RIP Chick Corea

[Niko]

that entire Liebman interview is really interesting, read it some time last summer after Grossman died, you find it e.g. here, there's a lot about playing with Miles in there, too, and quite a bit about playing with LaRoca, having LaRoca as your lawyer etc so I guess that part of the text is what the passage refers to (but I didn't read it again now)

[Dan Gould]

12 hours ago, JSngry said:

The basic premise, as I understand it, is the we all hold ourselves back because of...ourselves. So we need to figure out how to get throh/past all that shit. Clarity of focus aka "clear".

So far, so good, probably one of the more admirable quest in life.

But Lord...a cult is a cult is a cult. Dear Leaders and YOU pay for them and that's how you "advance  " , that's a cult. Always. 

In all fairness, again, I have known 1 or 2 people who got something meaningful out of it without getting cult-ed. But apart from them... Those motherfuckers creepy.

 And yes, the same can be said about ANY church and its members. Like Groucho Marx and clubs, I'm wary about any church that would want to have me as a member. 

 

You should delete those first three sentences and start with a cult is a cult is a cult.

Everything about L Ron Hubbard is about control of other human beings, and making money from it. He was a shitty science fiction writer who admired churches for amassing wealth which he was never going to attain. He invented his "system" and peddled it with one huge lie: That he was discharged from the service with terrible injuries and that only Dianetics "cured" him. 

He targeted people with weak susceptible minds just like cult leaders do ... and the entirety of the rest of it is cult cult cult, with heaps of criminality interlayered thru out. And to think, they claim to be the most  ethical people in the world. Fuck him and his descendants.

I would vote for any candidate for national office who would campaign on a promise to investigate, and remove, their "religious" tax exemption.

 

[Milestones]

Then there's the cult of the last president, but I guess we can't go there.

 

 

[JSngry]

My experience has been that most of America belongs to some kind of a cult. It's how most people get ahead in life.

Independence and success are not naturally aligned!

[mikeweil]

22 hours ago, gmonahan said:

  Didn't his attachment to Scientology keep him from being able to perform in Germany?? That rings the oldest and dimmest of bells, somehow. 

I remember one tour was cancelled due to protests against his Scientology association.

[felser]

I don't remember him ever mentioning Scientology onstage any of the (3) times I saw him live.  Does anybody?

[romualdo]

RIP Chick

saw him with Gary Burton here in Brisbane back in 2014 (seems like yesterday)

[Ed S]

I'm almost regretting reading the last few pages of this thread that recount the impact of Scientology on Corea throughout his career.

 

Like trane123 above, I discovered RTF while I was in high school.  "Where Have I Known You Before" just might have been my first jazz album.  Up until then, I was pretty much into progressive rock and the Allman Brothers Band.  Listening to that album was a real breakthrough for me and really inspired me to begin exploring jazz and I've never looked back.

 

Also like trane123, I noticed the acknowledgement of L. Ron Hubbard.  I had no idea who he was, what he did or what he represented.  It probably wasn't until a decade later that I found out and I had a hard time separating Corea the musician from Corea the cult member.  In the end, I couldn't - and stopped listening to Corea from probably 1990 until about five years ago.  RTF did a reunion tour of sorts with Jean Luc Ponty and Frank Gambale.  I decided to go see them and as a result, began pulling out some of my old Corea stuff.  I guess I sort of found myself able to ignore the cult and concentrate on and enjoy the music.  Then I read the past few pages.  I'll just say it brought back some prior feelings and exposed me to some new information.           

[ghost of miles]

Going to start a separate thread for this in the Jazz in Print forum, but wanted to add here as well—an excellent overview from Mr. Mark Stryker:

Chick Corea 1941-2021

[Michael Weiss]

On 2/11/2021 at 5:53 PM, Guy Berger said:

Oh no.

When he was at his best, he was one of the very very very best.

When he was at his worst, he was one of the very very very best.

[sgcim]

On 2/16/2021 at 5:36 PM, JSngry said:

Two more things.

1 -a cult is a cult is a cult. I've done occasional gigs at non-denominational mega churches where we were locked in a room for an hour before the service while the musical director prayed incessantly for, among other things, protection from outsiders and my level and spirits. Crazy, more than a little. But the gig would pay $3 50 for about 4 hours work so... And most of the band regulars looked it like that. But most is not all...and then their was all the layers of staff who would drop in to make sure that everything was "going ok". Creepy as fuck.

2 - Al Di Meola has always been, from what I can tell, either a jerk or a very jerk - like individual. Make of that what you will.

Check out the prices he's charging for this!!!

https://www.aldimeola.com/house-events

[ejp626]

11 minutes ago, sgcim said:

Check out the prices he's charging for this!!!

https://www.aldimeola.com/house-events

It beats busking in the subway...

I mean if I could convince someone to pay $5000 to watch me work on spreadsheets for an hour, I wouldn't turn that down.

[pglbook]

6 hours ago, ghost of miles said:

Going to start a separate thread for this in the Jazz in Print forum, but wanted to add here as well—an excellent overview from Mr. Mark Stryker:

Chick Corea 1941-2021

I enjoyed reading that.

It is an excellent (and affectionate) portrait of the many personalities of Chick Corea the musician and Chick Corea the man.

Thanks for sharing.

[Milestones]

Regarding DiMeola, there's a sucker born every minute.  

 

[clifford_thornton]

 

On 2/17/2021 at 2:37 PM, JSngry said:

My experience has been that most of America belongs to some kind of a cult. It's how most people get ahead in life.

Independence and success are not naturally aligned!

THIS

Edited February 19, 2021 by clifford_thornton

[sidewinder]

That DiMeola evening sounds like fun though. Should keep a few bankers entertained !

[Dub Modal]

23 hours ago, ejp626 said:

It beats busking in the subway...

I mean if I could convince someone to pay $5000 to watch me work on spreadsheets for an hour, I wouldn't turn that down.

Yeah me too. Although I'd need to have some folks take pics of me working on the computer and then convert them to posters for the office space. 

[sgcim]

I'd rather pay to watch you guys working on spreadsheets, than watch that pig slobbering down his spaghetti, slurping up all the sauce and getting it all over his face. He probably licks the plate clean right in front of you for an extra thousand bucks!

3 hours ago, clifford_thornton said:

 

THIS

I've thought of starting my own cult to help pay the bills. I got the idea from Lenny Lopate. You have to combine the popularity of Jesus in the West and the hare Krishna movement from the East. I'll call it, "The Hairy Christians".

[Rabshakeh]

That Al Di Meola offer is quite something.  

[Ed S]

My first look at the Di Meola site posted was that this is some sort of joke.  But I guess it's not, right?

 

I read the Di Meola interview posted upthread and could not believe what a self absorbed, ego driven douchebag the guy came across as, the scientology comments notwithstanding.  I will admit to liking his work with RTF, but the solo stuff - after the first couple of solo efforts which were sort of cool back in the day just left me empty for the most part.  I remember seeing him at a local club during the Cielo e Terra - World Sinfonia period which I enjoyed  But the electric stuff he does just does not work for me.  

Edited February 20, 2021 by Ed Swinnich

[JSngry]

Dude, I knew more than a few hardcore fusion lovers back in the day who hated his playing even then. They called him Al Screameola.

For that matter...not every fusion lover loved RTF. They just didn't, especially the people who were already on to Holdsworth/Soft Machine and various other non-Major Label bands that were usually found in the "Imports" section at Peaches.

RTF was obviously very popular. But not universally so. The Big 3 - Mahavishnu, Weather Report, and RTF ahd fan bases that only sometimes overlapped, especially as the musics diverged even more widely that they had begun.

[Milestones]

I loved Mahavishnu, especially the first couple of records.  It took a while for me to come around on Weather Report.  Return to Forever, other than the ECM album, never really did a thing for me.  

[JSngry]

They really were different musics. The standardization came later, and not by the originators.

[felser]

I loved the first few Columbia Mahavishnu Orchestra albums ("The Inner Mounting Flame" was a game changer for me, and "Birds of Fire" is awesome), and some of the Soft Machine albums, including "Bundles" with Holdsworth, as well as Soft Machine Third and Soft Machine Fourth with Mike Ratledge and Elton Dean.  I like most of the 70's electric RTF albums plenty (not a fan of "No Mystery" except the title track) including the "Stanley Clarke" album, from the same template, but will take some of these other ones over them in a heartbeat.   Weather Report was always more hit and miss for me, though I found plenty to like on their first 4-5 albums.   I do love the first two, Airto/Flora/Farrell RTF's, and the Stanley Clarke "Children of Forever" album, but those are a whole different thing.

[Michael Weiss]

Excellent Interview.