Kenny G Explains Why He Did a Documentary About How Much People Hate Him

[Dan Gould]

If you care about the label (and I do, for it will always for me signify the music I care most about, from swing to hard bop to the modern mainstream of artists plying their trade in those sub-styles) there is nothing worse than encountering someone who says they are also a "jazz fan" and the first artist mentioned is G.

[Rooster_Ties]

30 minutes ago, Dan Gould said:

…there is nothing worse than encountering someone who says they are also a "jazz fan" and the first artist mentioned is G.

Except maybe if someone says they hate jazz — and then the first artist they mention is Kenny G (and they think you like Kenny G, because you said you like “jazz” — because that’s what jazz sounds like, far as they know).

I’ve had both happen — though admittedly a good 20 years ago, give or take.

[Teasing the Korean]

35 minutes ago, Dan Gould said:

If you care about the label (and I do, for it will always for me signify the music I care most about, from swing to hard bop to the modern mainstream of artists plying their trade in those sub-styles) there is nothing worse than encountering someone who says they are also a "jazz fan" and the first artist mentioned is G.

We can't control how people use language.  Words evolve, labels evolve.  Neighborhoods in cities will shift a few blocks this way or that way depending on property use and values.   I don't have time to worry about what other people consider jazz.  If someone wants to call Kenny G "jazz," that is fine.  It is just a label, after all.  Calling Kenny G jazz doesn't make his music any better or worse than it is.  

Edited December 10, 2021 by Teasing the Korean

[Daniel A]

37 minutes ago, Teasing the Korean said:

We can't control how people use language.  Words evolve, labels evolve.  Neighborhoods in cities will shift a few blocks this way or that way depending on property use and values.   I don't have time to worry about what other people consider jazz.  If someone wants to call Kenny G "jazz," that is fine.  It is just a label, after all.  Calling Kenny G jazz doesn't make his music any better or worse than it is.  

+1

[Rabshakeh]

All of this seems to be litigating something long past. I remember Kenny G = Jazz jibes from when I was a schoolboy, but I have barely even heard Kenny G's name mentioned in years. He was a popular commercial artist 30 years ago and his music has not stood the test of time. From a cultural perspective he now barely exists.

At most, he's a punchline about awful 1990s music.

[Dan Gould]

1 hour ago, Rabshakeh said:

All of this seems to be litigating something long past. I remember Kenny G = Jazz jibes from when I was a schoolboy, but I have barely even heard Kenny G's name mentioned in years. He was a popular commercial artist 30 years ago and his music has not stood the test of time. From a cultural perspective he now barely exists.

At most, he's a punchline about awful 1990s music.

His records as a leader start in 1982 and up until 2010 were out at a very regular clip (now its about 4-5 years in between shitting out a new one). Given the fact of this documentary being produced and aired now, and that a major part of it is a change in critical approval, I would hardly say that he "barely exists" culturally.

And OMG, check out the AllMusic review of his latest

With 2021's elegant New Standards, saxophonist Kenny G wryly inserts himself into the pantheon of American Popular Songbook composers performing and writing songs that feel as if they were written during the heyday of traditional pop in the '50s and '60s. The album is G's first studio production since 2015's Brazilian Nights and while it certainly hews to his distinctive crossover style it's steeped in a lush orchestral atmosphere that evokes the classic traditional pop of artists like Frank Sinatra, Johnny Mathis, and Ella Fitzgerald. Of course, these aren't swinging big-band numbers, but hushed and intimate ballads with just enough R&B keyboard, bass, and guitar textures to keep things contemporary. What's particularly notable about New Standards is just how effectively G has managed to capture the sound of traditional pop. While solely instrumentals, tracks like "Emeline," "Blue Skies," and "Paris by Night" are nonetheless harmonically sophisticated songs that have the cozy, martini-soaked vibe of Tin Pan Alley and Brill Building standards. One could easily imagine a companion album with lyrics and guest vocalists added to the mix. That they are all G's own newly penned original compositions makes them all the more impressive. Even the one guest appearance here, a somewhat dubious, digitally crafted duet between G and his late idol, saxophonist Stan Getz (or more specifically "the sound" of Stan Getz), does little to distract from the overriding aura of relaxed, old-school romanticism.

[Rabshakeh]

10 minutes ago, Dan Gould said:

His records as a leader start in 1982 and up until 2010 were out at a very regular clip (now its about 4-5 years in between shitting out a new one). Given the fact of this documentary being produced and aired now, and that a major part of it is a change in critical approval, I would hardly say that he "barely exists" culturally.

And OMG, check out the AllMusic review of his latest

With 2021's elegant New Standards, saxophonist Kenny G wryly inserts himself into the pantheon of American Popular Songbook composers performing and writing songs that feel as if they were written during the heyday of traditional pop in the '50s and '60s. The album is G's first studio production since 2015's Brazilian Nights and while it certainly hews to his distinctive crossover style it's steeped in a lush orchestral atmosphere that evokes the classic traditional pop of artists like Frank Sinatra, Johnny Mathis, and Ella Fitzgerald. Of course, these aren't swinging big-band numbers, but hushed and intimate ballads with just enough R&B keyboard, bass, and guitar textures to keep things contemporary. What's particularly notable about New Standards is just how effectively G has managed to capture the sound of traditional pop. While solely instrumentals, tracks like "Emeline," "Blue Skies," and "Paris by Night" are nonetheless harmonically sophisticated songs that have the cozy, martini-soaked vibe of Tin Pan Alley and Brill Building standards. One could easily imagine a companion album with lyrics and guest vocalists added to the mix. That they are all G's own newly penned original compositions makes them all the more impressive. Even the one guest appearance here, a somewhat dubious, digitally crafted duet between G and his late idol, saxophonist Stan Getz (or more specifically "the sound" of Stan Getz), does little to distract from the overriding aura of relaxed, old-school romanticism.

He's a punchline, that's all. Like Rick Astley or Richard Gere.

[Dan Gould]

1 minute ago, Rabshakeh said:

He's a punchline, that's all. Like Rick Astley or Richard Gere.

Why is Richard Gere a punchline?

[Dub Modal]

1 hour ago, Rabshakeh said:

From a cultural perspective he now barely exists.

FWIW, he's all over Apple Music's jazz channel, like top-billing profile for Standards. No idea if this is the same on other streaming platforms but I suspect it may be. He's on Concord records and shares a manager with Dolly Parton. To me that means he's got some good publicists pushing his image and product.

Anyway, I listened to the new one...it's not for me. Checked out his website. He's got shows lined up across the country through July 2022. Some venue tix are around $120, maybe more. He may be a punchline in some ways, but not as a performer with those ticket prices and some of those venues. When he's playing at county fairs for free, then it'll be different. 

[Rabshakeh]

2 hours ago, Dan Gould said:

Why is Richard Gere a punchline?

A ridiculous rumour.

[JSngry]

 

[Ken Dryden]

Pardon my cynicism, but that All Music review is nothing more than purely sucking up to the record label and I have no idea who wrote it.

I reviewed the awful Classics in the Key of G for them when it was released, panned it, got paid and it was never posted. Instead, an editor wrote a fawning review of that obvious piece of crap.

[JSngry]

I watched this this afternoon. The guy seems like Martha Stewart with a soprano, only less ruthless 

[Rooster_Ties]

50 minutes ago, JSngry said:

I watched this this afternoon. The guy seems like Martha Stewart with a soprano, only less ruthless 

Nailed it.

[JSngry]

Seriously, he seems like an honest guy with a perhaps OCD-ish work ethic. He knows what he is and what he isn't..the one thing that struck me as a total cop out was his excuse for never bothering to learn theory. That's just lame. But hell, we've heard variations of the same thing for generations around all kinds of pop music (and some jazz, to be honest).

Otherwise, he worked hard, still works hard, and didn't fuck up. As a person, good for him. As a musician...it's easy to blame him, but obviously, a lot of people like shit, and if you don't believe that, you haven't been paying attention for the last century or three 

The film itself was a lot less prickly revisionist than the reviews linked here, but the critics all look like critics (and sound like them as well), and if the moral of the story is that 50,000,000 Elvis Fans Can't Be Wrong, I say the hell they can't, but it's their world, and/so I try to live in it as little as possible. 

I have learned that feeding the beast of wrongness only allows it to remain hungry. It already has it's food, so it need not have mine.

Two different worlds...

 

[Guy Berger]

On 12/10/2021 at 11:43 AM, Rabshakeh said:

All of this seems to be litigating something long past. I remember Kenny G = Jazz jibes from when I was a schoolboy, but I have barely even heard Kenny G's name mentioned in years. He was a popular commercial artist 30 years ago and his music has not stood the test of time. From a cultural perspective he now barely exists.

At most, he's a punchline about awful 1990s music.

Yup.  File this debate in a dusty archive next to "the Wynton Wars"

16 hours ago, JSngry said:

I watched this this afternoon. The guy seems like Martha Stewart with a soprano, only less ruthless 

Laughing so hard right now... contender for post of the year

[Enterprise Server]

Really? Kenny G wants his music to be taken seriously? For that to happen -he would have to play music that is serious. That clearly is not happening.....