Grant Green interview

[Hardbopjazz]

The interviewer talks too much 

 

[DMP]

Thanks!  You’re right, it’s mostly the interviewer - who’s frothing over that number from “Final Comeback,” where Green is hardly a factor. (Although, maybe he played it in that club, and did more with it.) The new Cobblestone LP they talked about was actually recorded several years earlier in a studio in Pittsburgh (released as “Iron City”), and the debate rages over the name of the organist. 

[mjzee]

23 minutes ago, DMP said:

and the debate rages over the name of the organist. 

Big John Patton confirmed that it's not him, and thought it was Larry Young.

[DMP]

There’s an interesting story about the album in (of all places!) an Amazon review, by someone named Travis Klein (if that’s his real name, who knows about those reviews). He recalls the recording as being 1965, and that is a period when Young was working and recording with Green. However, a common recording date is 1967, and Patton was working with Green then (I saw the group at a gig that year at the Hurricane, an organ bar on Center Ave., up on the Hill.) Whoever it is, and I’ll go with Young, it’s hard to identify - nothing really stands out, the organist is working the standard organ vocabulary.  

[bertrand]

You saw Grant Green at the Hurricane in 1967 or 1965 or both?

[DMP]

1967.  Two things stand out: They opened up with “The Yodel,” played at about half the tempo of the version on “Got a Good Thing Going.” And, at the break, someone put on Wes Montgomery’s “Day in the Life,” and when Green and Patton returned to the stand they were trying to work  out an arrangement. (Green did eventually record it.)

[bertrand]

Wow! So it was at this very gig that the seed of the idea to record the Beatles' tune was planted in Grant's head. Amazing!

Do you remember who else was in the band? And, the big question: any chance anyone was recording?

So we know Grant was at the club several times. It still needs to be determined if Larry Young was ever on any of the gigs. It is the only way he could have been on Iron City.

[DMP]

Doubt anyone recorded it, wasn’t that kind of scene - the Hurricane was really just a neighborhood spot. (A neighborhood spot where you could regularly catch Jack McDuff, Stanley Turrentine, Pat Martino and Lou Donaldson!) Can’t remember the drummer - could have been Roger Humphries - he was around town then - but probably not. As for the organist on “Iron City” - hard to tell, he (or she) pretty much works within the standard organ vocabulary of that time. Green worked with both Young and Patton in ‘65, Patton after that. 

[mjzee]

I'm still not seeing the incentive for anyone in this production chain to say it was Patton when it was actually Young.  It's not like one was a bigger draw to record buyers than the other; in fact, in 1972 (the year of release), Young may have been a little "hotter" due to his work with McLaughlin, Santana, etc.  By that logic alone, it is probably Patton on Iron City.

Another interesting question: how did a date from 1965 or 1967 wind up in Cobblestone's hands in 1972?  Who was holding it in the interim?  Especially since Green was paid for the date, why would it take so long for the backer to get a return on his investment?  If it was held up for legal reasons, then there would have been a wider knowledge of the tape's existence.

[DMP]

Again, I would point to that Amazon review of “Iron City, under the heading of ‘The Real Story’ - seems like it might actually be the real story! (Although it doesn’t clear up the name of the organist...mjzee’s post above makes the persuasive case for Patton.)

[Niko]

DMP, do you recognize the club in the photo?

 

[DMP]

Doesn’t stand out... The 2 most active clubs here in Pittsburgh at the time (Crawford Grill and Hurricane Bar) had small stands that were high off the ground - you were always looking up! You didn’t have the kind of view or sight line pictured here. Think about it, though - in many cities you could walk into a neighborhood spot and come across a scene like in your picture!  
 

[Niko]

thanks, that's exactly what I thought - both of those clubs have elevated stages while this one apparently doesn't... I agree that this picture could have been taken anywhere... the bit of extra information (found e.g. in the other Green thread that's currently active) is that George Heid, who is from Pittsburgh, claimed that this picture was taken in Pittsburgh....

[JSngry]

Is the writing on that picture on the wall discernible with any kind of digital tool?

[mjzee]

4 hours ago, Niko said:

DMP, do you recognize the club in the photo?

 

Could it have been the Five Spot in NYC? (see upper left corner)

[bertrand]

It seems like I reactivated two great threads at the same time - sorry about that!

Another interesting thing about the photo is the LP on the organ. Did Grant bring a box with him to the gig to sell? Or did the club owner put it there as a prop? Wikipedia says it came out in 1963, so probably not his latest release at the time of the gig...

[Dan Gould]

16 hours ago, JSngry said:

Is the writing on that picture on the wall discernible with any kind of digital tool?

No, but I applied a filter to try and draw out what's at the upper left, per mjzee's suggestion that it could actually be the Five Spot, and this is the most clarity I could achieve. Nothing.

[robertoart]

2 hours ago, Dan Gould said:

No, but I applied a filter to try and draw out what's at the upper left, per mjzee's suggestion that it could actually be the Five Spot, and this is the most clarity I could achieve. Nothing.

Is this the Five spot circa '66 ?

Edited May 9, 2021 by robertoart

[Quasimado]

Some interior shots of the Hurricane Bar here (initially posted this at the other thread ...)

https://sites.google.com/site/pittsburghmusichistory/pittsburgh-music-story/venues/hurricane-club