John Surman

[Milestones]

I’ve been getting into John Surman lately. He made a big contribution to McLaughlin’s Extrapolation. I recently picked up The Amazing Adventures of Simon Simon, a duet with Jack DeJohnette, and I love that one. I’ve heard Brewster’s Rooster, and his fine contributions to Abercrombie’s November.

I know he has worked a lot in a more ''European" vein...a lot of associations with ECM.

I find he is a quite a master of the big horn (baritone); the straight, high one (soprano); the bass clarinet; and other stuff. As far as overdubbing goes, he strikes me as the best in jazz.

Edited February 5, 2015 by Milestones

[A Lark Ascending]

Huge, huge catalogue to mine in many different approaches. Much of his recent work is solo (with overdubs) or unusual, almost classical collaborations.

If you want the Surman of Extrapolation the things by The Trio from the 70s are probably the nearest - fiery, abstract improvisation.

But it's worth remembering that he is also drawn to folk music and choral music - that side of his personality often comes out in a way that doesn't always appeal to jazz listeners.

One of the most exciting concerts I ever heard was Surman's occasional quartet with Chris Laurence, John Taylor and John Marshall. You can hear that combination on what is probably my favourite Surman disc:

Edited February 5, 2015 by A Lark Ascending

[clifford_thornton]

I guess I go for The Trio and before, so including the Deram LPs, the music with John Warren's big band, and of course sideman turns with Skidmore, Westbrook et al. That Jazz in Britain '68-'69 LP is also really nice and readily available on disc.

[Alexander Hawkins]

I really love this early stuff too - out on Cuneiform.

Also, for a bit of a rarity...

[mjazzg]

Where to start?

Surman seems to fit any sized grouping in which he performs and always stamps his personality on the session one way or another. He has an instantly recognisable sound on whatever horn (or tin whistle) he plays. I think Bev nails it when he mentions the importance of folk and choral music. I'm listening to his duo album with Howard Moody playing church organ 'Rain on the Window' and it perfectly encapsulates the manner in which he seamlessly fuses his influences. I'd suggest that for someone regarded a Jazz musician he's made relatively few straight ahead Jazz albums.

i'm very fond of his solo recordings and I think those that explicitly reference his South-Western roots seem very personal works - 'Road to St Ives', 'Rev Absalom Dawe', 'Saltash Bells'. I also really like the quartet with Oxley, Bley and Peacock.

In concert, The Brass Project with John Warren was one of the most exciting concerts I've attended and his solo concerts some of the most intimate (even in a large space)

There's so much else. SOS and his larger band recordings in the 70s, his work with Westbrook. In fact just the recordings from what we might call the pre-ECM years stand alone as a very impressive statement. I'm sure others who enjoyed these as they were realised will chime in with more informed appreciation than I can give.

Live he is one of the most self-effacing and humble musicians I've seen and always seems genuinely surprised by the positive reaction his playing generates. He also has a great sense of humour.

You may have guessed by now, I'm a fan

[clifford_thornton]

yeah that NDR band stuff that Cuneiform released is excellent. the DVD with studio footage is amazing. People don't talk much about Erich Kleinschuster, do they?

[colinmce]

I love John Surman in all his varied incarnations (and there are many)

I'd recommend grabbing the tremendous :rarum compilation from ECM and unfurling the albums from there. I mentioned in another recent thread how much I like his solo work from the 80s, though it may come across as dated to some.

[mjazzg]

I really love this early stuff too - out on Cuneiform.

Also, for a bit of a rarity...

Wish i could make it to Southampton to see you play with him. It's got be great, hasn't it? Are the Beeb recording it do you know?

[Homefromtheforest]

Yup all of the above and I'd also recommend some of the albums with his wife Karin Krog such as "cloud line blue", "Nordic quartet", "open space", and "such winters of memory".

[Alexander Hawkins]

I really love this early stuff too - out on Cuneiform.

Also, for a bit of a rarity...

Wish i could make it to Southampton to see you play with him. It's got be great, hasn't it? Are the Beeb recording it do you know?

Sorry not to catch you! I don't think it's being recorded...

...but tell you what - I'm just on the computer for 10 minutes having a break from practising some of the tunes...what a writer too...can't wait!

[mjazzg]

....and I'm eagerly awaiting the arrival of the new Mike Osborne archival release 'Dawn' [on Cuneiform] which features JS at the tender age of 21 in what I believe is his first recording (apart for the boy soprano recordings)

[A Lark Ascending]

This is another overlooked record - Tales of the Algonquin gets all the attention but I prefer this. Some of his Thomas Hardy pieces here - definitely has that link with early 20thC English music.

And a couple of superb sideman dates:

Special mention for his central role in Westbrook's Citadel Room 315 - Outgoing Song especially. The latter was the theme music of one of the BBC jazz programmes in the late 70s - possibly Jazz on 2 on Sunday nights.

Edited February 5, 2015 by A Lark Ascending

[clifford_thornton]

Yup all of the above and I'd also recommend some of the albums with his wife Karin Krog such as "cloud line blue", "Nordic quartet", "open space", and "such winters of memory".

Open Space is a nice one indeed. Was out on MPS back in the day, not sure if it's on disc or not.

[Milestones]

Good to see plenty of fans.

Certainly Surman has his own set of very distinctive roots, and I agree that he 's made relatively few straight-ahead jazz records. But I find his difference and his eclecticism appealing.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Milestones

[sidewinder]

I guess I go for The Trio and before, so including the Deram LPs, the music with John Warren's big band, and of course sideman turns with Skidmore, Westbrook et al. That Jazz in Britain '68-'69 LP is also really nice and readily available on disc.

Talking of the Surman/Warren 'Tales of the Algonquin', it is being performed at the Southampton event this weekend with Surman (very rare), really looking forward to it. On the previous day he will be performing with his quartet in a separate show with Alex H. on piano, so it will be a major Surman-Fest.

I'll have to get hold of that 'Brass Project'. Another one which is a monster is that CD plus DVD of the NDR session with Skidmore, Kenny Wheeler etc and which kicks off with 'Once Upon A Time'.

For my money, Surman is one of the greatest musicians to ever come out of this country. At a time when most were following the Gerry Mulligan influence, he took Harry Carney as the starting point and went with it.

Edited February 6, 2015 by sidewinder

[sidewinder]

Special mention for his central role in Westbrook's Citadel Room 315 - Outgoing Song especially. The latter was the theme music of one of the BBC jazz programmes in the late 70s - possibly Jazz on 2 on Sunday nights.

It was indeed. Wasn't it one of Charles Fox's Radio 3 shows though - 'Jazz Today'? That show also used a track from Henry Lowther 'Child Song' for a while too.

As an aside, 'Jazz Journal' has an obituary this month of Peter Russell, who used to run the 'Hot Record Store' in Plymouth, home town of Surman. It mentions that JS was in there a lot as a youngster, almost his second home apparently..

Edited February 6, 2015 by sidewinder

[sidewinder]

Also, for a bit of a rarity...

Wow ! Didn't know of that one.

[soulpope]

yeah that NDR band stuff that Cuneiform released is excellent. the DVD with studio footage is amazing. People don't talk much about Erich Kleinschuster, do they?

depends on the people you`re talking to .....

[A Lark Ascending]

Special mention for his central role in Westbrook's Citadel Room 315 - Outgoing Song especially. The latter was the theme music of one of the BBC jazz programmes in the late 70s - possibly Jazz on 2 on Sunday nights.

It was indeed. Wasn't it one of Charles Fox's Radio 3 shows though - 'Jazz Today'? That show also used a track from Henry Lowther 'Child Song' for a while too.

Suspect you are right - I get muddled. Stan Sulzmann's 'On Loan with Gratitude' and Loose Tubes' 'Yellow Hill' were also used on those programmes for a while. But which was which!

Here's another great sideman record:

Contains a version of my favourite Surman tune, the downward spiralling 'Tess'. Also on 'Stranger than Fiction'.

I once read an interview where Surman, usually the most gracious of commentators, mentioned how he did not remember his teaming with Vitous with affection (don't think the music was the problem).

[sidewinder]

Great concert at Turner-Sims last night. Surman in superb form - have seen him quite a few times over the years and really can't recall hearing him play better. Like all great jazz players, he has a truly unique sound. For this concert, concentrated on baritone and soprano and it was good to hear some really good, strong workouts on the big horn. The band were stunning too, very reactive to each other and they gelled very well with the Surman style.

Nice to hear them do 'Where Fortune Smiles' and a lovely version of Coltrane's ballad 'Central Park West' as the well-deserved encore.

Before the concert he said that he had jetted in after a 12 hour journey from Oslo and was pretty well 'wiped' but you would never guess it from the amount of energy on show. Very impressive considering the very limited rehearsal opportunity.

Edited February 8, 2015 by sidewinder

[A Lark Ascending]

Thanks for the review, Sidewinder. Would have like to have been there.

Back in November he did a few live pieces with pianist Steve Hamilton on the Jazz Record Requests broadcast from the Barbican. Included an astonishing solo rumination on Round Midnight. Still firing on all cylinders.

[sidewinder]

Yes, he's in great form at the moment - in past concerts I recall there was quite a lot of bass clarinet and synth but nothing on either of those last night. Really glad that he stretched out on the baritone in particular, although the soprano work was equally stunning. I have to also say that they did a grand job with the acoustics at the Turner-Sims too. What a fine venue it is.

Really looking forward to 'Tales of the Algonquin' later today, with John Warren on piano.

Edited February 8, 2015 by sidewinder

[A Lark Ascending]

Rub it in!

(One of those smiley things)

[sidewinder]

Rub it in!

I promise to keep 'shtumm' after 'Tales of the Algonquin'

[soulpope]

Great concert at Turner-Sims last night. Surman in superb form - have seen him quite a few times over the years and really can't recall hearing him play better. Like all great jazz players, he has a truly unique sound. For this concert, concentrated on baritone and soprano and it was good to hear some really good, strong workouts on the big horn. The band were stunning too, very reactive to each other and they gelled very well with the Surman style.

Nice to hear them do 'Where Fortune Smiles' and a lovely version of Coltrane's ballad 'Central Park West' as the well-deserved encore.

Saw him playing this in the early eighties as he was part of the "touring edition" of Jack DeJohnette`s New Directions feat Arthur Blythe and Peter Warren....

Edited February 8, 2015 by soulpope