Let's Talk About Afro Cuban Jazz Suites

[Teasing the Korean]

I'm thinking about stuff such as:

Chico O'Farrill

• The Afro-Cuban Jazz Suite
• The Second Afro-Cuban Jazz Suite

Chico & Diz:

• The Manteca Suite

Chico & Art Farmer'

• The Aztec Suite

Shorty Rogers

• The Wuayacañanga Suite

Perez Prado/Shorty Rogers

• Voodoo Suite

SO...

What do you think of these?  The first two Chico O'Farrill suites that I listed are my favorites.  These never get old, and I'm always finding new things in them.

Apologies if I started this very same thread 10 years ago.  I couldn't find it on the InterWebz.

[HutchFan]

I'm with you, TtK.  O'Farrill's Afro-Cuban Jazz Suite and Second Afro-Cuban Jazz Suite are my favorites too.

That said, I think the second suite one would been better if O'Farrill would have given it a more imaginative name.  I remember reading somewhere that O'Farrill was disappointed by its lack of recognition, relative to the first.  Titles matter!  Give us a more memorable handle!   

 

[Teasing the Korean]

14 minutes ago, HutchFan said:

That said, I think the second suite one would been better if O'Farrill would have given it a more imaginative name.  

Like, "The Afro-Cuban Jazz Sweetest!"

The second is more interesting, aside from the swing movement which I deleted from my custom version.  It sounds old-fashioned, and it drags the rest of it down.

I especially love the first two movements.  

Edited July 10, 2021 by Teasing the Korean

[jazzcorner]

Count this one in

[Teasing the Korean]

1 hour ago, jazzcorner said:

Count this one in

Never hear of this!  Is it on CD?

[jazzcorner]

3 hours ago, Teasing the Korean said:

Never hear of this!  Is it on CD?

Yes it is a CD

[Teasing the Korean]

28 minutes ago, jazzcorner said:

Yes it is a CD

It seems hard to find.  I wonder if it is slated for reissue as part of the new MPS reissue series.

[JSngry]

Figured this would have come up before now...

[Teasing the Korean]

9 minutes ago, JSngry said:

Figured this would have come up before now...

The Rhodes, electric bass, and synth are a stumbling block for me.  I should give it another chance though.  

[JSngry]

It was almost 50 years ago, plenty long enough for time to stand still.

[Teasing the Korean]

1 minute ago, JSngry said:

It was almost 50 years ago, plenty long enough for time to stand still.

I appreciate it for being something other than the kind of Afro-Cuban jazz suites I'm thinking about.  I filed it in the Now Sound section, and not in the Latin section.  

However, it worth listing, and I will spin it next weekend.

[JSngry]

You ghettoize your "Latin" records based on....what, exactly? Electric bass? Hell,

Electric bass.

Electric bass (Sal Cuevas, RIP)..

I saw Sal Cuevas play with a Barretto group one time, on electric bass. He was a motherfucker.

UH-oh, Rhodes too!

Why do they let people do this?

 

[Teasing the Korean]

59 minutes ago, JSngry said:

You ghettoize your "Latin" records based on....what, exactly? Electric bass? Hell,

Electric bass.

Electric bass (Sal Cuevas, RIP)..

I saw Sal Cuevas play with a Barretto group one time, on electric bass. He was a motherfucker.

UH-oh, Rhodes too!

Why do they let people do this?

Perhaps I was not clear.  

I do not "ghettoize" these records.  I simply classify them differently.  

I would play these records while drinking wine in my record room, which has lots of 60-70s moderne Euro plastic furniture.

However, I would not listen to these records while drinking rum cocktails in my tiki room, which has wood tones and more of a 1940s-50s aesthetic.  

[JSngry]

What do you listen to when you don't drink?

and besides, Chico O'Farrill....never the most "Latin" of "Latin" arrangers to begin with. Just sayin'...

[Teasing the Korean]

16 minutes ago, JSngry said:

What do you listen to when you don't drink?

All kinds of stuff.  When I am working, it has to be instrumental. But the decor is in place whether I am drinking or not.

15 minutes ago, JSngry said:

and besides, Chico O'Farrill....never the most "Latin" of "Latin" arrangers to begin with. Just sayin'...

He is probably my favorite from that era.  I absolutely love his "Latin" charts, but I tend not to like his swing charts, which often sound stilted and old-fashioned.  The Latin charts tend to be more modernist and forward-looking  As I mentioned above, I delete the swing movement from the Second Afro-Cuban Jazz Suite, and I like my 13-minute edit much more than the full version.  

[JSngry]

"Modernist" in a Stan Kenton type "Hollywood" way. A lot of grafting going on, perhaps more impressive in the acting than in the result. But he was no Rene Hernandez.

Then again, Rene Hernandez never wrote for Basie. O'Farrill actually proved to be very good at that.

In no way trying to diminish they guy, he was a total skillmaster. But the notion that a record he made with Dizzy & Machito somehow isn't "Latin" enough...I'd say that in truth, none of it really is, so proceed accordingly across those decades, all of which are over anyway.

[Teasing the Korean]

Just now, JSngry said:

"Modernist" in a Stan Kenton type "Hollywood" way. A lot of grafting going on, perhaps more impressive in the acting than in the result. But he was no Rene Hernandez.

Then again, Rene Hernandez never wrote for Basie. O'Farrill actually proved to be very good at that.

In no way trying to diminish they guy, he was a total skillmaster. But the notion that a record he made with Dizzy & Machito somehow isn't "Latin" enough...I'd say that in truth, none of it really is, so proceed accordingly across those decades, all of which are over anyway.

Not saying it isn't "Latin" enough; It just does not deliver what I get from the aforementioned suites.  I will actually spin it tonight with dinner, as this is a rare occasion on which my wife is home early.  (I never listen to LPs without her; it is something we do together.)

I have a variety of things by Rene Hernandez spread over many LPs and CDs, but LPs don't always list arranger credits.  I do love his work on Machito's exotica LP Kenya, and "Asia Minor" is an exotica classic.

[JSngry]

Well, no. It's 20+ years later, so it would not be the same. That's at least a preliminary plus imo.

[Teasing the Korean]

2 minutes ago, JSngry said:

Well, no. It's 20+ years later, so it would not be the same. That's at least a preliminary plus imo.

Artists were still making records in the 1970s with acoustic instruments.  Electric instruments offer a different aesthetic, one that reflects the decor of my record room and not my tiki room.  

[JSngry]

I have bought records at a furniture store before, but that was even before this record was made... so maybe you should be discussing this in a design and/or alcohol forum instead of a music one?

[Teasing the Korean]

9 minutes ago, JSngry said:

I have bought records at a furniture store before, but that was even before this record was made... so maybe you should be discussing this in a design and/or alcohol forum instead of a music one?

Music, alcohol, and decor all go together for me.  I am happy to discuss here.  If you want to bail, I won't be hurt.  But I will spin that LP now, so I wish you would stick around at least until I can share my thoughts on it. 

Edited July 12, 2021 by Teasing the Korean

[JSngry]

Perhaps you should change the thread title to reflect the multi-disciplinary thrust of your inquiry. As it now stands, we're not at all interested in just the music, it seems, initial appearances to the contrary 

[Teasing the Korean]

1 minute ago, JSngry said:

Perhaps you should change the thread title to reflect the multi-disciplinary thrust of your inquiry. As it now stands, we're not at all interested in just the music, it seems, initial appearances to the contrary 

I was responding to your comments.  It was not my intention for the thread.   

[Teasing the Korean]

So I listened to both sides of Diz/Machito/O'Farrill Afro-Cuban Jazz Moods, on Pablo, from 1975.

I believe this is only the third or fourth time I've spun this.  

I liked side 2, "Three Afro-Cuban Jazz Moods," more than side 1, "Oro, Incienso, y Mirra."

I like the music overall, but I didn't feel that they hung together as suites all that well.

Several of the passages had an early-70s urban cop show feel.  While there is Latin percussion throughout, these feel more like 70s jazz fusion/jazz rock pieces with Latin elements.  I don't know if that is a reflection on the degree to which Latin jazz had absorbed other styles by the mid-70s, or the degree to which Latin rhythms permeated other genres. Probably a combination of the two.  

I will happily spin this album again when my new EQ arrives later this week, but it did not hit me over the head as being two overtly "Afro-Cuban" suites along the lines of the earlier ones.

I asked Ms. TTK if we should file this in the Latin or Now Sound section, and she did not hesitate to say "Latin."  So that is where it will go.  Gotta keep the Mrs. happy.

 

 

Edited July 12, 2021 by Teasing the Korean

[jazzcorner]

4 hours ago, Teasing the Korean said:

It seems hard to find.  I wonder if it is slated for reissue as part of the new MPS reissue series.

Have to look up the details and will report

3 minutes ago, Teasing the Korean said:

I asked Ms. TTK if I should file this in the Latin or Now Sound section, and she did not hesitate to say "Latin."  So that is where it will go.  Gotta keep the Mrs. happy.

OK here is another one for the "Latin Section" on CD  Universal  # 801 00687.

Looks like a compilation of earlier issued material from MPS titled "Three Latin Adventures"