Anyone Doing Production w/ Roxio's Toast With Jam?

[RonF]

Basically, I'm too f*cking lazy to read the book.

Thanks!

Edited February 25, 2004 by RonF

[vibes]

Welcome back! Where ya been?

[Brandon Burke]

What are you wanting to know and which version do you have?

[RonF]

What are you wanting to know and which version do you have?

Thanks vibes. Just ricocheting around.

Brandon, Thank you. Well, let's see.....it's version 5, which I understand is the grandpappy version. Since I posted the question, I've made some advances with regard to pause length between tracks and trimming. Next up is adding voice from Pro-tools (and I know damned little about Pro-tools) converting to AIFF or MP3 files into Jam. Have you done that sort of production?

[Jim Alfredson]

I don't know ProTools very well, but wouldn't you export the file from ProTools as an AIFF first and then just burn in Roxio per the norm?

That's how Cubase works... you can build up as many tracks as you want and once you get them mixed right you export the finished mix as a .wav file (pc-land, you know) or an mp3 and then load it into your favorite burning software.

[Brandon Burke]

Toast 6 is brand brand new so that's why I asked. Also, you have Jam which I do not have because it has yet to come in. We ordered it last week. (So I can't answer anything regarding Jam yet.) As far as I can tell, Toast will only accept audio files in AIFF format. At least that is what I noticed while working on a Mac. You will need to "bounce" your audio files "to disk" (this is actually expressed as "bounce to disk" which you may do under the [File] pull-down menu). You will need to do this before you can throw them into Toast for burning. Bouncing to disk is a real-time process so if you've got a number of files it may take a while. Are you doing this already?

Secondly, I suggest coughing up for the Visual Quickstart Guide to Pro Tools. It's very good and very easy to read. All Visual Quickstart Guides are in my opinon. I have one for every software program that I run at work and at home (Pro Tools 6, Photoshop 7, Dreamweaver MX, etc). It might also be who of you to buy a guide to digital audio. The Pohlmann book (link below) is something of a standard among engineers. Often, these kinds of books are exhaustingly long but you can simply use them as reference texts and look up things as you need them. Don't be scared of the Visual Quickstart series, however. They're really well put together and allow you to start from scratch. In fact, they write them so that they're just as helpful regardless of whether you're just beginning or a seasoned pro simply looking up how to something that you've forgotten. Recommended if not essential.

Visual Quickstart Guide to Pro Tools 6

Principles of Digital Audio

TIP: It is never a good idea to burn more than about an hour's worth of material on a CD-R. Your signal will decrease in quality with anything more, regardless of the capabilities of the CD-R (74 min, 80 min, etc). This is a quirk exclusive to CD-R burning that does not manifest itself on consumer grade (i.e. previously recorded) CDs because they are manufactured by an entirely different process.

[Brandon Burke]

Basically, I'm too f*cking lazy to read the book.

You should really read the book, dude.

[RonF]

You should really read the book, dude.

That was more tongue in cheek than serious. You have to read the damn book or you're going nowhere fast. The Visual Guide to ProTools sounds great. I've already read about "bounce to disc". Jim touched on it but (without having experimented yet) I wondered if it was relatively easy to insert an AIFF file from ProTools into a track list in Jam. I'm gathering that it is. Many thanks. To be continued......

[RonF]

Toast 6 is brand brand new so that's why I asked.  Also, you have Jam which I do not have because it has yet to come in.  We ordered it last week.  (So I can't answer anything regarding Jam yet.)  As far as I can tell, Toast will only accept audio files in AIFF format.  At least that is what I noticed while working on a Mac.  You will need to "bounce" your audio files "to disk" (this is actually expressed as "bounce to disk" which you may do under the [File] pull-down menu).  You will need to do this before you can throw them into Toast for burning.  Bouncing to disk is a real-time process so if you've got a number of files it may take a while.  Are you doing this already?

Secondly, I suggest coughing up for the Visual Quickstart Guide to Pro Tools.  It's very good and very easy to read.  All Visual Quickstart Guides are in my opinon.  I have one for every software program that I run at work and at home (Pro Tools 6, Photoshop 7, Dreamweaver MX, etc).  It might also be who of you to buy a guide to digital audio.  The Pohlmann book (link below) is something of a standard among engineers.  Often, these kinds of books are exhaustingly long but you can simply use them as reference texts and look up things as you need them.  Don't be scared of the Visual Quickstart series, however.  They're really well put together and allow you to start from scratch.  In fact, they write them so that they're just as helpful regardless of whether you're just beginning or a seasoned pro simply looking up how to something that you've forgotten.  Recommended if not essential. 

Visual Quickstart Guide to Pro Tools 6

Principles of Digital Audio

TIP: It is never a good idea to burn more than about an hour's worth of material on a CD-R.  Your signal will decrease in quality with anything more, regardless of the capabilities of the CD-R (74 min, 80 min, etc).  This is a quirk exclusive to CD-R burning that does not manifest itself on consumer grade (i.e. previously recorded) CDs because they are manufactured by an entirely different process.

Brandon, It's the burning to disc at real time that poses one problem. Where I am, it's tying up computers for too long. Is there a program that that can record in real time, say - with 2 cds players, can create it's own voice file (no switching back and forth between ProTools), has some editing capability and burns to disc at an accelerated speed? I keep hearing that somthing is out there. Have you received your Jam for Toast 6?

Are you familiar with Bias Peak? I've read mixed reviews. It's either that or something else that boasts of burning to disc at 1/4 real time. I'm also curious about Sound Forge....a PC program.

PS Thank you for the tip on not burning more than an hours worth of time on a CD-R.

[Brandon Burke]

First of all, burning to disc and bouncing to disk are two different things. Bouncing fundmentaly changes the kind of file that you have and changes it into something that a burning software application would recognize. The burning process itself can be done at faster rates (2x, 4x, 8x, etc.) though the faster you go the more you set yourself up for signal loss. This doesn't really matter if you're ripping something onto CD-R for your buddy or for the car but if plan on broadcasting it I might think twice about accelerate burning rates.

Secondly, the bouncing process absolutely has to be realtime. There's no way around it. Similarly, when you capture sound--your initial capture from analog to digital--you can't do it at aa faster rate either. I mean it's just impossible. As for a program that allows for this with two CD players, you can do this if you've already bounced them to disk. The fact remians, however, that you'll still need to bounce them to disk. Your only option, if you want to copy readable/useable files on the fly like that is to buy a stand-alone CD burner; the kind that looks like any other stereo system unit. These things create CDs that are immedyately available for use on CD players. They have to capture whatever they're recording in realtime still (duh) but, once you've got it down then you can use it w/o dealing with Pro Tools etc. And there's no bouncing process to speak of. Many of these units (like the one I have) come equipped with two trays so you can do accelerated burning without tying up your computer.

As for Peak: I'm still learning. Same with jam. We just got it in yesterday. I brought it home to copy it off here but haven't had the change to really goof around with it yet.

[Brandon Burke]

Next up is adding voice from Pro-tools (and I know damned little about Pro-tools) converting to AIFF or MP3 files into Jam.

I forgot to mention this: Saving a Pro Tools file as an AIFF is a breeze. You simply choose [save as] from the [File] pull-down menu and there you go. Within [save as] you have the option of saving your session as a WAV, AIFF.....whatever. You have this same option when you start a new session (on the same pop-up screen where you choose your bit depth, sampling rate, etc).

[Jim Alfredson]

Brandon is right in that Pro Tools does bouncing in real-time. I don't know why. Cubase SX does it much much faster.

The stand-alone option is a good one, but of course you can't really do any editing, which is what you're using Pro Tools for, I assume. If the bouncing time is really an issue I'd research some other software that can do it faster.

[Brandon Burke]

Brandon is right in that Pro Tools does bouncing in real-time. I don't know why. Cubase SX does it much much faster.

The stand-alone option is a good one, but of course you can't really do any editing, which is what you're using Pro Tools for, I assume. If the bouncing time is really an issue I'd research some other software that can do it faster.

So does MOTU Digital Performer. Can't speak for the others.

As for stand alone units, I completely agree. You can't do any EQ tweaking or editing but they do come in handy if you're comfortable with the incoming feed.

[RonF]

Thanks Brandon and Jim. I'm running this info by our engineer. Looks like some research into other software would be a good idea. I'm digesting all of this as I continue to experiment. Thanks again. (to be continued)

[Brandon Burke]

And we're back.......!

So I'm trying to divide an otherwise lengthy track into separate tracks (in Roxio Jam) and I'm having difficulty figuring out how to do this. According to the tech guy on the phone (), all that I need to do is click along the timeline and insert track divisions like one would on, say, Final Cut Pro. The manual, however, says the following....

"An audio file can be parsed into several subsections called regions. Jam can import each region as a seperate track. For example, if you have large unified piece of music (such as a recording of a concert), but you don't want to record the entire piece as a single track on CD, you can separate it into regions, and import it into Jam with zero pause between tracks. Each region becomes a seperate track, but the whole CD will play seamlessly. Jam supports audio file regions in Sound Designer II or Jam Image as used by Peak." (Boldface type is mine.)

So this kind of pisses me off. Roxio specifically said that I could separate tracks using Jam, but now it seems like I actualy need to separate them in Peak--and only Peak?!--first and then import them into Jam; thus, nullifying the reason why I bought Jam in the first place.

Any ideas?

Edited April 2, 2004 by Brandon Burke

[Brandon Burke]

Alright, I figured it out. The Roxio guy was full of shit. Jam does not perform this function on its own.

Here's what actually needs to happen.....

1. Import the file into a third-party editing application (apparently only Sound Designer or Peak).

2. Create regions while in SD/Peak.

3. Save the document in the "Jam Image" format in a designated file.

4. Lastly, open the "Jam Image" file in Jam. (You may also do this by simply dragging the file and dropping into Jam.)