Obscure or Underrated Bassists

[Stevie Mclean]

3 hours ago, Chuck Nessa said:

A couple of images from an Andrew Hill event at the University of Chicago circa 1968 - taken by Terry Martin.

Wilbur Ware, Thurman Barker and Roscoe Mitchell.

Whaaaaat that's awesome!

4 hours ago, sgcim said:

I don't know if he would like being known for what I was talking about in my post. That's why I didn't mention his name.

 

Out of the options to:

1. Mention his name and his playing but ignore his vices.

2. Mention his name, his playing and his vices.

3. Omit his name but mention his playing and his vices.

You definitely chose the strangest one!

[Gheorghe]

I like Wilbur Ware as a group player, but on one 5 CD set of Clifford Jordan Strata East recordings (which I actually bought for the "Rhythm X" which was one of my favourite in my early youth, I had it on cassette then), well the Wilbur Ware solo CD on it, that´s a bit too much for me. And I think in 1968 Wilbur Ware was already towards the end of his career. 

My favourite underrated bass players when I had discovered bop (AFTER "free" I must admit), was Tommy Potter and Curley Russell. They the unsung heros of all those murder sessions with up tempo stuff, when there still was no amps and pickups for the bass fiddle. 
And it´s interesting that they could also play solo very well, only there was no space for much solo then. But Potter could play wonderful bass solos, and Russell the same, both were very very good bassists. 

In my youth there was a great bass player around, who played with Joe Henderson. His name was Ratso Harris I think, a helluva player. 

[soulpope]

19 minutes ago, Gheorghe said:

In my youth there was a great bass player around, who played with Joe Henderson. His name was Ratso Harris I think, a helluva player. 

Kenny Werner Trio "Herbie Nichols" (Sunnyside) 1989 .... good call on Ratzo Harris ....

[Stevie Mclean]

46 minutes ago, Gheorghe said:

My favourite underrated bass players when I had discovered bop (AFTER "free" I must admit), was Tommy Potter and Curley Russell. They the unsung heros of all those murder sessions with up tempo stuff, when there still was no amps and pickups for the bass fiddle. 
And it´s interesting that they could also play solo very well, only there was no space for much solo then. But Potter could play wonderful bass solos, and Russell the same, both were very very good bassists. 

I've recently been uncovering the wonders of Tommy Potter by way of Jimmy Forrest and Willis Jackson. Who would have thought, the backbone of bop is also one helluva soul jazz player!

Fresh Sounds has a CD of the Willis Jackson session with Tommy playing on 14 songs.

Edited May 6 by Stevie Mclean

[jazzbo]

Tommy was often called "Bird's favorite bassist."

 

[clifford_thornton]

On 5/5/2024 at 11:25 AM, JSngry said:

I'll nominate Wilbur Ware. Everybody knows the name, but how about the playing itself? Influence on today's players?

Massive influence on William Parker.

[soulpope]

Wilbur Ware influenced Charlie Haden (as already mentioned), Fred Hopkins and Malachi Favors to name a few ....

[JSngry]

But they're all dead now.

Except for William Parker. And he makes all the records.So, who else?

[soulpope]

Regarding japanese bass players I would liko to mention Hideaki Mochizuki .... can be heard inter alias on the excellent Takeo Moriyama Quartet "Green River" (Enja Records) from 1984 ....

[T.D.]

59 minutes ago, JSngry said:

But they're all dead now.

Except for William Parker. And he makes all the records. So, who else?

He sure makes a truckload of records (I am a fan, btw). It sometimes does seem like all of them. 😁

I imagine most of us have favorite local bassists who are "obscure" or not very well known nationally/internationally. For instance, I think Michael Bisio (Kingston NY, Hudson Valley area) is very good. Even though he's made or appeared on many recordings, I doubt he's a "big name".

Joe Fonda (I think Hudson Valley area, but am not sure) also comes to mind, but I doubt he's "obscure" due to his work with Braxton among other things.

14 hours ago, Gheorghe said:

I like Wilbur Ware as a group player, but on one 5 CD set of Clifford Jordan Strata East recordings (which I actually bought for the "Rhythm X" which was one of my favourite in my early youth, I had it on cassette then), well the Wilbur Ware solo CD on it, that´s a bit too much for me. And I think in 1968 Wilbur Ware was already towards the end of his career. 

...

I was also underwhelmed by that one Ware CD, although I like every other recording of his that I've heard.

[clifford_thornton]

I like that Ware "Frontier" record. The solo playing sounds a lot like WP.

Bisio is fantastic and yes, not exactly a household name outside of the New York and PNW areas (he lived in Seattle for many years). Fonda was based in Connecticut for quite some time, though I'm not sure where he lives these days. Beautiful player.

Ken Filiano is another one who I would like to see more verbiage about. Tremendous.

I have that Everything is Everything record; it's quite good, though I don't recall being able to pull Carbone's name out of a hat on it. Teruo Nakamura, Lanny Fields, and Reggie Workman are also on the album.

The related Hino LP by Group Everything Everything Everything has Nakamura, Fields, and Holland (no Carbone or Workman).

[soulpope]

Today's mention goes to Greg Maker, whose work on Sam Rivers "Crystals" (Impulse) and three Billy Harper albums (Denon) is astonishing ....

[soulpope]

A "underrated" vote for Wayne Dockery ....

[soulpope]

Today's "underrated" nomination a tribute to Harrison Bankhead ....

[soulpope]

Believe also Charnett Moffett - who left us too early - should be mentioned as "underrated" .... a superb bass player whose recorded legacy doesn't feature any "milestone platters" unfortunately ....

[Gheorghe]

Now a bassist who was very much in action in the late 70´s here in Viena: His name is Bert Thompson and he was great. He played with Fritz Pauer, with Art Farmer, and with virtually all US stars who visited Viena. 
I have heard that he originally was a US Soldier based in Germany and later moved to Olanda, where he also took a non musical job as translator or something like that. 

Another great, Austrian bassist from the time of my youth was J.A. Rettenbacher, who even had played with Monk in Berlin. I think he lived in Germany and came back to Viena in the early 80s, but beside a short lived project that was named "So Near So Far" (like a tune from a Miles album) there was not much happening anymore. He was a regular at "Jazz-Spelunke", a joint in Viena where you met musicians, and could perform, but only until 10:00 pm since it was a house were other people lived in. 
Another regular was his little brother Harry Rettenbacher, also a great bass player sometimes, but a tragedy since he had had a bad accident, lived in poverty and didn´t even have a bass anymore. He would come to my house I mean I took him to my house so he could play on my bass fiddle and to talk and drink. But he was too uneven or unrelieable for substantial gigs so eventually I lost contact. I only remember in his last years he was a kinda "story teller" in the bars, cadging drinks from regulars......  . 

For german reading folks: His greeting for me was "Gerhard, host aan zwanz´ga ? (Gehard, hast Du 20 Schilling für mich) and I would give him 20 Shillings. 
But once I came in and before he would ask me I would say "Rettenbacher, host aan zwanzga für mi´? And belive it ore not, he GAVE me 20 schillings !!!!! 

[soulpope]

17 minutes ago, Gheorghe said:

"Gerhard, host aan zwanz´ga ? (Gehard, hast Du 20 Schilling für mich) and I would give him 20 Shillings. 

But once I came in and before he would ask me I would say "Rettenbacher, host aan zwanzga für mi´? And belive it ore not, he GAVE me 20 schillings !!!!! 

Sehr scheen 😂😂😂 ....

[JSngry]

Ernie Shepard

[Chuck Nessa]

52 minutes ago, JSngry said:

Ernie Shepard

YES!

 

[mhatta]

On 5/10/2024 at 3:28 PM, Gheorghe said:

Another great, Austrian bassist from the time of my youth was J.A. Rettenbacher, who even had played with Monk in Berlin. I think he lived in Germany and came back to Viena in the early 80s, but beside a short lived project that was named "So Near So Far" (like a tune from a Miles album) there was not much happening anymore. He was a regular at "Jazz-Spelunke", a joint in Viena where you met musicians, and could perform, but only until 10:00 pm since it was a house were other people lived in. 
Another regular was his little brother Harry Rettenbacher, also a great bass player sometimes, but a tragedy since he had had a bad accident, lived in poverty and didn´t even have a bass anymore. He would come to my house I mean I took him to my house so he could play on my bass fiddle and to talk and drink. But he was too uneven or unrelieable for substantial gigs so eventually I lost contact. I only remember in his last years he was a kinda "story teller" in the bars, cadging drinks from regulars......  .

One of my favorite piano trio records, Yancy Korossy's "Identification" (MPS) has "Hans" Rettenbacher on bass.  Is this J.A. or Harry or a complete stranger?

 

Aladar Pege might be well known in his native Hungary, but little known outside his country.  He possesses incredible technique.

 

[soulpope]

41 minutes ago, mhatta said:

One of my favorite piano trio records, Yancy Korossy's "Identification" (MPS) has "Hans" Rettenbacher on bass.  Is this J.A. or Harry or a complete stranger?

Aladar Pege might be well known in his native Hungary, but little known outside his country.  He possesses incredible technique.

Johann (aka Hans)- Anton Rettenbacher 😇😎 .... and agreement reg Aladar Pege .... 

[Niko]

"Hans" is J.A.

[Gheorghe]

On 5/11/2024 at 9:09 AM, mhatta said:

One of my favorite piano trio records, Yancy Korossy's "Identification" (MPS) has "Hans" Rettenbacher on bass.  Is this J.A. or Harry or a complete stranger?

 

Aladar Pege might be well known in his native Hungary, but little known outside his country.  He possesses incredible technique.

 

About the two Rettenbach brothers. Hans is the one who recorded much. He was the oldest of the three Rettenbachers (Hans born 1939, Irmela born 1945 and Harry born 1947) . I knew the whole family, the three kids and their mother. Irmela was a singer and had sung with the first edition of the Vienna Art Orchestra. Later she was serving drinks at "Uzzi´s Einhorn" , a place where there was not live music but a meeting point for musicians. Irmela was like a big sister for me. We were all close then.....

Aladár Pege: I heard him many times here in Viena. Well Viena and Budapesta anyway are something like twin cities, thinking about the Austro-Hungarian Empire, which is also my background. I mean I live in Viena and feel at home, and I can go to Budapesta and feel like home, it´s in ya blood. 
I remember Aladár Pege best for a gig with Sonny Stitt in 1980 at Porrhaus here in Viena. 

[optatio]

I remember Jack Gregg, he was often in Göttingen, Gunter Hampel's hometown. Here is a photo from the Göttingen venue 'Blue Note' in 1976 with Allan Praskin (fl) and Joe Pentzlin (p).

Jack Gregg recorded 9 albums with Gunter Hampel and 5 albums with Marion Brown - Marion was also often here in our town.

[soulpope]

20 minutes ago, optatio said:

I remember Jack Gregg, he was often in Göttingen, Gunter Hampel's hometown. Here is a photo from the Göttingen venue 'Blue Note' in 1976 with Allan Praskin (fl) and Joe Pentzlin (p).

Jack Gregg recorded 9 albums with Gunter Hampel and 5 albums with Marion Brown - Marion was also often here in our town.

Thnx for sharing 👌👍 ....