Lee Morgan At The Both/And Club June 1970

[Eric]

I once had some of this material on a Trip 2-LP set.  How does the Fresh Sound compare - does it have better sound?  I remember the music having a nice kind of energy, but Lee was low in the mix.

My take on the new CD is that he is slightly lower in the mix than say Maupin or Mabern, but not terribly so.  All-in-all sound quality is quite acceptable to me.

I have the FS CD - have not gone back to compare.

Edited August 3, 2015 by Eric

[Dan Gould]

Let me go out on a limb and suggest that Eric meant to say "but not terribly so".

It's been a while and I really should pull out this music again but my recollection tracks with everybody else - acceptable sound, better than a lot of these types of recordings.  And great music.

[Eric]

Let me go out on a limb and suggest that Eric meant to say "but not terribly so".

It's been a while and I really should pull out this music again but my recollection tracks with everybody else - acceptable sound, better than a lot of these types of recordings.  And great music.

LOL, yes and correct, thanks

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

Are we any nearer to conclusively finding the origin of this music?

as in where the source material is for this, would love to know...

[SemperFam]

This post is a bit older and I'm new to the set so please forgive any rookie errors. I've got awesomely clarifying news with PROOF for all of you. No offense to anyone and I'm just sharing what I know, as I understand it from the sources and material I have. 

My late Father Hammond Hero and Producer George Semper along with Oliver Moss, recorded the sessions at the Both/And Club. They recorded 5 Lee Morgan Quintet Songs (see reels) including ~ The Chief, Neophilia, See Autumn, Something Like This, and Willow Weep For Me. What struck me about the release that's referred to from Hi-Hat is missing "The Chief" and others which I have. 

At the time, Oliver was involved with programming at KSOL in San Francisco and they recorded this session for live broadcast. According to Oliver they "Micd up the stage, and ran two stereo phone lines from the club to the station." That's why Lee and some sound seems distant.

The best part? THEY WERE GIVEN THE ANALOG REELS! The even better part? I own them including this very recording. For now here is a sample I actually need to make some serious updates on the watermark ( I used a generic one) and also, the video for this one was not recorded when we transferred the analog reel to WAV. I used this to share what I had prepared at the time, and am updating with the full track and new watermark.

Can't tell you how much I appreciate the opportunity to share with you Vets who know what's up since none of my folks get very excited about this incredible piece of history in my possession 8-) 

FYI...at the time my Father was working extensively with A&M Records, and used their crossed out letterhead on the reel notes. Also the date on the reel notes is inaccurate. I can't upload here because of size constraints but if you download the reel images you can zoom in for detail.

ENJOY!

 

 

Edited May 7, 2017 by SemperFam
clarified material and typo

[sidewinder]

Wow !

[brownie]

What Sidewinder said!

 

Thanks for sharing!!

 

More! More!

[mjzee]

Sounds great!

[SemperFam]

Hey Guys,

When I restored, baked, and transferred my Pop's 140+ Master reel vault (20% are transferred to WAV) I realized I needed an easy safe way to archive, metadata, and share with folks. The most significant part of that effort is to preserve my Family History and his Legacy.

I created the George Semper Music Archive and in that spirit, I thought you guys might enjoy sharing in it so here is som weekend FUN FOR YOU! 

http://georgesemper.life/res/?c=58&k=d205d4b706

Enjoy! Keep in mind the link is good for a limited time!

SemperFam

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

so is that why this release got the name "see autumn" (instead of Ceora), in 1980?  so these are the same tapes TRIP used then?

 

[sidewinder]

Fascinating - I remember seeing that 'See Autumn' LP in the racks.

According to discogs that one was put out on a label called Picadilly - but maybe that was part of the Trip bootleg 'family'?

Edited May 9, 2017 by sidewinder

[Dan Gould]

On 5/7/2017 at 8:08 AM, SemperFam said:

This post is a bit older and I'm new to the set so please forgive any rookie errors. I've got awesomely clarifying news with PROOF for all of you. No offense to anyone and I'm just sharing what I know, as I understand it from the sources and material I have. 

My late Father Hammond Hero and Producer George Semper along with Oliver Moss, recorded the sessions at the Both/And Club. They recorded 5 Lee Morgan Quintet Songs (see reels) including ~ The Chief, Neophilia, See Autumn, Something Like This, and Willow Weep For Me. What struck me about the release that's referred to from Hi-Hat is missing "The Chief" and others which I have. 

At the time, Oliver was involved with programming at KSOL in San Francisco and they recorded this session for live broadcast. According to Oliver they "Micd up the stage, and ran two stereo phone lines from the club to the station." That's why Lee and some sound seems distant.

The best part? THEY WERE GIVEN THE ANALOG REELS! The even better part? I own them including this very recording. For now here is a sample I actually need to make some serious updates on the watermark ( I used a generic one) and also, the video for this one was not recorded when we transferred the analog reel to WAV. I used this to share what I had prepared at the time, and am updating with the full track and new watermark.

Can't tell you how much I appreciate the opportunity to share with you Vets who know what's up since none of my folks get very excited about this incredible piece of history in my possession 8-) 

FYI...at the time my Father was working extensively with A&M Records, and used their crossed out letterhead on the reel notes. Also the date on the reel notes is inaccurate. I can't upload here because of size constraints but if you download the reel images you can zoom in for detail.

ENJOY!

 

 

Have you approached Blue Note to gauge interest in a release? How much music do you actually have on the reel(s)?

(of course I realize Blue Note might not be interested but I imagine they'd have to sign off if Lee was a BN artist at the time, then you could move on to Resonance or maybe Uptown as a way to get this music to the public. Unless of course you're just teasing us ...

[bertrand]

Mr. Semper,

I sent you a private message.

Bertrand.

 

[SemperFam]

On 5/9/2017 at 7:05 PM, chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez said:

Would't dare tease Dr. Funkenstein! See Autumn, Something Like This, Willow Weep for Me E X T E N D E D ALL coming soon! Join the archive for unfettered digital reel diggin!

 

 

 

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

hey i still dont understand exactly what were lookin at here, are these what Trip et al used or is this a separate recording of the same stuff?

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

I dont know what to say.  dog you and we all know this stuff "worth it" but how to we hear it all in a way the benefits you and us, can you charge for downloads and not have to hire estate lawyers if you release it all with "copyright george semper".  when the guy w/ the rare genesis video from 1970 approached tony smith/hit n run a few yrs back and wanted a million bucks for it, genesis passed.    you probably werent askin a million bucks im just relating that.  i wish this could be beneficial for you.  as owner of this stuff you deserve to be rewarded if you let us hear it.  OH WHAT ABOUT THIS:::::::: WHAT IF YOU MANUFACTURE THE CDS    *****IN EUROPE*****...........would that circumvent having to hire estate lawyers

[jazzbo]

On June 30, 2017 at 0:40 PM, SemperFam said:

Dan Thank You! I have approached one of these three and they passed.

They thought it would not be profitable for them. Whats nuts is this collection is not only the source of all the other Both/And Club releases BUT also never released as a collection. The most recent weaker material (Hi-Hat) is drownding out the merchants on the "Mother". Disgusting. Moving right along....THESE REELS ARE AVAILABLE to any label or private party who is interested.

Most of my archive is Soul, Funk, RB and I need funds to continue transferring 140 reels! I'm incredibly flexible and want to see the reels find a "good home" which will value the material vs. McDonalds type enterprises. (Yuck)...I've utter disdain for lack of vision so if you challenged find a corner

For good measure I'll throw in Gene Jug Ammons (Both/And - unreleased) one song, and unreleased Jimmy Smith.

Semper,

Did you approach Resonance Records?  I am pretty certain they would be interested. If need help you can PM me or email me at lonjazz@yahoo.com and I'll try to get you in contact with the producer Zev Feldman that seems to be spear-heading the Resonance releases. . . . 

[Dan Gould]

Resonance turned him down. Next up is Blue Note and Uptown and maybe Jordi since he's put out archival things also, like the Carmell Jones set.

[jazzbo]

Okay. 

[SemperFam]

On 5/9/2017 at 3:04 AM, Dan Gould said:

Have you approached Blue Note to gauge interest in a release? How much music do you actually have on the reel(s)?

(of course I realize Blue Note might not be interested but I imagine they'd have to sign off if Lee was a BN artist at the time, then you could move on to Resonance or maybe Uptown as a way to get this music to the public. Unless of course you're just teasing us ...

Jazzbo,

Dan is correct but here's the thing. I do not think I have a good e-mail for Blue Note, definitely nothing that would reach Mr. Was or Mr. Eli Wolf. This is what I have can anyone help me out - message me - with a direct email? "emiclassics@emimusic.com".

Guys I soo want to see this released. It's important man it's the True reels and the sounds...I wish I could share WAV with you here. I will eventually IF everyone turns me down, we'll just set it FREE!!!

[Rooster_Ties]

Uptown, maybe, perhaps.

But I cannot see Blue Note releasing this material, I'm afraid, unless it was download-only perhaps.  There were quite a number of other unissued takes from the same nights as the already 3CD release of live material by this band. It would seem unlikely that BN would release other material by this same band (same year), unless they had already exhausted what they already had in their own archives.

Don't mean to be negative, I just wouldn't chase the Blue Mote option until my dying day.

[Kevin Bresnahan]

E-mail Michael Cuscuna at Mosaic Records. He'll likely help you get in touch with the right people at Blue Note.

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

let me go back a ways do these lee morgan reels contain music not heard on the previously released versions of both/and material?  I have this stuff spread on in various ways.

 

---The Fresh sound CD set....which contains an extra Ceora, however most of the cd set is availble spread across 3 lps on TRIP: "ONE OF A KIND" ////  ""A DATE WITH LEE MORGAN""" ///// ""SPEEDBALL""

 

[bertrand]

I still haven't figure out what the 5th track is.

[bertrand]

Nor whether the Fresh Sound set is from the Both/And. The reference to Howard Rumsey is not a clue one way or the other.

The Chief and Meofelia are the same song. Why are BOTH listed on the tape reels? The 3 bootleg CDs have either one or the other, not both. Has NO ONE noticed this discrepancy yet? I'm going nuts here.