Branford slams Miles

[JSngry]

If Branford had three balls, all he'd have would be a pawn shop.

Wayne, otoh, is still fertile as fuck. Old as fuck too, now, but hey.

The only way Branford "matters" is as an economic placeholder for today's business. If he were to die tomorrow, music itself would have no void left. And if Branford had never been born, somebody else would have his gigs now. And still, no difference.

These motherfuckers need to stop thinking they're important to music. They're not. They think they matter. They don't. I didn't miss them before they got here, hey, that's how insignificant they are to me. Place holders in the "business", that's all they have to offer music.

But they do have gigs.

 

 

[Stefan Wood]

10 hours ago, AllenLowe said:

I gotta say that I've liked almost nothing that Wayne Shorter did away from Miles. But his playing with Miles was godlike. Not elsewhere, I don't care what anybody says. 

Sigh.  Old man yelling at clouds syndrome.

 

Wayne's quartet of the past two decades is proof positive that he learned a great deal from Miles.  It is also a testament to Wayne's greatness that he applied it in his own way and own terms.  His sidemen are excellent but I have little to no interest in hearing their own projects.  But with Wayne they are transformed.

[John L]

Jim S.  -  Well, I didn’t understand from the discussion that Branford was asserting his own importance in music.  He was just expressing an opinion about Mile’s role, or lack thereof, in the 2nd quintet. I also disagree with his opinion, but don’t think that he needs to be chastised for it.  

Edited April 16, 2019 by John L

[JSngry]

My chamber of chastisement is currently out of commission until we can get a new drainage system installed. I was merely expressing my opinion about Branford's opinion.

[felser]

1 hour ago, JSngry said:

My chamber of chastisement is currently out of commission until we can get a new drainage system installed. I was merely expressing my opinion about Branford's opinion.

[Rooster_Ties]

Didn't Branford play with Miles for a minute in the 80's?  Couldn't remember, but I'm finding this.  It's the only thing in Plosin's database, so he must not have ever played live with him (or nothing that got caught on tape) -- or am I forgetting something else?

http://www.plosin.com/milesahead/Sessions.aspx?s=830910

September 10, 1983 (3 items; TT = 25:35)

Record Plant Studio, New York NY

Commercial for Columbia

1 -	Decoy (R. Irving III)	8:32
2 -	Code M.D. (R. Irving III)	5:55
3 -	That's Right (M. Davis)	11:08

[JSngry]

56 minutes ago, felser said:

No dice - they got trouble right there in River City. Not bringing that here.

[danasgoodstuff]

12 hours ago, felser said:

I loved his playing with Blakey and his Blue Notes.  But I agree that his work with Weather Report never knocked me out, and the latest leader date that was a keeper for me was 1974's 'Native Dancer'. 

seconded but with some more love for Shorter in Whether Retorts, Typical hype on Bradford's part: making it weaker by saying it stronger. He trumped himself.  Lowe's position is almost as silly.

Edited April 16, 2019 by danasgoodstuff

[Scott Dolan]

Anyone who thinks Brandford is anything short of a stellar musician hasn’t listened to any of his quartet from the last couple of decades. They are the closest approximation to the classic Coltrane Quartet that I’ve ever heard. 

Hopefully, before Jim goes on his word salad rant response, everyone else will note that I clearly stated “approximation”. 

[felser]

1 hour ago, JSngry said:

No dice - they got trouble right there in River City. Not bringing that here.

[JSngry]

Of course he's a stellar musician. The world is full of stellar musicians.

But Branford ain't no giant. He's just tall, that's all.

[Pim]

I do not like Branford either. Never heard him play anything mind blowing, although he is surely more mind blowing than his brother... Branford isn’t bad at all but that goes for quite a lot of saxophonists. if I have to name a saxophonist of that generation that is way better i’d say Kenny Garrett for example. 

But I really don’t like his negative comments on such an old master... I don’t like that whole club of arrogant and jealous musicians with low self esteem: Wynton and of course the biggest gaping asshole in jazz mr. Stanley Crouch. I don’t like jazz musicians talking negative about others anyway. 

Edited April 16, 2019 by Pim

[mandrill]

2 hours ago, Scott Dolan said:

Anyone who thinks Brandford is anything short of a stellar musician hasn’t listened to any of his quartet from the last couple of decades. They are the closest approximation to the classic Coltrane Quartet that I’ve ever heard. 

Hopefully, before Jim goes on his word salad rant response, everyone else will note that I clearly stated “approximation”. 

The last I checked, the classic Coltrane Quartet albums were still in print and readily available.

[ghost of miles]

2 hours ago, Scott Dolan said:

Anyone who thinks Brandford is anything short of a stellar musician hasn’t listened to any of his quartet from the last couple of decades.

I saw them last weekend at the IU Auditorium and they were superlative for sure.  Btw I don't think it will (nor should it, most likely) change any minds in this discussion, but I'll try to post a photo or scan of the entire Miles passage from the DownBeat article later tonight.  

[Milestones]

That would be good.  I tried to get as close to what he said as I could, given my sometimes faltering memory.  But I can say that I did a double take when I read BM's words on Miles.  

[clifford_thornton]

FWIW, Wayne also has a trumpet-playing brother, and his brother was/is a hair more interesting than Branford's.

[Rooster_Ties]

4 hours ago, Rooster_Ties said:

Didn't Branford play with Miles for a minute in the 80's?  Couldn't remember, but I'm finding this.  It's the only thing in Plosin's database, so he must not have ever played live with him (or nothing that got caught on tape) -- or am I forgetting something else?

http://www.plosin.com/milesahead/Sessions.aspx?s=830910

September 10, 1983 (3 items; TT = 25:35)

Record Plant Studio, New York NY

Commercial for Columbia

1 -	Decoy (R. Irving III)	8:32
2 -	Code M.D. (R. Irving III)	5:55
3 -	That's Right (M. Davis)	11:08

Interesting that Branford's comments come from someone who worked with/for Miles, albeit briefly.  I'm not suggesting that makes Branford right, or anything.  I'll have to see the full comments in context.

[Pim]

Yes Alans nice! Pity he only put out a few records...

[soulpope]

49 minutes ago, clifford_thornton said:

FWIW, Wayne also has a trumpet-playing brother, and his brother was/is a hair more interesting than Branford's.

Touche 😎 ....

[felser]

50 minutes ago, Rooster_Ties said:

Interesting that Branford's comments come from someone who worked with/for Miles, albeit briefly.  I'm not suggesting that makes Branford right, or anything.  I'll have to see the full comments in context.

a date in 1983 doesn't enable him to expertly evaluate a remarkable 45 year career.

1 hour ago, mandrill said:

The last I checked, the classic Coltrane Quartet albums were still in print and readily available.

[JSngry]

As clem's math would say...one Rusty Bryant record >>>>>>> relevance to the body of jazzmusic than the entirety of Branford's entire family's past/present/future musical existences, recorded and otherwise.

And TWO, well, that would just not be fair!

 

[soulpope]

1 minute ago, JSngry said:

 

Btw 👍excellent platter👍 ....

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

do we dislike this album too, because i happen to have a japan 1st pressing, but i could be persuaded- whats the over/under on this one with you guys here?

 

[Justin V]

34 minutes ago, JSngry said:

As clem's math would say...one Rusty Bryant record >>>>>>> relevance to the body of jazzmusic than the entirety of Branford's entire family's past/present/future musical existences, recorded and otherwise.

And TWO, well, that would just not be fair!

 

Rusty Bryant Returns has quickly climbed the ranks to become one of my all-time favorites.   

[JSngry]

30 minutes ago, chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez said:

do we dislike this album too, because i happen to have a japan 1st pressing, but i could be persuaded- whats the over/under on this one with you guys here?

 

It was fun at the time, but it made promises that were never delivered. So...maybe I was a fool to even think they WERE promises instead of a set of well-crafted head fakes.