felser Posted May 15, 2019 Author Report Posted May 15, 2019 6 minutes ago, JSngry said: I remember Jim Peterik from Chase! Yeah, he had that style Down! Quote
JSngry Posted May 15, 2019 Report Posted May 15, 2019 Hardly a top-tier talent, but still...there's been a lot of trash talked about Dodo Greene over the years because all people know is that sleepyass Blue Note record and they have no context for hearing it what it is and they jsut dump all over it and her like she and it were all some kind of joke. They weren't. No need to like it, or even appreciate it, but I am here to advocate for both talent and context, past present and future. I don't think it's particularly wise to be without either, but I think it's dangerous as hell to eradicate both from a culture's collective memory. So that's where I'm coming from on Dodo Greene. That and imagine what it must have been like being Ike Quebec's girlfriend, imagine ALL that must have come along with that. THAT'S some "Blue Note" right there, getting off the gig and riding with Ike Quebec into god only knows what kinds of nights, waking up to god know what kinds of mornings, and then at some point, Rudy's. And then back out again. My Hour Of Need indeed! There could be a REALLY good movie there, Ike and Dodo and all that went along with being them, alone and together, if they made good movies about lives like that. If they knew how to make good movies about lives like that. As it is, there are their records, and some are better than others, but none are not real. Quote
Aftab Posted May 15, 2019 Report Posted May 15, 2019 1 hour ago, felser said: Yeah, he had that style Down! My preferred version of the above song... Quote
JSngry Posted May 15, 2019 Report Posted May 15, 2019 Vehicle, by a Mexican Afro-Cuban band playing at a Senor Taco in Singapore. I'm glad that everybody's staying inside their own culture. Quote
felser Posted May 15, 2019 Author Report Posted May 15, 2019 Well, Peterik wrote it, as well as charting it. And he was like 20 years old. And he also wrote and charted "Eye of the Tiger". And in the 60's when Peterik was in his teens, the Ides of March were a top garage band in Chicago, along with Shadows of Knight, Buckinghams, Cryan' Shames, H.P. Lovecraft, etc.. Quite a local scene (and the Curtis Mayfield-driven soul scene was amazing, with Gene Chandler, pre-Philly Jerry Butler, Barbara Acklin, Barbara Lewis etc. etc.) Quote
JSngry Posted May 15, 2019 Report Posted May 15, 2019 Yeah, but did he ever have sex with Ike Quebec? Talk about the friendly stranger in the black sedan... Quote
felser Posted May 16, 2019 Author Report Posted May 16, 2019 47 minutes ago, JSngry said: Yeah, but did he ever have sex with Ike Quebec? Talk about the friendly stranger in the black sedan... I hear that! Quebec had a short, hard, messy life, and I'm sure by extension Greene did, too, during that period. Quebec died the same month that Greene record was released. That seems to be the underside of the whole Blue Note thing - a lot of troubling human stories behind the great music. Quote
Aftab Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 12 hours ago, felser said: I hear that! Quebec had a short, hard, messy life, and I'm sure by extension Greene did, too, during that period. Quebec died the same month that Greene record was released. That seems to be the underside of the whole Blue Note thing - a lot of troubling human stories behind the great music. Yeah, that’s the underside of a lot of great jazz musicians, and artists in general. 🙁 BTW, I opened a show for a recent version of Ides of March not too long ago. Jim Peterik came over and talked to us for a bit. Cool guy, cooler hair. 👍🏻 Quote
bertrand Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 Does Grant Green get any solo space on the Dodo record? Any thoughts on Natural Illusions? Quote
mikeweil Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 On 14.5.2019 at 3:21 AM, mjzee said: How are those two Blakey Holiday for Skins albums? Are they similar to his other drum-focused albums (Orgy in Rhythm, Drums Around The Corner, Drum Suite)? I kinda liked DATC, never cared for Orgy, haven't heard Drum Suite. Oh yeah, The African Beat too; never heard that one either. Holiday For Skins is kind of in the middle between Orgy In Rhythm and The African Beat. DATC is the jazziest, TAB the most "African". But you have to enjoy drum focussed albums to repeatedly play any of them. Quote
felser Posted May 16, 2019 Author Report Posted May 16, 2019 13 minutes ago, bertrand said: Any thoughts on Natural Illusions? I think of it like a subpar CTI record. If Hutcherson playing "Sophisticated Lady" etc. with a bunch of string arrangements by Wade Marcus turns you on, go for it. Quote
JSngry Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 Isn't that the one that was recorded outdoors? Oops, no, that was Linger Lane, my bad. Quote
felser Posted May 16, 2019 Author Report Posted May 16, 2019 14 minutes ago, JSngry said: Isn't that the one that was recorded outdoors? Oops, no, that was Linger Lane, my bad. Linger Lane is a different kind of commercialization, a Jerry Peters production along the lines of what Peters was producing for Donald Byrd and Bobbi Humphrey on BN at the time (1974ish) and I greatly prefer it to "Natural Illusions". Hutcherson/BN were trying some different things then, with some differing results. But I'm always going to have a soft spot for any record with an extended "People Make The World Go Round" on it. Quote
JSngry Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 Hard as it might be to imagine now, Blue Note was actually spending money on Bobby Hutcherson in the early 70s. I recall one full page ad in DB in particular. A full page ad! I guess BH had made some kind of market breakthrough or looked like he was about to, I don't know. At some later point, BN seemed to put him on the back burner, but hey, Columbia took him and ran with it for a bit. Who was Bobby's manager? Somebody who did well by him, I gotta think, the guy never had any real periods of obscurity, except, maybe(?) post-Columbia, but that might have been voluntary, coming out of it as he did with that glorious solo album on Contemporary. Dude always had a gig, always had a record. Quote
Rooster_Ties Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 1 hour ago, JSngry said: ...the guy (BH) never had any real periods of obscurity, except, maybe(?) post-Columbia, but that might have been voluntary, coming out of it as he did with that glorious solo album on Contemporary. Dude always had a gig, always had a record. Were there really any vibe-players of Bobby's generation, other than probably Roy Ayers and Gary Burton of course, that ever got much national exposure and name recognition? I can't believe no one has put up all the Downbeat reader-poll results for every year somewhere on the internet, but I did just find an image of the results for Vibes in 1975 https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/34607_446952055350_4737393_n.jpg?_nc_cat=103&_nc_ht=scontent-iad3-1.xx&oh=e46c8afed6de8646691960664124beb5&oe=5D74847B In case that won't display, FWIW, here's the Vibes category... Vibes (Downbeat Readers Poll 1975) 2426 - Gary Burton 1390 - Milt Jackson 631 - Bobby Hutcherson 394 - Lionel Hampton 154 - Roy Ayers 140 - Ruth Underwood 116 - Cal Tjader 105 - Karl Berger 91 - David Friedman 67 - Terry Gibbs 56 - Red Norvo Quote
felser Posted May 16, 2019 Author Report Posted May 16, 2019 2 hours ago, Rooster_Ties said: Were there really any vibe-players of Bobby's generation, other than probably Roy Ayers and Gary Burton of course, that ever got much national exposure and name recognition? Not sure who else would have merited the attention those three received. Quote
Rooster_Ties Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, felser said: Not sure who else would have merited the attention those three received. Agreed, but I will say that Ruth Underwood was one hell of a good player too. Quote
felser Posted May 16, 2019 Author Report Posted May 16, 2019 3 hours ago, JSngry said: Hard as it might be to imagine now, Blue Note was actually spending money on Bobby Hutcherson in the early 70s. I recall one full page ad in DB in particular. A full page ad! I guess BH had made some kind of market breakthrough or looked like he was about to, I don't know. At some later point, BN seemed to put him on the back burner, but hey, Columbia took him and ran with it for a bit. Who was Bobby's manager? Somebody who did well by him, I gotta think, the guy never had any real periods of obscurity, except, maybe(?) post-Columbia, but that might have been voluntary, coming out of it as he did with that glorious solo album on Contemporary. Dude always had a gig, always had a record. May be that the 'Now' album, with the Eugene McDaniels cuts, opened some doors, but I'm not sure what would have lead BN to believe a breakthrough was imminent (though he certainly did some great music). Seems like the only break in his discography into the 90's was when he had his hand injury in the early 80's. He was a different player when he returned, 2 mallets rather than four, etc. Generation later, but the guy who could really play vibes at an awe-inspiring level, though I never heard recorded proof of it (saw him live) was Bryan Carrott. Just now, Rooster_Ties said: Agreed, but I will say that Ruth Underwood was one hell of a good player too. Yes she was, saw her live with Zappa. She was critical to his sound, and perfect for that group. But she never recorded as a leader or wrote material, etc. AFAIK. Quote
Aftab Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 59 minutes ago, JSngry said: Found the ad. I love the attitude! Oh snap! Love it. Nice internet sleuthing btw. Quote
JSngry Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 No sleuthing anywhere except in my closet, scanned directly from an old DB! Here's another one I had stored: GOTTA be a buff! Quote
king ubu Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 fotofuckit still exists? and allow you to up stuff without you having to pay 300$ a year or what? either way, very cool ads, thanks for sharing! -- btw, the Conn of the Dodo Green (I like it, but it took me a few rounds) has plenty of bonus material, the CT has a long first take in its RVG guise, too - will these be included in this new series? Anyone knows? Quote
jazzbo Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 The upcoming Greene shows only ten cuts on CDJapan, and there is no track listing for the Taylor. Seems unlikely the bonus material is present. Quote
king ubu Posted May 16, 2019 Report Posted May 16, 2019 17 minutes ago, jazzbo said: The upcoming Greene shows only ten cuts on CDJapan, and there is no track listing for the Taylor. Seems unlikely the bonus material is present. Okay - for those I checked, there were no tracklists yet (or possibly "Conquistador" as a one-track disc just won't get one?) Quote
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