EKE BBB Posted March 29, 2004 Report Share Posted March 29, 2004 Fascinating thread! I never learned music or how to play an instrument... but for some recorder at a very early age. I still regret it. I´m afraid I won´t have time to start: my everyday life hasn´t got nothing to do with music, so I´ll be a listener and a collector for the rest of my life (and I´m sure I´m losing something) But I won´t let this happen to my children, for sure. So I´d like to ask, which is the ideal age to start into music? (my elder child is two years old) Thanks in advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted March 29, 2004 Report Share Posted March 29, 2004 ...which is the ideal age to start into music? (my elder child is two years old) Well, as I see it, singing and dancing are "natural" in one form or another almost from birth, and beating in rhythm on something in rhythm ain't too far behind, so as far as developing a child's fundamental, innate, musical instinct, "now's the time", as a wise man from long ago once put it. It saddens be when I see/hear really young kids jumping around in an embryonic attempt at dance, or howling/moaning/whatever in a similar attempt at song and the parents get all wigged out and go out of their way to stifle that. Now, if it's in a restaurant or in church or someplace, sure. But otherwise, let the babies get their groove on - they're probably "closer" to a lot of intrinsic feelings at that stage of their life than they ever will be again, so the object should be to nurture/refine that, not stifle/destroy it. From the ages 2-7, my son used to break out into a no-holds-barred shimmy whenever I'd play Louis Jordan or Big Joe Turner. As he got older, he got more self-conscious about that stuff, but he developed into a pretty decent teenage trumpet player who can tell bogus from real several miles away. So the earlier the better, I say. There's a level of musicality that exists in most all of us that has nothing to do with learning an instrument (or "learning" period!), and that needs to be encouraged a lot more than it usually is. I could be wrong, but I don't think so! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AfricaBrass Posted March 29, 2004 Report Share Posted March 29, 2004 I agree about not limiting the child's natural desire to groove. I encourage it with my 2 1/2 year old. He loves to dance and sing. I think it's great. He's too young to really play any instrument, but I like to tap in time with music with him. He does pretty good with that. The key for me is just making it fun and I really encourage him when he does something cool. He loves to strum my guitar. I'll hold the chords for him and he'll strum. I think the key is to just help them to love music and make it something that isn't so mysterious. My son and I look through musical instrument catalogs together and he's always pointing at the "crazy" guitars. I went and bought one of the crazy guitars he loved (it was really cheap) and we sit around and play that thing together. My wife gets really frustrated at all the noise we make banging away, but we have fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack Posted March 30, 2004 Report Share Posted March 30, 2004 I would suggest the piano. I started with lessons at about eleven years of age. My brothers all started with different instruments and 3 of them have taken piano lessons at one time or another. They say that if they could do it over they would take some piano and then go for the other instruments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardbopjazz Posted March 31, 2004 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2004 Does it matter if my daughter starts on one of those electric keyboards or should I wait to start her until my piano gets tuned? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Burke Posted March 31, 2004 Report Share Posted March 31, 2004 Does it matter if my daughter starts on one of those electric keyboards or should I wait to start her until my piano gets tuned? There's a pretty significant difference between playing a piano and a keyboard; namely the fact that a piano has "weighted" keys. My group is preparing to play shows around Austin soon and I'm having to get used to a keyboard because none of the venues we plan on playing have a piano. So I'm basically learning my parts all over again. I should also mention that many modern keybaords, like the one I'm using, are touch sensitive. I get the impression that there are between 4 and 5 levels of volume that you can achieve, in accordance with how hard you hit the keys themselves. This makes feel more more like a real piano, in that respect, but it doesn't change the fact that the keys feel light as a feather without weights. And I'm finding it very difficult to play with the same 'touch' as before. Espscially on the quiet numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Fitzgerald Posted March 31, 2004 Report Share Posted March 31, 2004 There are keyboards ("digital pianos") out there that have a better touch and are better in tune than a lot of bad acoustic pianos. Have a look at some of the roundups/buyer's guides that Keyboard magazine periodically does. I have one here from September 2000 that covers 5 "affordable" ones (Generalmusic Pro1; Korg SP-100; Kurzweil SP88/X; Roland RD-100; Yamaha P-80 - all between $1000 and $1500) in detail and then has a page of additional information on other brands and models. Ideally, a good acoustic is the way to go, but I completely understand that there are issues (financial, space, sound) that can interfere. It is absolutely vital that the instrument be in tune, however, which is one area where the electronic wins out. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted March 31, 2004 Report Share Posted March 31, 2004 I just bought a Yamah P120S digital piano that plays very convincingly like the real thing, even has adjustable weighted keys, and even has a quite realistic sustain feature ---sounds very much like a real piano (as well as a real electric piano or two, Hammond organ, etc.) QUITE a nice product, and I'm picky about keyboards; they have to play like a piano with wieghted keys, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardbopjazz Posted March 31, 2004 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2004 I plan on using the electric piano till I get it to my house and then tuned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Alfredson Posted April 1, 2004 Report Share Posted April 1, 2004 I love old pianos. My father restores pianos and specializes in the old uprights. We've had some uprights over the years that will give 9 foot grands a run for their money. But they have to be OLD! Like, 1910, 1920s. They made PIANOS back then. Piano is a great first instrument, but I plan on getting my child started young on the Hammond! He/she will be kickin' bass lines in no time! Child: Daddy, I hungy. Me: Have you learned Jimmy's solo from "Back At The Chicken Shack" yet? Child: No, I hungy. Me: Then hop to it, youngin'!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardbopjazz Posted April 5, 2004 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2004 b3-er, how much harder is it to learn the organ over the piano? I know there are all those pedals on the organ which adds to the equation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted April 5, 2004 Report Share Posted April 5, 2004 I love old pianos too. Though at the moment they are sort of a sore spot. I've enjoyed old pianos in the church my father "pastored" in Burton Ohio for thirty years. And I've always wanted one of my own. My wife's aunt died recently; Helen's aunt had inherited her own uncle's Steinway grand "reproducing" piano, built in the twenties, and that is one FINE instrument! Helen was offered the piano. . . I was not sleeping well at nights trying to negotiate getting that piano to our home. First I convinced my wife by actually rearranging the living room and putting up boxes in the appropriate area that we COULD fit the piano into our living room and still "live." Ultimately I lost out, because my father-in-law refused to ship it to us unless we ALSO took a nineteenth century dining room set and a lot of other furniture from this huge Chicago house her aunt had lived in most of her life, and we would have to get a larger house, and we simply COULDN'T afford that even if we WANTED to move somewhere else, which we really and truly DON'T want to do. So we passed on the Steinway. . .and I had a hard time sleeping again. . . til my wife announced we could buy a digital piano and we shopped around and settled on my new P120S. It's no Stienway, but it amazed me how good it sounds, it does play convincingly like a real hammer and strings and big harp piano and can also do so many things. . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son-of-a-Weizen Posted April 5, 2004 Report Share Posted April 5, 2004 I agree that piano is an excellent place to start. In fact, I just started my two (6 & 8) w/lessons 3 weeks ago on my Mom's well used 1930's Brewster baby grand that I just had shipped out from San Diego, where it was disassembled and gathering dust in a spare room with a feline monster or two. A few minor repairs, some elbow grease to the finish..and it sounds marvelous. The best thing that parents can do (imo) is not jump the gun and start in a w/lessons to early. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soulstation1 Posted April 5, 2004 Report Share Posted April 5, 2004 the braithaphone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted April 5, 2004 Report Share Posted April 5, 2004 Laughing my ass off just thinking of one of my nephews playing the braithaphone in his house. . . ! That would be chickens coming home to roost for my LOUD-when-a-kid brother! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertrand Posted April 6, 2004 Report Share Posted April 6, 2004 (edited) I had enquired at a Bethesda, MD music studio about joint guitar lessons for my 4-year old and me - I didn't think he'd learn much at that early age, but he might get a kick out of watching daddy re-learn how to play, and it would foster his (ever-increasing) interest in music. The place wasn't too keen on the idea, but they gave me the name of one of the two owners who they said liked kids and would probably be my best shot - we could try a trial lesson and see. Well, I put off scheduling the lesson because I thought a private teacher might be more willing to experiment (haven't made the call yet). Well, it turns out 'liking kids' was an understatement - the guy in question was arrested last week for fondling and taking nude photos of a 13-year old girl, and photos of dozens of other girls (headless photos) were found in his house. Holy crap - this really sent chills down my spine. We almost took lessons with a major pedophile. Bertrand. Edited April 6, 2004 by bertrand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardbopjazz Posted April 6, 2004 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2004 That’s scary shit! The person I found to teach piano to my daughter allows the parent to sit in the next room where he/she can watch what going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Fitzgerald Posted April 6, 2004 Report Share Posted April 6, 2004 Particularly at the beginning, it is very beneficial to have the parent attend the lessons. Even parents who have never played the piano can learn side by side - I mean, really, if your little kid can do it, you can too! Then you'll have a duet partner as well as someone who can point out the wrong notes. Studies have shown that it is the student's *perception* of parental valuing/approval of activities that makes the difference. Not whether you value or approve of whatever. (So, actually, you don't really have to love music, you just have to make your kid *believe* that you love music.) It's not just telling them it's important, you need to show it - making it a priority in your schedule, showing an interest, being supportive - even if it's just sitting there while they practice. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Burke Posted April 7, 2004 Report Share Posted April 7, 2004 I should add that just tonight I had to start relearning all of my (piano) parts on a MIDI keyboard so we can play out. It sucks, man. I hate it. Drasticaly changes my available dynamics. This keyboard does not have weighted keys and the supposed 'volume action' doesn't really cut the mustard. It's especially problematic on the quiet numbers because I don't have any "touch" anymore. Plus, since the keys aren't weighted, if I accidently hit a neighboring key it sounds because there's no resistance. Uugh.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted April 7, 2004 Report Share Posted April 7, 2004 Get rid of that turkey and get a better model! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrome Posted April 7, 2004 Report Share Posted April 7, 2004 I can recommend Kindermusik for kids, especially younger ones. I started my daughter at a local Kindermusik when she was 18 months old and the results have been great. She's now 11 and quite accomplished on the piano, having played a marvelous rendition of "Moondance" at a recent recital. She can also bring home instruments from her regular school's music class and quite quickly learn to pick out tunes on those as well (violin, recorder, now trombone). The Kindermusik stuff incorporates a lot of basic music theory into play time, and the parents attend classes with the kids until the kids are about 4. My younger girls are attending Kindermusik classes now. We look at it as musically enhanced nursery school. Plus, I think it helps them naturally develop a desire to learn and play an instrument. Also, after Kindermusik, my eldest daughter started private lessons with just a keyboard (for both space and $$ reasons). When it came time for her to advance beyond this, we talked to her teacher to get advice on what to do next, given our constraints. Ended up with a nice electric piano that seems to be doing the job so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Burke Posted April 12, 2004 Report Share Posted April 12, 2004 Get rid of that turkey and get a better model! In a different world, I'd be able to do that. But, as it stands now, I'm a poor grad student with a broken driver's side window that I can't afford to fix, rent payments at two different places when I do my internship at Library of Congress over the summer, and....well, lot's of other stuff that $1,200 a month doesn't cover. So a good keyboard is way down there on the priority list. Someday..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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