JSngry Posted June 18 Report Share Posted June 18 Al Bell stands tall. Some date the true end of Memphis soul to the murder of Al Jackson. Either way Hi Records, Willie Mitchell. Southern Soul does indeed live, and yes, it is called Blues. Why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted June 18 Report Share Posted June 18 1 hour ago, John L said: What you write here is indeed broadly consistent with the story told in Bob Bowman's book... It's been a few decades since I read that book, but I came away from it with a vivid lasting impression that Bowman levied a pretty scathing indictment against Union Planters as being the real murderers of Stax. Bell's perspective about all that was certainly no surprise here. The depth of the CBS backstabbing was, I don't really remember all that, not to that extent. But the odious actions of Union Planters, that I remember. #winthropspoketruthtoal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John L Posted June 18 Report Share Posted June 18 2 hours ago, JSngry said: It's been a few decades since I read that book, but I came away from it with a vivid lasting impression that Bowman levied a pretty scathing indictment against Union Planters as being the real murderers of Stax. Bell's perspective about all that was certainly no surprise here. The depth of the CBS backstabbing was, I don't really remember all that, not to that extent. But the odious actions of Union Planters, that I remember. #winthropspoketruthtoal Yes, I recall that Bob Bowman shares both views - that Stax was never the same (i.e. the equal) of what it was in the 60s but that CBS and Union Planters played a major role in bringing it down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 No, it was "never the same". How could it be? Why should it be? It remained Black, and it remained profitable. Al Bell wanted to grow that. Good for him. I read Barry Gordy's autobiography, and he always paid White guys to run Accounting and some other key administrative positions, not because they were "better" at it, but because he knew that if he paid then enough that they would be loyal and run the necessary interference when the racist business bullshit would happen, and of course it happened. Al Bell was every bit as ambitious as Barry Gordy, but I don't know if he hired the right people to run interference for him. If he didn't, then that's his bad. Otherwise, Al Bell stands tall. And Barry Gordy hired Al Bell to handle the sale of Motown to MCA. Tell me that's not a vote of vindication that Al Bell understood all too well all the games that were going to be played... The only "mistake" here is that there wasn't more like it. On the record, that is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 5 hours ago, John L said: Yes, I recall that Bob Bowman shares both views - that Stax was never the same (i.e. the equal) of what it was in the 60s but that CBS and Union Planters played a major role in bringing it down. And remember, the only reason they had anything to kill was because Al Bell brought them back to life after Atlantic killed them the first time. Al Bell stands tall. And Jim Stewart is there besides him. Not a mistake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulpope Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 10 hours ago, John L said: Yes, I recall that Bob Bowman shares both views - that Stax was never the same (i.e. the equal) of what it was in the 60s but that CBS and Union Planters played a major role in bringing it down. That may be true (or not), but it were the artistic decisions made internally which had impact on the product/brand Stax .... world class song writer duo David Porter/Isaac Hayes more or less "retired" and concentrated on solo careers (btw quite telling that the much better singer aka David Porter had much less success economically) .... top song writer (Barbara Mason soon was thankful @ Buddah Records) and excellent singer Bettye Crutcher was not supported .... top in-house producers started getting rare f.i it was Wardell Quezergue @ Malaco Studio who got the actual vibes by recording Jean Knight "Mr. Big Stuff" .... ask (me) for more .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulpope Posted June 20 Report Share Posted June 20 https://www.soulcountry.net/post/the-gospel-of-stax Another diversification of Stax in the early 70's aka The Gospel Truth label .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted June 20 Report Share Posted June 20 More Gospel is usually a good thing!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted Friday at 02:31 AM Report Share Posted Friday at 02:31 AM On 6/18/2024 at 2:13 AM, soulpope said: Thnx for your thoughts ... Stax - as described in detail by Rob Bowman in his book - started as a small Southern Soul label and both the expansion (artistically and economically) and the myriad of "hits" in the 60`s - based on superb songwriting - simply happened .... while the Memphis productions were textbook raw Southern Soul, the early diversification with Don Davis stepping in was a first change in direction .... at the end of the the decade a more pro-active search - you could say enforcement of - for top selling records started and the story how songwriter Isaac Hayes ended as singer (aka "try and error") is quite telling ..... the industry changed, innocence was lost and and money (greed) increasingly beacame the name of the game .... Stax subsequently concentrated on a handful of top performers and other acts started flying under the radar marketingwise .... so no disrespect to the productions/efforts in the 70`s, but if listening to the "Complete Stax (Volt) Singles" compilation in chronological order gives an audiblle documentation of the changes .... You quote of "Johnnie Taylor arguably became the blueprint for the further development of Southern Soul" made me think, but obviously there is no definition of "Southern Soul" and to me a genre of "Soul/Blues Crossover" would more apply .... The collapse of Stax happened before the heydays of Disco, so we will never know how the company if still active would have mastered this challenge .... Nevertheless the "Stax Story" is one of a kind and the heritage remains treasurous .... The impression I have is that following the Atlantic debacle, the company tried to expand too fast, instead of gradually building itself up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted Friday at 03:10 AM Report Share Posted Friday at 03:10 AM But they were making money (more than ever, perhaps) and kept having hits. Al Bell built it back bigger than it was before. Watch WATTSTAX. Leveraged capital is hardcore American Capitalism 101. So is calling in all the chips when you want to pull the rug out from under somebody you want to get out of the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulpope Posted Friday at 05:19 AM Report Share Posted Friday at 05:19 AM 2 hours ago, Brad said: The impression I have is that following the Atlantic debacle, the company tried to expand too fast, instead of gradually building itself up. A valid point .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulpope Posted Friday at 08:18 AM Report Share Posted Friday at 08:18 AM https://bittersoutherner.com/how-stax-records-set-an-example-for-america The tale of two "Stax (hi)stories" .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulpope Posted Sunday at 10:38 AM Report Share Posted Sunday at 10:38 AM https://staxrecords.com/songwriter/we-three-bettye-crutcher-raymond-jackson-homer-banks/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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