Scott Dolan Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) Nicely said, fass! Edited December 21, 2015 by Scott Dolan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 I thought that "a better place" was where you went when you died? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fasstrack Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 3 minutes ago, JSngry said: I thought that "a better place" was where you went when you died? Oddly enough, I just heard that someone died (not anyone I knew, but still...), so I'm sorry not to be in my usual mood for humorous banter. It no doubt spurred my comments. I do think it better for artists to show some class and let their work speak for itself. The other bullshit just leads to more of the same. As for 'a better place', all I know is the right here, right now. Life is short and music beautiful. It's ours to use or squander. OK, off the pulpit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Sorry that somebody died. I'm sure they're in a better place. As for ego and competitiveness and that shit, hey, that's fine by me as long as it remains aboveboard. It's a basic facet of humanity. Maybe not on the Picard version of the Enterprise, but elsewhere, yeah. Where it goes off the tracks for me is when it gets underhanded, backstabbing, intentional hitting below the belt on and off the record and all that, real harm to lives being done. No respect for that. Otherwise, talk is cheap, but cheap can be fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fasstrack Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 2 minutes ago, JSngry said: cheap can be fun. Yeah, like dark chocolate. But to me it's not only nice to be nice, it's smart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 10 minutes ago, JSngry said: As for ego and competitiveness and that shit, hey, that's fine by me as long as it remains aboveboard. Like comparing Wynton Marsalis to rape, Fascism, and the Taliban? Doesn't strike me as "above the board". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlhoots Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 32 minutes ago, fasstrack said: Personally, I find this public lambasting of fellow artists to be low-class and unnecessary. Honest musical criticism is one thing, in the proper forum. The rest is an ego-fest and it doesn't do a goddamn thing but make the purveyors look like the insecure babies they are. That includes Miles, Wynton, the late Brookmeyer, Jarrett himself (trashed Marsalis w/o provocation). I'm sick to death of it. Art is supposed to make the world a better place IMO. I agree with you. Careful though because the ever thoughtful & sensitive "douche bag" slur has yet to be invoked by those here in charge of the profane & ludicrous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fasstrack Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) I think a Jaki Byard quote may be in order here: (It was said to me when I was mouthing off about somebody years ago, so I don't profess to be an angel). 'Everyone's a big-time critic, but nobody plays shit'. Exact quote, and it took some years and maturity to learn what he meant. Edited December 21, 2015 by fasstrack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 "Douche bag" is not in the vocabulary of a True Sensitive Motherfucker. They lie if they claim otherwise. It's not that I have anything against liars, I once heard Richard Nixon lie in person, in an airplane hanger in Longview, fall of 1972. But Richard Nixon was not a Sensitive Motherfucker. Was he a douche bag? I'll leave that for others to decide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted December 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 To quote Shorty Petterstein, "Art came on the band about three weeks ago..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 And lest I lie unnecessarily, let me correct myself - it was fall of 1970 that I saw Richard Nixon lie in person, in an airplane hanger in Longview. http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=2776 The Mature Sensitive Motherfucker will never lie to you. They may bullshit you 24/7, but they will never lie to you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 6 minutes ago, Larry Kart said: To quote Shorty Petterstein, "Art came on the band about three weeks ago..." Ewwwwww... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted December 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 30 minutes ago, Scott Dolan said: Ewwwwww... Full Petterstein interview (Shorty is Henry Jacobs, the interviewer is Woodrow Leafer). As you can see, I got Shorty's remark about Art a bit wrong.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afdMn8thXnU In a similar vein, an interview with scholar Prof. Sholom Stein (Jacobs is the interviewer, Leafer is Stein). I played this many years ago for a Navy friend of my dad, an anthropologist who taught at Notre Dame. By the end, tears of laughter were running down his face: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKKkRdY0dpc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Did not know that was originally a Fantasy EP, cover and all. Just knew it from the first Lenny Bruce LP. Is there a reason how that happened? The World Pacific album...ever reissued on CD? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted December 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Not reissued on CD apparently. I prize my copy. As for the original Petterstein EP cover mutating into the cover of the LP that contained the Petterstein-Sholom Stein material plus Bruce's first recorded routines, I once had a set-to with some academic who was writing a supposedly (in his mind) definitive essay on Bruce and had based it in part of his assumption that Lenny was responsible for the Petterstein and Sholom Stein interviews. Aside from the fact that he should have recognized that the tone of the Petterstein interview was as unlike that of Lenny as could be -- compare Lenny's routine about the junky joining the Lawrence Welk band -- this guy simply refused to believe that there was such a person as Henry Jacobs, was sure that it was Lenny under a pseudonym and eventually told me I was a liar when I tried to explain who Jacobs was. BTW, haven't listened to it myself yet, but there's a lengthy interview with Jacobs on-line (Jacobs died this September): http://www.kpfahistory.info/conv/conv005_jacobs.mp3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted December 22, 2015 Report Share Posted December 22, 2015 He told you that you were a liar? Like not only was he 100%+ sure about the accuracy of his story, but equally certain about you saying something that you knew was false in every way, that he knew this as well? Whoa... I never knew that that cover was - or that those cuts were - originally on a Fantasy EP until today. There's got to be a story there. Was Fantasy at all initially nervous about Bruce? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted December 22, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2015 1 hour ago, JSngry said: He told you that you were a liar? Like not only was he 100%+ sure about the accuracy of his story, but equally certain about you saying something that you knew was false in every way, that he knew this as well? Whoa... I never knew that that cover was - or that those cuts were - originally on a Fantasy EP until today. There's got to be a story there. Was Fantasy at all initially nervous about Bruce? Don't remember the whole weird exchange that well now, but IIRC my sense of this guy's attitude was that he already was so heavily invested in the theory of Bruce around which he had already built his essay (maybe it already had been published?) and that this theory was a good deal dependent on his mistaken belief that the whole Fantasy LP, and those two mock interviews in particular, was Lenny's work and also crucial to who Lenny was as a comic that he just couldn't give up on the whole edifice he'd built on top of this error. That he also was quite a jerk didn't help. If you recall the Joyce Hatto affair, maybe it was a bit like that. P.S. I won't call out the guy's name right now, but upon checking via Google I see that the piece he wrote was more than 20 pages long, appeared in a prominent academic journal back in 1997, and later was included in a book. As for why Fantasy re-used the EP cover for the LP and threw the Jacobs material and the Bruce material together, I can't say for sure, but I'd guess that they just didn't have an LP's worth of Bruce available at the time Lenny was getting some early recognition and just slapped trogether the old EP cover and two fairly disparate performers in a slapdash manner, not because of nervousness about Bruce. Fantasy had some history of being slapdash. On Mort Sahl's brilliant initial Fantasy album "Sahl at Sunset" (at least I think it was his first) they significantly speeded up the concert tape to get all of it onto the LP. Mort, who thus sounds like he was on benzadrine that night (this not necessarily to the detriment of his work, I think) was furious at what Fantasy had done, and I think he successfuly sued to get the album suppressed. Too bad because, again, it's brilliant. If you have any taste for Sahl and see a copy, grab it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quasimado Posted December 22, 2015 Report Share Posted December 22, 2015 Bit hard to hear the group behind Shorty P. - Brookmeyer is certainly there. Ted Gioia says it's the Stan Getz band of the time with Bob playing "Have You Met Miss Jones". Q Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 https://youtu.be/HUQrIuzRH7U Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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