Mitch Miller and George Avakian

[medjuck]

Does anyone know who worked for whom when George Avakian and Mitch Miller were both at Columbia?  Avakian was  supposedly in charge of popular as well as jazz recordings (he did discover Johnny Mathis)  but Miller seems to have a pretty free rein-- he takes credit/blame for keeping Columbia out of the Rock and Roll business until the '60s. 

[Fer Urbina]

There's plenty to be found on Billboard. On the Sep 30, 1957 issue, there's a note saying that Avakian reports to Miller (although Avakian was just months away from leaving Columbia). You may also want to check the August 4, 1956 issue -- it carries a 30-page infomercial about Columbia. Interestingly, Avakian only appears towards the end as "a.&r. director of pop albums". Miller appears as "pop artists & repertoire chief" working under "sales chief, Hal Cook".

F

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

Mitch Miller was a 32nd degree freemanson and in the 90s dr stephen greer met with him as part of his ongoing disclosure project.  Have you guys ever heard of the Orion Cube.  Much like, in a way, like 15 ips 2-track machines....very few people have ever experienced the orion cube, which is now in a room in the pentagon, but it used to be in the DC Scottish rite bldg...anyways back to the story,  in February 1954 at Edwards Air Force Base California, President Eisenhower  met with some people from the "Nordic" race of ETs.  Earth was given this device, a piece of advanced technology, it can call up holographic imaging of past events and some future events.   A lot of ppl will say oh science doesnt know about that lolololol chewy-- oh well. 

Edited August 22, 2018 by chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez

[Big Beat Steve]

Chewy, what have you been smoking this morning??

[JSngry]

http://www.starshipearththebigpicture.com/tag/orion-cube/

[Big Beat Steve]

Mitch Miller an extraterrestrian? Well, who knows ...

Maybe Men in Black ought to have been made much, much earlier?

[JSngry]

I just wonder what was really coming out of that oboe...

[Brad]

1 hour ago, Big Beat Steve said:

Chewy, what have you been smoking this morning??

I never understood that whole Mason thing, with this degree or that degree. 

[JSngry]

Oh, it's interesting. How much, if any, of it you want to believe is entirely your choice, but it is interesting.

A while back, I found some introductory Masonry literature in a dumpster and of course pulled it out and had a read. Nothing far out, but it was pointing towards "mind power", the ability to develop your mind past that of the average joe. I have no problem with that, but did wonder why you need a "secret" organization to teach that. Historically, yeah, ok, there was a time when science was considered heretical and dangerous (uh, last week, maybe?) so sure, an underground thing was needed. But today, it seems like so much flash-and-bang show. If that's all they're going for.

I have a neighbor who got into Masonry about 10 years ago. He was well into his 40s, maybe his early 50s, so not one of these young guys who do Shriners and all that. He would tell be stuff that he was "learning", and I was like, dude, in the first place, yeah, whatever, I've no doubt about only some of what you're saying, and secondly, you're not supposed to be telling me any of this, right?

And no, he wasn't. And yes, he stopped.

From all I can gather, the higher degrees are all about demonstrated mental discipline as demonstrated through personal service and accomplishment. Now, the term "mental discipline" can mean a lot of things...the "powers of the mind" can take you to some funny places if you let them.

[Big Beat Steve]

24 minutes ago, Brad said:

I never understood that whole Mason thing, with this degree or that degree. 

Don't mind or care too much about masonry. If they want to engage in that, so be it ...
But that Orion Cube thing ... now come on ...

[medjuck]

On 8/21/2018 at 5:58 AM, Fer Urbina said:

There's plenty to be found on Billboard. On the Sep 30, 1957 issue, there's a note saying that Avakian reports to Miller (although Avakian was just months away from leaving Columbia). You may also want to check the August 4, 1956 issue -- it carries a 30-page infomercial about Columbia. Interestingly, Avakian only appears towards the end as "a.&r. director of pop albums". Miller appears as "pop artists & repertoire chief" working under "sales chief, Hal Cook".

F

This may explain Avakian's decision to leave.  BTW Did you find this just by Googling or is there a Billboard website that's searchable? 

[Big Beat Steve]

39 minutes ago, medjuck said:

This may explain Avakian's decision to leave.  BTW Did you find this just by Googling or is there a Billboard website that's searchable? 

You can do this via Google Books.

https://books.google.de/books?id=PCMEAAAAMBAJ&hl=de&source=gbs_all_issues_r&cad=1

E.g. here for a copy from 1955:

https://books.google.de/books?id=PCMEAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA5&hl=de&source=gbs_toc&cad=2#v=onepage&q&f=false

But scrolling through the individual pages and enlarging them piecemeal to find what you are lookng for can be a bit of a pain the you-know-where if you do this for any length of time. 

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

 

ever notice how we went from the long playing record to the compact disc in like 33 years?  the integrated circuit dawg- absolutely developed with back engineering tech recovered in the Roswell crashes.  Ever hear of Roswell?  this stuff really happened you guys. we need to stop burying our heads in the sand, two most significant events of the 1940s: Charlie Parker, and Aliens accidentally crashed their spaceship when their antigravity field was penatrated by one our experimental ultra high voltage radar systems.  I dont want to veer off topic too much here, but this is really important.  this is not pseudo-science, this is 70 years of firsthand accounts.  

[mikeweil]

The problem about believing is, you believe what you want to believe. That goes for science, too.

[Fer Urbina]

On 8/22/2018 at 5:46 PM, medjuck said:

This may explain Avakian's decision to leave.  BTW Did you find this just by Googling or is there a Billboard website that's searchable? 

The Billboard thing, like Big Beat Steve said, through Google Books. Not perfect (sometimes it skips results that are there), but it's free.

As far as I know, Avakian left because he was exhausted from overworking (he got seriously ill towards the end of 1957) and also because he got wind of the difference between the money he was making for Columbia, and what they were paying him.

I wrote this when he died.

F

[medjuck]

Nice appreciation of Avakian.  Thanks so much.    

[Teasing the Korean]

It is interesting to see how Mitch did or did not get involved with pop/jazz crossover projects.  For example, he arranged the (excellent) Other Voices LP for Erroll Garner, certainly a crossover artist at the time.  Mitch was apparently not involved with Johnny Mathis's first jazz LP for Columbia, produced by George Avakian; but after Mitch took over and moved Mathis into more of a pop direction, Mitch wiped the tapes of the unreleased tracks from those early jazz sessions - a full album's worth of tunes. I would love to hear these, but they are gone.  Mitch didn't understand why Tony Bennett wanted to do a jazz-leaning album for his Columbia 12" LP debut, Cloud 7, but allowed him to do so.  My copy of the LP does not credit a producer. 

Edited August 24, 2018 by Teasing the Korean

[medjuck]

1 hour ago, Teasing the Korean said:

 n, Mitch wiped the tapes of the unreleased tracks from those early jazz sessions - a full album's worth of tunes. I would love to hear these, but they are gone.  

Do you know who played on or arranged that one?

[Teasing the Korean]

47 minutes ago, medjuck said:

Do you know who played on or arranged that one?

Teo Macero, Gil Evans, Manny Albam, John Lewis, and Bob Prince are the arrangers on the existing 13 tunes.  Presumably, they are also the arrangers on the other dozen or so that were lost. 

Edited August 24, 2018 by Teasing the Korean

[medjuck]

I didn't realize that they did so many sides during those sessions.  

[Teasing the Korean]

3 minutes ago, medjuck said:

I didn't realize that they did so many sides during those sessions.  

Yes, like 24 or 25.  Do you know the finished album?  It is very good.  

Edited August 24, 2018 by Teasing the Korean

[Ted O'Reilly]

2 hours ago, Teasing the Korean said:

  For example, he arranged the (excellent) Other Voices LP for Erroll Garner, certainly a crossover artist at the time.  

It was my understanding that the arrangements for that project were done by Nat Pierce.  He was also supposed to conduct, but Miller decided he would take over that assignment.

[medjuck]

52 minutes ago, Teasing the Korean said:

Yes, like 24 or 25.  Do you know the finished album?  It is very good.  

Yes, I have it. (With my other Gil Evans cds.) 

[Teasing the Korean]

16 hours ago, Ted O'Reilly said:

It was my understanding that the arrangements for that project were done by Nat Pierce.  He was also supposed to conduct, but Miller decided he would take over that assignment.

You may be right. I unfortunately no longer have the album.  Is Nat Pierce credited?  Either way, Mitch was still involved as conductor.

Machito was briefly with Columbia in the early 1950s.  Mitch plays oboe on this tune.