Blue Note's TONE POET series.

[Dub Modal]

Anybody can make any claim online in an anonymous forum, “gear profiles” be damned (lol at that asinine rule). I’m not in the market for most of these Tone Poets but I have a few. While it’s a shame some of them have random defects I do like how BN is featuring some of these albums and weaving them into their contemporary stable. They’re at least profiling some legendary musicians and albums that remain relevant and should never be forgotten. 

[Kevin Bresnahan]

I have enjoyed quite a few of these Tone Poet LP releases. I think a large majority of them sound great and look even better than the originals. I have no problem buying them... after I find out that there aren't any mastering problems. I've been burned and I'm not doing it any more.

What bothers me over on the Hoffman boards is this weird attitude that you can't say anything bad about them. It's almost as if they're afraid that they might stop releasing them if people complain. Theses people will tell you to clean your record, swap your cartridge, swap your turntable, swap your phono preamp, or the worst case "I don't hear the problem so it must be you". They will literally say anything except the obvious, "Boy, Blue Note really screwed this one up".

I think back to Blue Note's CD reissue programs. I remember getting corrected CDs sent to me for Wayne Shorter's "The Soothsayer" and the RVG CD of Bobby Hutcherson's "Dialogue" because there were mastering defects. Blue Note (Michael Cuscuna) heard about a problem and they fixed it. They even offered corrected CDs to those affected. What a novel idea - customer service. Blue Note no longer seems to care about this.

Edited November 10, 2022 by bresna

[sidewinder]

With regards to ‘Passing Ships’, my understanding is that Wallen Bink in London were originally working on this one and planning to reissue it themselves. In the end, Blue Note took over the project. The original plan was for side 4 to include additional music.

Hoffman Forums = ‘Moonies’ (not Keith..)

[Kevin Bresnahan]

8 minutes ago, sidewinder said:

With regards to ‘Passing Ships’, my understanding is that Wallen Bink in London were originally working on this one and planning to reissue it themselves. In the end, Blue Note took over the project. The original plan was for side 4 to include additional music.

Hoffman Forums = ‘Moonies’ (not Keith..)

Michael Cuscuna never identified the label but did say that it was a UK label and that they were compensated for the mastering work they already did. I didn't hear that they planned additional material. I wonder what they were planning for side 4?

[sidewinder]

According to WB’s Facebook page, it would have included alternate takes of ‘Illusion’, ‘Dance With Death’ and ‘Soul Special’. Malcolm Addey was originally involved in the mastering, apparently.

[Kevin Bresnahan]

1 hour ago, sidewinder said:

According to WB’s Facebook page, it would have included alternate takes of ‘Illusion’, ‘Dance With Death’ and ‘Soul Special’. Malcolm Addey was originally involved in the mastering, apparently.

Yeah, Michael said that Addey re-did this analog stereo master from the original 8-track analog tapes for this Tone Poet LP. I don't imagine there are too many mastering engineers out there who mix in analog these days. It would seem to be a dying art. I've had enough trouble making a good cassette dub of a stereo LP. I can't imagine setting the levels right so that 8 tracks of audio don't drive the signal into overload.

[Pim]

On 23-8-2022 at 6:00 PM, bresna said:

What bothers me over on the Hoffman boards is this weird attitude that you can't say anything bad about them. It's almost as if they're afraid that they might stop releasing them if people complain. Theses people will tell you to clean your record, swap your cartridge, swap your turntable, swap your phono preamp, or the worst case "I don't hear the problem so it must be you". They will literally say anything except the obvious, "Boy, Blue Note really screwed this one up".

 

I am a SH visitor as well and this is very recognizable. Blue Note has the the status of a catholic saint, a communist leader over there. You can’t say anything bad about them. The new Wayne Shorter is missing a spine text on all the pressings. I thinks that’s a little messy for a company asking 30 euros for a piece of vinyl. But no one agreed with me, nobody even liked my remark. The people who reacted said they didn’t understand what I was complaining about and Blue Note should ignore customers like me. These are the same guys that send a record back 4 times because it gives one pop at the end.
 

This leads to another weird Hoffman Blue Note thing. It’s the total obsession by so many board members with…. Blue Note. Most people there don’t know shit about any other jazz artists unless he has brought out his music on Blue Note. The only jazz they listen to is on Blue Note. I dare to say that to them jazz = Blue Note. 
 

And they like every single record on the label. Every new Tone Poet, every new Classic: it’s always the same story. ‘Wow this must be one of the best jazz records I’ve ever heard’. ‘Oh my god I love this record’. Blablablabla. No serious music listening or analyzing at all. No sincere opinions.

Weird guys they are/

Edited August 24, 2022 by Pim

[Rabshakeh]

22 minutes ago, Pim said:

This leads to another weird Hoffman Blue Note thing. It’s the total obsession by so many board members with…. Blue Note. Most people there don’t know shit about any other jazz artists unless he has brought out his music on Blue Note. The only jazz they listen to is on Blue Note. I dare to say that to them jazz = Blue Note. 

And they like every single record on the label. Every new Tone Poet, every new Classic: it’s always the same story. ‘Wow this must be one of the best jazz records I’ve ever heard’. ‘Oh my god I love this record’. Blablablabla. No serious music listening or analyzing at all. No sincere opinions.

Weird guys they are/

I think this is pretty common, provided that you add in Miles Davis and stuff on Impulse! 

[mjazzg]

Thank God we're not weird over here 

[sidewinder]

14 minutes ago, mjazzg said:

Thank God we're not weird over here 

To be fair to them, some of them seem to like Wallen Bink so all is not lost.

[Pim]

56 minutes ago, mjazzg said:

Thank God we're not weird over here 

[Kevin Bresnahan]

1 hour ago, mjazzg said:

Thank God we're not weird over here 

Yeah. you're right! We are very normal over here. Oh... wait a minute... you're being sarcastic!

[HutchFan]

2 hours ago, mjazzg said:

Thank God we're not weird over here 

You're right, mjazzg, we're weird too. ... But it's a different flavor of weird.

I just happen to like my kinda weird; i.e., people who hang out on THIS forum.   

Besides, people who aren't weird are boring.

 

[JSngry]

1 hour ago, HutchFan said:

people who aren't weird are boring.

 

Unless they are given positions of authority and try to encourage and enforce a culture of conformity.

That's not weird, that's evil.

[danasgoodstuff]

5 hours ago, Pim said:

I am a SH visitor as well and this is very recognizable. Blue Note has the the status of a catholic saint, a communist leader over there. You can’t say anything bad about them. The new Wayne Shorter is missing a spine text on all the pressings. I thinks that’s a little messy for a company asking 30 euros for a piece of vinyl. But no one agreed with me, nobody even liked my remark. The people who reacted said they didn’t understand what I was complaining about and Blue Note should ignore customers like me. These are the same guys that send a record back 4 times because it gives one pop at the end.
 

This leads to another weird Hoffman Blue Note thing. It’s the total obsession by so many board members with…. Blue Note. Most people there don’t know shit about any other jazz artists unless he has brought out his music on Blue Note. The only jazz they listen to is on Blue Note. I dare to say that to them jazz = Blue Note. 
 

And they like every single record on the label. Every new Tone Poet, every new Classic: it’s always the same story. ‘Wow this must be one of the best jazz records I’ve ever heard’. ‘Oh my god I love this record’. Blablablabla. No serious music listening or analyzing at all. No sincere opinions.

Weird guys they are/

I love BN as much as the next guy, maybe more.  But it does get a little weird over there.  BN is NOT the whole story of jazz, even if it's my favorite chapter.  And there is crap on the label (I'm not totally convinced that the Mizell brothers' stuff is even music made by earthlings).  On the other hand, I love seeing something like Don Wilkerson's Preach Brother getting a bunch of love over there.

[Kevin Bresnahan]

I had Kenny Burrell's "Kenny Burrell", one of the latest Tone Poet LPs, in my hands at Bull Moose Music store in Portsmouth over the weekend and decided to hold off since I hadn't read any reviews of this newest pressing. Glad I did - people are reporting distortion on Side 2. They didn't get me this time.

[sidewinder]

37 minutes ago, bresna said:

I had Kenny Burrell's "Kenny Burrell", one of the latest Tone Poet LPs, in my hands at Bull Moose Music store in Portsmouth over the weekend and decided to hold off since I hadn't read any reviews of this newest pressing. Glad I did - people are reporting distortion on Side 2. They didn't get me this time.

Interesting - most of the Hoffmeisters seem happy with it but at least one reports distortion on the title track. I’m holding fire on this one for now too.

[Kevin Bresnahan]

3 hours ago, sidewinder said:

Interesting - most of the Hoffmeisters seem happy with it but at least one reports distortion on the title track. I’m holding fire on this one for now too.

That one post is enough for me. Too many of those posters ignore problems with these Tone Poet LPs so that one negative means more to me than the many posters praising it. I'll watch for more posts on this but for now, I'll continue to enjoy the CD.

[Dub Modal]

On 8/24/2022 at 5:30 PM, danasgoodstuff said:

(I'm not totally convinced that the Mizell brothers' stuff is even music made by earthlings). 

Lol, You think they were Venutians? 

[danasgoodstuff]

41 minutes ago, Dub Modal said:

Lol, You think they were Venutians? 

It's music from some place I ain't never been, even in my mind.  Nor do I care to go there.

[JSngry]

You never listened to Jackson 5 records as a kid?

Perhaps YOU, then, are the Venutian!

[Pim]

The Grant Green sounds amazing. Don’t know about the Burrell

[Dub Modal]

Speaking of the Mizzel's, I don't think they've issued any of those BNs in the TP series, but have done 3(?) in their Classic reissue line. Maybe Joe Harley isn't a fan of them either. I like 'em and am a little surprised to read about how they've been controversial ever since first released. Guess since they're more tinged with jazz elements and not strictly jazz records coming from a font of hard bop that BN was, that is/was the issue - the main one at least. 

[JSngry]

My issue isn't with what they were trying to do, it's with how they ended up doing it. 

[Dub Modal]

I don't know any of the behind the scenes stuff outside of what's generally available online via BN, wiki, etc.