Helping Mosaic by Suggesting Artists and Sets, Part Deux

[medjuck]

3 hours ago, Teasing the Korean said:

I will attribute that up to poor marketing on Mosaic's part.  Obviously Numero, Light in the Attic, Real Gone Music, and a number of film score boutique labels (Intrada, La-La-Land, etc.) have made single-disc releases work.  

Bigger audience.  That's why it can sustain so many labels. 

[Joe]

2 hours ago, JSngry said:

Not sure if everybody got paid right the first time. Sloppy at best. 

But speaking of Gramavision... Anthony Davis and/or James Newton and/or Abdul Wadud.

Not on Mosaic though. They'd have no idea what to do with it. The music is too modern for them. Whoever they were, that was then 

But there's an amazing set to be done there by somebody with the appetite and the skills. That will not be today's Mosaic. 

Some day, somebody will do it, package the material, pimp the artists, and find the audience. We're here. 

I'm down with an Anthony Davis set.

Mosaic may or may not be the ones to do it, but the John Carter Gramavisions need to be returned to wide circulation.

[Teasing the Korean]

17 minutes ago, medjuck said:

Bigger audience. 

Shrinking, dying audience that their pricey box sets have done nothing to grow.

[JSngry]

Does some of that Numero stuff have a bigger audience than a Freddie Hubbard Mosaic?

I'd like to see the data on that to be sure one way or the other. 

[Ken Dryden]

11 hours ago, Teasing the Korean said:

Real Gone Music is a legit US label. As are all the others that I listed above.  None of them are grey market.

https://realgonemusic.com

Sorry, I had the label confused with one of those European labels that puts out PD box sets.

[Jim Duckworth]

The Andy Kirk box would have to be very selective as there is a very high percentage of forgettable vocals in that discography. 

The Frank Strozier set sounds like a Mosaic in waiting to me...

[HutchFan]

15 hours ago, JSngry said:

But speaking of Gramavision... Anthony Davis and/or James Newton and/or Abdul Wadud.

Yeah!!!  THAT.

There's lots of other great stuff on Gramavision too.  Oliver Lake.  Bob Moses.  (When Elephants Dream of Music is a stinkin' masterpiece.)  Billy Hart (especially Oshumare, another brilliant record).

Somebody needs to get on that.  To the best of my knowledge, ALL of those Gramavision albums are out-of-print.  I don't even know who owns them.

 

[ghost of miles]

Given that I believe Michael and Scott are both in their 70s now, I think it’s asking a lot for them to somehow reinvent the wheel that is Mosaic. And I have no inside knowledge, but I don’t sense that there’s anybody in line to take over once they retire. Maybe Zev Feldman or somebody else will make a bid for the label if it’s put up for sale. 

The Braxton set surely came about in part because of MC’s direct involvement in those records. I seem to recall hearing that it sold reasonably well, which doesn’t surprise me, given the international base of Braxton fans and the significance of what he did on Arista. No idea about the Threadgill set’s sales, but it obviously didn’t tank the label. From what I understand, though, one very poor-selling set *could* sink them. (Niche markets are a tricky business anyway, even in the best of economic circumstances.) That may account for playing it safe at this late date in the Mosaic story. 

Mosaic’s going to mark its 40th anniversary this year, correct? They’ve had an amazing run, and I hope they can keep going for a few more years. I’m the kind of customer/listener who buys the Threadgill and Braxton sets *and* the JATP, swing-era and Blue Note boxes (I know I’m far from alone in that regard on this board), and I’ll likely be in line for whatever’s next, whether it’s a Sonny Clark or an Anthony Davis collection. It’s amazing to contemplate the Mosaic discography and the wealth of jazz history that their sets represent, and that they’ve managed to stay afloat amid all of the changes in the music marketplace—the rise of streaming in particular. And as somebody noted earlier in this thread, they still put out the occasional jaw-dropper, like the Tristano private collection or the Savory box. Grateful for all of it, and to MC and Charlie Lourie and Scott for sustaining such a mission of love; they’ve accomplished much.
 

If the concept of physical-media anthologies survives, whether in the form of vinyl or CDs or some sort of virtual-reality hologrammy “Anthony Davis plays in your living room” form (I’m only half-kidding… the future’s getting weirder all the time and continues to arrive on schedule), then I imagine that we’ll see some of the suggestions in this thread eventually come to pass, albeit likely from a non-Mosaic source. If nothing else, the reissue industry always needs new past eras to mine. What about an M-Base or Medeski, Martin and Wood set? Probably not of interest to many here, but the 1980s and 90s have already become well-mined in popular culture (the ongoing 90s nostalgia/retro appeal among my younger 20something friends is intense) and the jazz from those decades is now as far back in the rearview mirror as Monk’s Blue Note sides were when Mosaic started. As Jsngry said, *somebody* will do the Anthony Davis set… and if it’s done well, it doesn’t really matter to me whether it comes from Mosaic or not. The sadly-departed Revenant did a fantastic job with their Ayler box (good Lord, did that come out nearly 20 years ago?) and the Tubby Hayes Fontana has been one of my favorites in recent years. 

 

8 minutes ago, HutchFan said:

Yeah!!!  THAT.

There's lots of other great stuff on Gramavision too.  Oliver Lake.  Bob Moses.  (When Elephants Dream of Music is a stinkin' masterpiece.)  Billy Hart (especially Oshumare, another brilliant record).

Somebody needs to get on that.  To the best of my knowledge, ALL of those Gramavision albums are out-of-print.  I don't even know who owns them.

 

Agreed! Also add my lament that James Carter’s Roots and Folklore cycle remains uncollected, per previous comments that also alluded to the inherent licensing difficulties that series presents.

Edited April 3, 2023 by ghost of miles

[Larry Kart]

13 hours ago, Teasing the Korean said:

Shrinking, dying audience that their pricey box sets have done nothing to grow.

But the TikiBar audience is growing! 

[Kevin Bresnahan]

I've always thought that Mosaic picked the wrong label for their Sonny Stitt box. Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of great tunes on that Roost box but there are also some clunkers. Plus, I've never actually gone searching for those old Roost records. They should have done Stitt's Muse records. On the whole, I think Stitt hits a lot more highs than lows throughout his Muse records and I pull those Muse CDs off the shelf way more often than the Mosaic Roost set. I actually don't even remember the last time I listened to it.

[sidewinder]

1 hour ago, ghost of miles said:

Given that I believe Michael and Scott are both in their 70s now, I think it’s asking a lot for them to somehow reinvent the wheel that is Mosaic. And I have no inside knowledge, but I don’t sense that there’s anybody in line to take over once they retire. Maybe Zev Feldman or somebody else will make a bid for the label if it’s put up for sale. 

The Braxton set surely came about in part because of MC’s direct involvement in those records. I seem to recall hearing that it sold reasonably well, which doesn’t surprise me, given the international base of Braxton fans and the significance of what he did on Arista. No idea about the Threadgill set’s sales, but it obviously didn’t tank the label. From what I understand, though, one very poor-selling set *could* sink them. (Niche markets are a tricky business anyway, even in the best of economic circumstances.) That may account for playing it safe at this late date in the Mosaic story. 

Mosaic’s going to mark its 40th anniversary this year, correct? They’ve had an amazing run, and I hope they can keep going for a few more years. I’m the kind of customer/listener who buys the Threadgill and Braxton sets *and* the JATP, swing-era and Blue Note boxes (I know I’m far from alone in that regard on this board), and I’ll likely be in line for whatever’s next, whether it’s a Sonny Clark or an Anthony Davis collection. It’s amazing to contemplate the Mosaic discography and the wealth of jazz history that their sets represent, and that they’ve managed to stay afloat amid all of the changes in the music marketplace—the rise of streaming in particular. And as somebody noted earlier in this thread, they still put out the occasional jaw-dropper, like the Tristano private collection or the Savory box. Grateful for all of it, and to MC and Charlie Lourie and Scott for sustaining such a mission of love; they’ve accomplished much.
 

If the concept of physical-media anthologies survives, whether in the form of vinyl or CDs or some sort of virtual-reality hologrammy “Anthony Davis plays in your living room” form (I’m only half-kidding… the future’s getting weirder all the time and continues to arrive on schedule), then I imagine that we’ll see some of the suggestions in this thread eventually come to pass, albeit likely from a non-Mosaic source. If nothing else, the reissue industry always needs new past eras to mine. What about an M-Base or Medeski, Martin and Wood set? Probably not of interest to many here, but the 1980s and 90s have already become well-mined in popular culture (the ongoing 90s nostalgia/retro appeal among my younger 20something friends is intense) and the jazz from those decades is now as far back in the rearview mirror as Monk’s Blue Note sides were when Mosaic started. As Jsngry said, *somebody* will do the Anthony Davis set… and if it’s done well, it doesn’t really matter to me whether it comes from Mosaic or not. The sadly-departed Revenant did a fantastic job with their Ayler box (good Lord, did that come out nearly 20 years ago?) and the Tubby Hayes Fontana has been one of my favorites in recent years. 

 

Agreed! Also add my lament that James Carter’s Roots and Folklore cycle remains uncollected, per previous comments that also alluded to the inherent licensing difficulties that series presents.

Well said !

[danasgoodstuff]

Mosaic's greatest contributions to me were the Tina Brooks and Herbie Nichols which brought attention to long neglected artists.  Along those lines, I'd love to see/hear a Frank Strozier set.

Edited April 3, 2023 by danasgoodstuff

[jazzbo]

I actually think two of the star items in the Mosaic catalog are the complete Commodore recordings in three sets, and the Benedetti Parker set. These in complete form are wonderful, important collections.

[T.D.]

2 hours ago, jazzbo said:

I actually think two of the star items in the Mosaic catalog are the complete Commodore recordings in three sets, and the Benedetti Parker set. These in complete form are wonderful, important collections.

Agreed on Benedetti / Parker, but isn't that one of the sets that took the longest to sell out?

Admission: I don't own it. Seriously considered purchase for years and years, but held off because I figured the sound quality would deter me from listening very often.

[sidewinder]

14 minutes ago, T.D. said:

Agreed on Benedetti / Parker, but isn't that one of the sets that took the longest to sell out?

Admission: I don't own it. Seriously considered purchase for years and years, but held off because I figured the sound quality would deter me from listening very often.

Yeah, it took forever to sell out in the CD version, although the LP sets cleared much quicker (I guess they were quite few).

This is one set that I definitely need to dig out again.

[Rooster_Ties]

Benedetti / Parker wasn’t a limited edition. Mosaic owned that music, far as I’m recalling, and weren’t contractually l limited in the number of sets they could sell — iirc.

[mjzee]

1 minute ago, Rooster_Ties said:

Benedetti / Parker wasn’t a limited edition. Mosaic owned that music, far as I’m recalling, and weren’t contractually l limited in the number of sets they could sell — iirc.

You are correct.  I think many assumed they would sell it forever, until they changed their business model.

[Larry Kart]

Given TTK's frequent claims that Mosaic is stuck in the mud , has failed to innovate/ grow its audience, and is on its way to doom, what I wonder is his version of how Mosaic should grow and save itself? He'a a smart guy; let's have it. 

[Teasing the Korean]

11 hours ago, Ken Dryden said:

Sorry, I had the label confused with one of those European labels that puts out PD box sets.

I think there is a grey market label called Real Gone, as opposed to Real Gone Music, so it was an easy mistake to make.

7 hours ago, Larry Kart said:

But the TikiBar audience is growing! 

No, it's the latest target in the cultural appropriation discussion.  

[JSngry]

I wish they had a counterweight for Scott. He does what he does really well, but he's not as "modern" in taste as Michael, and Michael seems to have not a lot of appetite for too much past what he did thru the later 70s, all of which is good/great, but...                                                               

They all seem to be super-nice and ultra-competent (or more!) guys and I love them (and Charlie Lourie RIP) until my last days, but this is not about that.

That Fred guy seems pretty cool, but is he in the decision-making loop?

The power of 3 is absent here, and it's really starting to show.

Triangulate!!!!

[Kevin Bresnahan]

I don’t think Scott is 70. In fact, I’m wondering if he’s even 60. He doesn’t look that old in his Facebook pictures.

[AllenLowe]

On 3/31/2023 at 10:56 AM, Mark Stryker said:

Off the top:

1. Frankie Newton across a zillion labels and his whole career as a leader and sideman -- anything where he has solo space or makes a significant ensemble contribution. There's a 3 CD set on Acrobat that kinda does this but it's by no means complete and there are no notes/context etc. on a remarkably individual music and life. 

2. Complete George Adams-Don Pullen Quartet Studio and Live Sessions.  This would at least include everything on Soul Note, Timeless, and Blue Note -- that's 10 LPs if you include the Timeless record from Montmartre with Scofield as a gues. (There are also 11 unissued tracks from this performance recorded the day before.) You would also have to think about whether to include the (presumably) bootleg live stuff that's some out on Palcosenico (two LPs), Flock (three tracks), and Repertoire (three tracks with Lewis Nash in for the Richmond). 

3. Complete Frank Strozier as a leader on Mercury, Vee Jay, Jazzland, SteepleChase, and Trident -- there are seven LPs that got released, but what would have been his debut on Mercury date (c. 1958) remains unissued, so eight LPs total worth of material, plus alternates.  

4. I haven't thought through the concept and organization yet, but I would LOVE to see a set devoted to Budd Johnson.

 

George Adams' playing drives me up a wall; always goes into that patented yodel of his; an entire Mosaic of him would definitely send me to the loony bin (which might make my wife happy).

I will tell you a great Mosaic - and one that I actually believe would do well - Dave Schildkraut; I've got everything, even one with a solo from circa 1954 that sounds pre-Coltrane (and Trane admired him, voted for him once as best alto, and dedicated a song to him at his Jazz Gallery gig). There's plenty, a lot of amazing side man work, and I think I have everything (including a mint reissue LP pressing of Like Cool with Eddie Bert and Hank Jones). And I recorded him in 1978 and there is some amazing stuff that he did.

That settles it; I guess the consensus is for Schildkraut.

[JSngry]

After Bill Barron. 

[ghost of miles]

11 hours ago, bresna said:

I don’t think Scott is 70. In fact, I’m wondering if he’s even 60. He doesn’t look that old in his Facebook pictures.

You’re correct, and my earlier post was mistaken—he’s 63. Michael is 74.

Edited April 4, 2023 by ghost of miles

[Jim Duckworth]

11 hours ago, AllenLowe said:

George Adams' playing drives me up a wall; always goes into that patented yodel of his; an entire Mosaic of him would definitely send me to the loony bin (which might make my wife happy).

I will tell you a great Mosaic - and one that I actually believe would do well - Dave Schildkraut; I've got everything, even one with a solo from circa 1954 that sounds pre-Coltrane (and Trane admired him, voted for him once as best alto, and dedicated a song to him at his Jazz Gallery gig). There's plenty, a lot of amazing side man work, and I think I have everything (including a mint reissue LP pressing of Like Cool with Eddie Bert and Hank Jones). And I recorded him in 1978 and there is some amazing stuff that he did.

That settles it; I guess the consensus is for Schildkraut.

A Dave Schildkraut collection would be exceptional:  the sideman work alone encompasses George Handy, Tito Puente, Tony Bennett, Pete Rugulo, Johnny Richards, Oscar Pettiford, Chuck Wayne, John Graas, Miles Davis, and Stan Kenton. Of course there's the licensing dilemma...