Kamasi Washington: NYT Magazine profile

[BFrank]

I'm seeing him next week - one of two sold-out shows. Will report back.

[Scott Dolan]

7 hours ago, Hot Ptah said:

Some Barnes and Noble stores have added significantly to their inventory in the past two years. The Kansas City store on the Plaza had little music selection a few years ago but it has bounced back and now has a decent selection again. I am pleasantly surprised.

I haven't been in that store in many years (probably 6 to 7), but I didn't even recall it having a music section! So it must have been small. 

Edited February 17, 2016 by Scott Dolan

[Hot Ptah]

1 hour ago, Scott Dolan said:

I haven't been in that store in many years (probably 6 to 7), but I didn't even recall it having a music section! So it must have been small. 

The entire basement was music when it opened. The selection in the basement shifted to mostly DVDs and Blu Rays at one point. Now the music section has taken over more of the basement again.

[Scott Dolan]

Aha! I never went down to the basement, so now it makes sense. 

[Hot Ptah]

7 hours ago, JSngry said:

More to the immediate point, though - I buy a "lot" of music, new and used, online and "in person", but if you were to use my consumption at Barnes & Noble as an indicator of anything, you'd think I had the same collection now as I did 4-5 years ago, that I've just gotten old and given up. My wife no doubt wishes it were so, but, sorry baby, when you pick your battles, don't think I don't consider it a blessing from above that you never pick this one.

So, all anybody got to do to get physical product to an audience without resorting to this megachain silliness is just find alternative outlets, where your audience hangs out, and place the product accordingly and proportionately. One thing hasn't changed since the goodolddays - you can still buy records at some unconventional places - I bought some Oum Kalsoum stuff at a freakin' buffet restaurant, came to eat, went home with a feast.

"Independent" anything, start looking there, and the more ethnic- or age- or art- specific it is, look all that much harder. Because a lot of people don't go to Barnes & Noble to get what they want, nor do they really need to. And really - word of mouth and a good server...you can have a hit and nobody will hear about it other than the people who know about it.

Every city is different. I REALLY REALLY did NOT mean to turn this thread into a discussion of the merits of Barnes and Noble when I mentioned that I could not buy Kamasi Washington's "The Epic" there. I used Barnes and Noble as an example ONLY,  of how there is no huge 1970s style promotional campaign behind the album which is catapulting Kamasi Washington into undeserved fame and riches, while more artistically deserving artists continue to struggle. That is not happening if my city is typical.

i should have not mentioned the name of the store where I could not buy "The Epic." I mentioned Barnes and Noble ONLY because it is literally the only brick and mortar store in Kansas City now where you can pop in and buy a current new release on CD. The other brick and mortar stores in Kansas City are used music stores or unique specialty shops reflecting the personality of the owner, who is usually sitting at the cash register. 

I did not mean to even discuss the pros and cons of current Barnes and Noble stores nationwide.

Edited February 17, 2016 by Hot Ptah

[JSngry]

Paramus Barnes & Noble- the one with the big(ger) jazz selection)

765 Route 17 South
Paramus, NJ 07652
201-445-4589

Same thing - I can order for you, but for home delivery only. Although, this guy did say he could "take a chance" on ordering a store copy, but if he did that, he's have to be sure of an almost immediate turnover. But as far as placing an order, prepaid, of course, for store pickup. Nope, couldn't happen.

I don't know what the Paramusstore  is like, but around here, I've seen stock on the B&N shelves that's been there 3-5 years. But at least this guy offered a theoretical possibility of The Epic being on his shelves, even though he didn't act like he wanted it to be. Fear of the unknown, perhaps?

And again, this "I can order it for you to have it delivered to your house:...I can do that myself, why do they think this is something I'm gonna get excited about, them offering to do this for me?

[Scott Dolan]

Some people do not like ordering things online. I was just having a discussion about that with a nice lady who doesn't like ordering things online. And some folks just don't like or "get" the process. 

[paul secor]

I would prefer buying music from a physical store - I enjoy seeing the actual records or CDs and I enjoy the interaction - but since there are no stores in my area with any decent stock, I'm stuck ordering online. In any case, I ain't going to be buying a Kamasi Washington recording.

[Brad]

41 minutes ago, JSngry said:

Paramus Barnes & Noble- the one with the big(ger) jazz selection)

765 Route 17 South
Paramus, NJ 07652
201-445-4589

Same thing - I can order for you, but for home delivery only. Although, this guy did say he could "take a chance" on ordering a store copy, but if he did that, he's have to be sure of an almost immediate turnover. But as far as placing an order, prepaid, of course, for store pickup. Nope, couldn't happen.

I don't know what the Paramusstore  is like, but around here, I've seen stock on the B&N shelves that's been there 3-5 years. But at least this guy offered a theoretical possibility of The Epic being on his shelves, even though he didn't act like he wanted it to be. Fear of the unknown, perhaps?

And again, this "I can order it for you to have it delivered to your house:...I can do that myself, why do they think this is something I'm gonna get excited about, them offering to do this for me?

Why don't you call every one in the nation?

[JSngry]

Because this is anecdotal research, not scientific.

But hey - free long distance, gotta love free long distance, right?

[Dmitry]

Getting back on topic ..

I just watched/listened to The Epic on youtube.

The music is OK, nothing amazing IMHO. I lost interest with it after a while.

There once was a much more original big band with it's leader also dressed unconventionally. It was called the Sun Ra Arkestra.  I am surprised no one here has drawn the parallels between Sun Ra's and Kamasi's acts. Am I off by comparing the two?

Even though I was less than thrilled about the music, I'm glad there's an act like him. It's always good to have the non-jazz listeners exposed to our music. Because all of us were non-jazz listeners once.

 

[Guy Berger]

21 hours ago, Steve Reynolds said:

They stock ultra-obscure ECM issues but not The Epic?!? 

No way some of those odd ECM CDs sell one tenth whatever The Epic is selling

Maybe the audiences for the two are different.  Easy to imagine that some older shoppers (like ECM fans) still like to frequent record stores whereas youngsters (Kamasi fans) do not.  It might simply be that ECM's distribution network is suffering from inefficient inertia.

[Hot Ptah]

30 minutes ago, Dmitry said:

Getting back on topic ..

I just watched/listened to The Epic on youtube.

The music is OK, nothing amazing IMHO. I lost interest with it after a while.

There once was a much more original big band with it's leader also dressed unconventionally. It was called the Sun Ra Arkestra.  I am surprised no one here has drawn the parallels between Sun Ra's and Kamasi's acts. Am I off by comparing the two?

Even though I was less than thrilled about the music, I'm glad there's an act like him. It's always good to have the non-jazz listeners exposed to our music. Because all of us were non-jazz listeners once.

 

I saw Sun Ra live many times. He was very much more creative, unusual and wild in concert. He was out and out strange at times, in a good way. I don't really see the parallels with Kamasi Washington. It would be like saying that some young guy with long hair who plays electric guitar is reminiscent of Frank Zappa live. It is like another universe apart.

[JSngry]

I'm looking for that unconventional clothing myself.

[jazzbo]

Don't really hear a strong Sun Ra "connection" in the music myself. A bit perhaps.

Going to have to spin The Epic again soon. I do like it. So much to listen to!

Edited February 17, 2016 by jazzbo

[Dmitry]

23 minutes ago, Hot Ptah said:

I saw Sun Ra live many times. He was very much more creative, unusual and wild in concert. He was out and out strange at times, in a good way. I don't really see the parallels with Kamasi Washington. It would be like saying that some young guy with long hair who plays electric guitar is reminiscent of Frank Zappa live. It is like another universe apart.

No , I think your Zappa analogy doesn't play here.

Parallels between Kamasi  and Sun Ra:

1.Two large scale orchestras + singers & dancers, playing non-conventional music.

2.Both play original tunes, no standards.

3.Both woodshed-ed, and pretty much lived together with other band members [according to the NYT piece on KW that's what he did/does].

4.Both would draw large non-jazz audiences. For example, I heard Sun Ra on the same bill with the Sonic Youth. 

Those are just the obvious similarities.

[Scott Dolan]

36 minutes ago, Guy Berger said:

Maybe the audiences for the two are different.  Easy to imagine that some older shoppers (like ECM fans) still like to frequent record stores whereas youngsters (Kamasi fans) do not.  It might simply be that ECM's distribution network is suffering from inefficient inertia.

That's an excellent point. As I said earlier, CDs are dinosaurs, so your logic makes perfect sense. It's almost exclusively dinosaurs that are still buying them. 

[Guy Berger]

 

20 minutes ago, Scott Dolan said:

That's an excellent point. As I said earlier, CDs are dinosaurs, so your logic makes perfect sense. It's almost exclusively dinosaurs that are still buying them. 

The corollary of this is that KW could still have good or even great marketing support behind him that's not being wasted on record stores.

Also, related but unlikely (but someone more familiar with the production side of physical media can chime in) - it may be that the CD is selling so well through other distribution channels that there simply isn't enough stock available to supply a random record store.

[BFrank]

I'm a dinosaur and only have the digital version. If the show is good enough, I'll buy the CD at the merch table.

[Brad]

As someone noted, this has focused too much on Barnes & Noble.  In looking for a CD that is probably the last place I'd look.  In its heyday, Borders had -- at least the ones around here -- a pretty good Jazz section (which, as it started to get into financial trouble, shrunk).  Borders' book sections were also much better than Barnes & Noble, which I generally find wanting.  If I wanted to buy a jazz CD, it would be Amazon or CD Universe for me, definitely not B & N.

[Scott Dolan]

Best actual in house selection of Jazz CDs I ever encountered was at Virgin Megastore in Downtown Disney. 

[Brad]

47 minutes ago, Scott Dolan said:

Best actual in house selection of Jazz CDs I ever encountered was at Virgin Megastore in Downtown Disney.

The one in New York city was awesome.  I don't think they're around anywhere.  The same could be said for Tower Records on Broadway.  Incredible selection but sadly just a memory.

[Scott Dolan]

Yeah, Branson shut down the Megastores here in the states about a decade ago, IIRC. But man, I remember stopping in there at 1a.m. on our way back from club hopping City Walk at Universal and just perusing for an hour or so, and taking in the atmosphere. That was at least a monthly occurrence. I'd say close to half of my Coltrane collection came from there. 

[JSngry]

We had two Virgins here, one in Dallas, which was kinda blah on a mega scale, and another one out at the Grapevine Mills outlet mall, which was a freakin'  treasure chest, both in their regular stock and, especially, in their cutout bins, which is apparently where a lot of their "international" inventory went to die (or else be bought by people who said, hey, wtf is THAT cover, i'm buying it even if i can't read one word on it!).

The best record stores for me nowadays are online places like Berkshire Record Outlet, where you get an email saying, ok, we've gotten some new things in, here's a link to what they are, click here, and I don't recognize ANY of it, but this one here sure looks like it will be good, lather, rinse repeat, next thing you know, oh shit, I gotta put some of this back...that's how a real record store operates, by making you put stuff back for the next time, and yes, there will be a next time.

[BFrank]

Posted this morning on FB: "@websterhall was so fun last night!!! Thanks for starting 2016 right for us"

Today he's here in SF doing a sit-down discussion this afternoon and 2 shows tonight! Not sure how he does THAT, but I'll let you know.