The Great Day in Harlem photo - which of them did you see live?

[Brad]

I only saw Sonny once.  The rest of you guys like Medjuck are very lucky. 

[felser]

11 hours ago, mjzee said:

There was a prior discussion on the board about this.  Some said that the rhythm section was imposed on Cecil, that he wanted a more progressive bassist or drummer.  The results were...indescribable.  Taken as a trio, Mary Lou was great, but then there's this guy on the other end of the stage...  Anyway, hear it for yourself if you dare!

 

It's worth it just for the high concept of seeing Cecil Taylor on Pablo.  Though it should have been called "Mary Lou Williams Meets Cecil Taylor," or "The Mary Lou Williams And Cecil Taylor Quartet," or "The Ebullient Mary Lou And Cecil...Together!" or maybe "Cecil Taylor Sits In With The Mary Lou Williams Trio."

I actually do own that CD, which is what prompted me to ask the question!  Is that recording the performance you saw?

[Chuck Nessa]

About 30.

[Don Brown]

I saw 44 of them. Toronto was always an excellent place for jazz. Most of these artists appeared at either the Colonial Tavern on Yonge Street or the Town Tavern on Queen. The Town booked mostly "modernists" while the Colonial booked everyone from Monk to Eddie Condon.

 

Edited March 22, 2019 by Don Brown

[porcy62]

Only Rollins. But I would like to buy an art print of it.

[Peter Friedman]

23 hours ago, Dmitry said:

https://www.udiscovermusic.com/stories/amazing-photograph-jazz-history/

I've only seen two in person, the two who happen to be the last men standing today, Benny Golson and Sony Rollins. Coincidentally, both are tenor players.

I saw most of the "Giants" that are in the photo such as Prez, Monk, Diz, Rollins, Roy, Horace, Blakey, Basie.

But one of those in the photo that I am sorry to have never seen was Pee Wee Russell.

[felser]

38 minutes ago, porcy62 said:

Only Rollins. But I would like to buy an art print of it.

Me too, $25.49 from Amazon

https://www.amazon.com/24x35-Great-Harlem-Portrait-Poster/dp/B000O2C0LQ/ref=sr_1_3?crid=9HH2VLQDFF00&keywords=great+day+in+harlem+poster&qid=1553271254&s=gateway&sprefix=great+day+in+harle%2Caps%2C204&sr=8-3

 

[BillF]

Blakey (3 times), Griffin (twice), Clayton, Kaminsky, Silver (twice), Rushing, Emmett Berry, Monk (twice), Gillespie (3 times), Basie (twice), Dicky Wells - and all in the UK.

Edited March 27, 2019 by BillF

[mjzee]

2 hours ago, felser said:

I actually do own that CD, which is what prompted me to ask the question!  Is that recording the performance you saw?

Yes.  I think it was a one-time thing.

What did you think of it?  I did not see Cecil listening to Mary Lou; he just did his thing.  I suspect that if you were able to isolate his mikes, you'd be listening to a Cecil solo concert.

[JSngry]

It should be noted that Cecil had a lot of respect for Mary Lou (as he did for all past maters), but she was, to put it mildly, suspicious of him (as she was of many people for many reasons). The concert/record was a mess, but how could have not been? It would be wrong, though, to assume that Cecil was being an asshole towards Mary Lou, he wasn't. Cecil was just playing the way he played, period, same as he always did and always would. Same with Mary Lou.

If anybody's interested, check out Mary Lou's comments about her composition "A Fungus Amungus"...nobody has denied that this was not aimed at Cecil, nor her various comments about homosexuality destroying jazz (or whatever it was she said along those lines).

Two great artists with strong individual POVs, best - and probably only - enjoyed on their own terms rather than in any attempted merge.

 

[Mark Stryker]

10 -- Basie, Blakey, Farmer, Gillespie, Golson, Griffin, Hank Jones, McPartland, Rollins, Silver 



 

[Shrdlu]

I saw Diz and Monk when they toured Australia (where I lived then, though that was coming to an end) as part of George Wein's "Giants Of Jazz" in 1971. Realizing that that was a once-in-a-life-time opportunity, I went to Melbourne to catch them, as well as at Adelaide where I was living. I flew back to Adelaide with them all, and my Dad took pics of us all leaving the plane. In those days, you went down a ladder off the plane and walked across the tarmac. No security zones, and I wasn't X-rayed in the nude like they do now in the U.S.

For those who don't know, the lineup was Diz, Kai Winding, Sonny Stitt, Monk, Al McSkibbon-Vouty and Bu. They had Jaki Byard there, in case Monk couldn't play, but Monk played at all the concerts and Jaki did a set of piano solos.

The lineup was a good idea on paper, but, as Bu said, it was a bad idea. But, as many of you know, it did produce that excellent Monk session for Black Lion in London. Three whole CDs' worth.

Bud Freeman, Jimmy Rushing, Buck Clayton and Pee Wee Russell were touring Australia with an Eddie Condon group. Others in the group were Dick Cary and Jack Lesberg. I don't remember who was on drums: maybe George Wettling. My uncle took me to see them. I was a teenager, into Bird and Trane, and I didn't like a single minute of it, to be honest. I had just been given a copy of Bill Grauer and Orrin Keepnews's "Pictorial History of Jazz", and I was keen to talk with Eddie about Bix. I only got a couple of minutes and then was told to clam up. I wish I had then known that Buck was in the classic Basie band. I saw him in the hotel and said to him that I had heard him on a Benny Goodman album: the Decca "Benny Goodman Story", Vol 2, album, where he isn't credited, but appeared in a picture on the cover of the Australian issue of the album. Bud and Jimmy Rushing were both extremely friendly.

[Justin V]

I'm still under 40, so I never had the opportunity to see most of the musicians in the photograph.  I've seen Sonny Rollins 3 times, Benny Golson 5 times (6 times soon) and Hank Jones twice.  

[felser]

1 hour ago, mjzee said:

Yes.  I think it was a one-time thing.

What did you think of it?  I did not see Cecil listening to Mary Lou; he just did his thing.  I suspect that if you were able to isolate his mikes, you'd be listening to a Cecil solo concert.

I think it's an utter mess, but an interesting utter mess.  I do still own it, which says something.

1 hour ago, JSngry said:

It should be noted that Cecil had a lot of respect for Mary Lou (as he did for all past maters), but she was, to put it mildly, suspicious of him (as she was of many people for many reasons). The concert/record was a mess, but how could have not been? It would be wrong, though, to assume that Cecil was being an asshole towards Mary Lou, he wasn't. Cecil was just playing the way he played, period, same as he always did and always would. Same with Mary Lou.

If anybody's interested, check out Mary Lou's comments about her composition "A Fungus Amungus"...nobody has denied that this was not aimed at Cecil, nor her various comments about homosexuality destroying jazz (or whatever it was she said along those lines).

Two great artists with strong individual POVs, best - and probably only - enjoyed on their own terms rather than in any attempted merge.

 

I hear you, but that maybe calls into question the idea of doing that concert in the first place.  I heard McCoy Tyner and Marian McPartland play together at an encore at the Tower Theatre 20ish years ago.  They retained their identities, but met each other somewhere that worked.  Of course, McPartland did that all the time on her radio show.   Did not know about the aspects of Mary Lou you are sharing, but easy enough to understand how some of that would have come about, given what she may have experienced in the biz.

[JSngry]

I forget who put the concert together, but I don't blame either one of them for taking the gig. I'm sure the money was good enough.

Certain "schools" will want to "blame" the "other person" for the mess, but hey - blame the promoters. It was their idea, it was their money. And really, if everybody got paid, nobody's business. They each continued on, no damage done to either.

[mjzee]

As I recall, Mary Lou put the concert together.  She wanted to bridge the gap, as it were, and show connections between more traditional jazz and the avant-garde.

This backs me up: https://jazztimes.com/features/mary-lou-williams-cecil-taylor-embraceable-you/

[JSngry]

hmmmm.....

[JSngry]

Cecil! Please listen if you can. Why did you come to me so often when I was at the Cookery? Why did you consent to do a concert? You felt I was a sincere friend. In the battlefield, the enemy (Satan) does not want artists to create or be together as friends.

Cecil, the spirituals were the most important factor of the concert (strength), to achieve success playing from the heart, inspiring new concepts for the second half. I wrote you concerning the first half. You will have a chance to listen to the original tapes and will agree that being angry you created monotony, corruption, and noise. Please forgive me for saying so. Why destroy your great talent clowning, etc.? Applause is false. I do not believe in compliments or glory, my inspiration comes from sincere love. I was not seeking glory for myself when I asked you to do the concert. I am hoping you will reimburse me for 30 tickets-would you like to see the receipts?

I still love you, Mary

Yeah, this sounds to me like a missionary who's still trying to save the natives from themselves after thinking that all they had to do was to show up and glow.

I love Mary Lou, no mistake, but she went out there and stayed out there as far as the "spiritual" thing went. And she's had a cult every bit as much as Cecil had.

So...she paid Cecil to play with her. And then she pissed him off by not respecting him as a collaborator and he played harder.

Apparently she felt a draft because he did (although at first I guess she was happy, felt that she played her ass off, but then she heard voices).

And THEN she blamed the devil.

A fool and their money, etc.

[Peter Friedman]

Looking at the Harlem 1958 photo and listing those I had seen caused me to reflect on the many many many fine jazz musicians I have seen live, and who were on the scene in 1958, but were not included in the photo.

Certainly some may have not been in New York when the photo was made, but some most likely were in town. I came up very quickly with a list of more than 50 not in the photo. Here are just a few -

Milt Jackson, John Lewis, Bob Brookmeyer, Zoot Sims, Al Cohn, Curtis Fuller, Sonny Stitt, Tommy Flanagan, Donald Byrd, Lee Morgan, Jackie Mclean, Miles Davis, John Coltrane, Paul Chambers, Barry Harris, Philly Joe Jones, Louis Hayes, J.R. Montrose, Percy Heath, Lee Konitz, Warne Marsh, Chet Baker, Phil Urso, Pepper Adams, JJ Johnson, Kenny Burrell, Jimmy Raney, Dexter Gordon, Sonny Red, Kenny Dorham, Thad Jones, Mel Lewis, Jimmy Heath, Ray Brown, Bill Hardman, Frank Foster, Frank Wess, Joe Newman, John Williams, Red Garland,  Stan Getz, Charlie Shavers, Wild Bill Davison, Terry Gibbs And more. 

[porcy62]

7 hours ago, felser said:

Me too, $25.49 from Amazon

https://www.amazon.com/24x35-Great-Harlem-Portrait-Poster/dp/B000O2C0LQ/ref=sr_1_3?crid=9HH2VLQDFF00&keywords=great+day+in+harlem+poster&qid=1553271254&s=gateway&sprefix=great+day+in+harle%2Caps%2C204&sr=8-3

 

Thanks!

[medjuck]

I recently read this kids book and quite enjoyed it.  

Edited March 22, 2019 by medjuck

[king ubu]

That is one crazy-ass letter there ... you don't happen to have ghosted it for MLW @JSngry 

 

Alas, I didn't see many of the musicians present that day - and each of them just once:

- Johnny Griffin (in trio with Martial Solal and NHOP)

- Benny Golson (doing his Coltrane tribute programme, with Buster Williams, Al Foster, Randy Brecker a.o.)

- Sonny Rollins (in fine shape with his no more than okay band)

- Hank Jones (in a pretty weird all-star gig that also included Ray Brown [now where is he on that photo?], Kenny Burrell, Mickey Roker and Bobby Hutcherson (though he seemed as if he preferred not being there and played like that, too, total lack of interest)

Caught a few more that didn't make that photo shooting (Max Roach) or were probably not quite prominent enough to have been invited (Sheila Jordan, Curtis Fuller, Benny Bailey, Shirley Horn)

[BillF]

On 3/22/2019 at 9:29 PM, Peter Friedman said:

Looking at the Harlem 1958 photo and listing those I had seen caused me to reflect on the many many many fine jazz musicians I have seen live, and who were on the scene in 1958, but were not included in the photo.

Certainly some may have not been in New York when the photo was made, but some most likely were in town. I came up very quickly with a list of more than 50 not in the photo. Here are just a few -

Milt Jackson, John Lewis, Bob Brookmeyer, Zoot Sims, Al Cohn, Curtis Fuller, Sonny Stitt, Tommy Flanagan, Donald Byrd, Lee Morgan, Jackie Mclean, Miles Davis, John Coltrane, Paul Chambers, Barry Harris, Philly Joe Jones, Louis Hayes, J.R. Montrose, Percy Heath, Lee Konitz, Warne Marsh, Chet Baker, Phil Urso, Pepper Adams, JJ Johnson, Kenny Burrell, Jimmy Raney, Dexter Gordon, Sonny Red, Kenny Dorham, Thad Jones, Mel Lewis, Jimmy Heath, Ray Brown, Bill Hardman, Frank Foster, Frank Wess, Joe Newman, John Williams, Red Garland,  Stan Getz, Charlie Shavers, Wild Bill Davison, Terry Gibbs And more. 

And from your list, Peter I saw the following: Stitt (twice), Lee Morgan, PJJ, Louis Hayes, Konitz, Pepper Adams, Dexter, Thad, Mel (twice), Frank Foster, Wess and Newman.

Some others I saw who I don't think were in either list were: Cozy Cole, Earl Hines, Jack Teagarden, Woody Herman, Paul Desmond, 

[felser]

1 hour ago, BillF said:

And from your list, Peter I saw the following: Stitt (twice), Lee Morgan, PJJ, Louis Hayes, Konitz, Pepper Adams, Dexter, Thad, Mel (twice), Frank Foster, Wess and Newman.

Some others I saw who I don't think were in either list were: Cozy Cole, Earl Hines, Jack Teagarden, Woody Herman, Paul Desmond, 

I have seen McLean, Hayes, Dexter, and Jimmy Heath.

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

i'm pumped to see #2 in a few weeks!