Duke Pearson - Wahoo master tape found?

[hvbias]

From Music Matters website

"...

This is to announce that we have taken our last walk through the vaults, selecting the final titles for this incredible series to close out the season with a real flourish. What a lineup! We've got 13 titles, handpicked from the best of the best, and one lost master tape that was finally found after thirty years. If they were a baseball team we would compare them to New York's "Murderer's Row" in 1927, Brooklyn's "Boys of Summer" with the '52 Dodgers, or the great "Gas house Gang" from the '34 Cardinals. So here they come, our "Big Blue Machine" from the depths of the Blue Note Vault, one last time, one last game, and then gone forever.

..."

They aren't spelling it out that it is the Wahoo master tape that was found which is what leaves me skeptical given some of their past practices, but it is one of the titles in their latest reissues.

Edited August 18, 2016 by Deepak

[clifford_thornton]

Maybe Eero Koivistoinen's Wahoo...?

[hvbias]

Sorry I shouldn't have mashed the submit thread as fast as I did Figured most people knew the needle drop tape story about Duke Pearson's Wahoo that I could leave out the artist.

[clifford_thornton]

I don't know the story but figured you meant Pearson...

[Rooster_Ties]

Or maybe that one McLean session with Tryone Washington (and Woody Shaw).  Supposedly lost, but a lot more likely "lost" was always my hunch.

[clifford_thornton]

The one with Norman Connors? I thought it was just not very good, not actually gone...

[Rooster_Ties]

1 hour ago, clifford_thornton said:

The one with Norman Connors? I thought it was just not very good, not actually gone...

Yeah, that's been told too.  I'm just remembering an email exchange I had (personally) years ago with Michael C., when he said that McLean/Tyrone tape was actually lost (which I've since always presumed was really "lost").

Edited August 18, 2016 by Rooster_Ties

[jazzbo]

2 hours ago, Rooster_Ties said:

Or maybe that one McLean session with Tryone Washington (and Woody Shaw).  Supposedly lost, but a lot more likely "lost" was always my hunch.

I just don't see Music Matters releasing that one if they found it (if it was really lost).

Edited August 18, 2016 by jazzbo

[Rooster_Ties]

1 hour ago, jazzbo said:

I just don't see Music Matters releasing that one if they found it (if it was really lost).

That's for sure!

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

dawg i thought it was SWEET HONEY BEE that they lost.....

[Kevin Bresnahan]

3 hours ago, chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez said:

dawg i thought it was SWEET HONEY BEE that they lost.....

It was "Sweet Honey Bee" that has a master tape that's a needle drop, not "Wahoo".

[hvbias]

Ugh, sorry about that guys. So this is the their list of reissues. Which one of these is the supposed "found master tape"

[Jay]

On 8/18/2016 at 1:35 PM, Deepak said:

They aren't spelling it out that it is the Wahoo master tape that was found which is what leaves me skeptical given some of their past practices, but it is one of the titles in their latest reissues.

What does this mean?  Are you saying that Music Matters has past practices that one should be skeptical about or Blue Note, the label?  I am not aware of any past practices of Music Matters that would give rise to this.

[JSngry]

If it was "finally found after 30 years", it's only been "missing" since 1986.

[robertoart]

They're probably only releasing Wahoo because it's got Joe Henderson on it. They have avoided any non marquee leader dates pretty much from the get go. The only Organ Lp they released in all their 'forays into the vaults' was Unity, plus Into Something. I'm amazed they are releasing Wahoo. I'm surprised they haven't repackaged it with a different cover as a 'Joe Henderson' Lp. '"For the good of the music and to get this great Jazz music out to a wider listening public'"....sorry for my cynicism. 

[mikeweil]

So the marketplace will be flooded with used copies of the needledrop edition ....

[Kevin Bresnahan]

Let's hope that this "newly discovered master tape" isn't like the time when Music Matters "discovered" the master tape for Lee Morgan's "The Sidewinder".

 

[Jay]

You should not blame Music Matters for anything whatsoever that Steve Hoffmann says.  He was hired for a time to do the work on the initial releases and then summarily dismissed.  Hoffmann didn't find anything nor should he be considered a mouthpiece for anything relating to MM.  I think it speaks volumes that Cuscuna and Ron (and Joe) work closely with respect to the images appearing on the inner covers and they all have a long-standing relationship of working together.

PS Excited for this release!  It is a great record.

Edited August 23, 2016 by Jay
Add PS

[mjzee]

I find it odd that MM is not specifying which album they're referring to.  It's not mentioned in any of the 13 individual album descriptions: https://www.musicmattersjazz.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=116

[Kevin Bresnahan]

2 hours ago, Jay said:

You should not blame Music Matters for anything whatsoever that Steve Hoffmann says.  He was hired for a time to do the work on the initial releases and then summarily dismissed.  Hoffmann didn't find anything nor should he be considered a mouthpiece for anything relating to MM.  I think it speaks volumes that Cuscuna and Ron (and Joe) work closely with respect to the images appearing on the inner covers and they all have a long-standing relationship of working together.

PS Excited for this release!  It is a great record.

No blame intended. Just remember that back in the early days when Hoffman was working with them on "The Sidewinder", they also brought up this "found" master tape.

FWIW, they did find the lost master for Dolphy's "Out To Lunch" and their LP pressings are superb. So there is a chance that they aren't making this up.

[Jay]

1 hour ago, Kevin Bresnahan said:

No blame intended. Just remember that back in the early days when Hoffman was working with them on "The Sidewinder", they also brought up this "found" master tape.

FWIW, they did find the lost master for Dolphy's "Out To Lunch" and their LP pressings are superb. So there is a chance that they aren't making this up.

I would thumbs up this if I could!

 

But yes, I would encourage everyone to take anything that guy has said or says with a grain of salt.  This is the guy that said that Monk played the way he did because he was "literally going insane".  He should not be trusted with Jazz.  He seems to be more of an authority on Bread and Peter Paul and Mary.

 

On the missing tape, looking at the other titles, most of which were done as 45s, the process of elimination seems to suggest that it was Wahoo.  Again, excited.  I am a big fan of this series (obviously).

[hvbias]

On 8/23/2016 at 10:00 PM, Jay said:

What does this mean?  Are you saying that Music Matters has past practices that one should be skeptical about or Blue Note, the label?  I am not aware of any past practices of Music Matters that would give rise to this.

Forget the Hoffman board, just do a search here regarding MM reissues.

How about two huge complaints from the 33 rpm series

Music Matters saying that "print through" is present on the Midnight Blue tape. It's not, it's a pressing issue and you can hear the pre-echo exactly once every revolution. There is no other version of Midnight Blue that has the groove pre-echo including the SACD or hi-res download that came out within years of MM's reissue. Or any other commonly available CD. Music Matters didn't want to scrap a bunch of vinyl and recut it again.

The gross distortion found on Blakey's cymbals on Somethin' Else. Not present on any other version.

Edit: I thought of another one, their dreadful sounding reissue of Newk's Time which Joe Harley says due to Sonny walking around the studio. These are drop outs/damage on the master tape that they were trying to fix, anyone that has listened to this reissue can clearly hear this. Years later Bernie Grundman would confirm it in a video.

Edited August 24, 2016 by Deepak

[Eric]

At least we will be able to get "Ready for Freddy" with the newly found corrected title ... 

I wonder why they are calling it quits?  In retrospect, they were pretty conservative with the titles - and very little from the Liberty era.  Only one Bobby Hutcherson record.  OTOH, they did bring out a number of "Japanese 1st issue" titles - Grant Green was well served in this regard.  

 

[Kevin Bresnahan]

1 hour ago, Eric said:

I wonder why they are calling it quits?  In retrospect, they were pretty conservative with the titles - and very little from the Liberty era.  Only one Bobby Hutcherson record.  OTOH, they did bring out a number of "Japanese 1st issue" titles - Grant Green was well served in this regard.  

How do you make a million dollars selling Jazz records? Start with two million.

[robertoart]

It's true by and large they've done a good job, and at the end of the day they are running a business. They delivered a first class package. I wish they dug the Hammond more, and I'm glad they didn't have a stab at updating the liner notes :-)