Late Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 ... the fiery, keening, naked quality of Jackie's sound. It's just so pure and intense. So youthful, really, a sort of swaggering Romeo. Nice description. There is a certain amount of swagger in the Prestige dates, whereas in the Blue Note sessions I hear a more concentrated effort to stretch boundaries, which results in a greater level of seriousness. Of Jackie's Blue Notes, I've always thought Jackie's Bag was under-examined. Some of the very best Sonny Clark on record there — some of the hippest comp figures I've heard. I've also wondered if the cover art were different — say, with an actual photo of Jackie — if the record itself would receive more attention. I guess Francis Wolff was not a fan of that cover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjzee Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 I'd like to hear Jackie's two Jubilee dates in great sound. I have them on a Roulette two-fer called "Tune Up" that's in reprocessed stereo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Posted November 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 I'd like to hear Jackie's two Jubilee dates in great sound. Kind of nit-picky, but doesn't Jackie only have one date on Jubilee (i.e. Fat Jazz)? I thought his debut was on Ad Lib, and then later reissued on Jubilee. (So, I guess there are two Jubilee dates.) At any rate, I agree with your statement. I have his debut session on a 1983 Japanese compact disc (the price printed on the tray card at 3500¥!) with the owl cover ... on Roulette. The sound is actually quite good. I have Fat Jazz on a Japanese SBCJ mini-LP edition. The sound is compressed like crazy, but with the volume turned down, it doesn't sound awful. Both sessions would benefit from a careful remaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clunky Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 The Ad-Lib date sounds no better or worse than most of the prestige sides. I quite like it. I've only heard Fat Jazz on Spotify and thought that both the sound and music were poor. The CD edition I have is TOCJ 50151 from Japan (2006). Sound is reasonable. Bass is pretty thin but there's no unpleasant shrillness , very listenable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlhoots Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 I'd like to hear Jackie's two Jubilee dates in great sound. I have them on a Roulette two-fer called "Tune Up" that's in reprocessed stereo. I have both on Japanese mini-LP style CD issues. They're fine for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluesnik Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 So I suppose people don't get too enthusiastic about his dates for Jubilee (particularly "Fat Jazz") either? I heard it first before finding out about its place in McLean's opus but found it very nice to listen to. I have that plus Presenting Jackie McLean (with Donald Byrd, Mal Waldron, Doug Watkins and Ronald Tucker) on Ad Lib, which was a Japanese facsimile mini LP and I like them both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felser Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 So I suppose people don't get too enthusiastic about his dates for Jubilee (particularly "Fat Jazz") either? I heard it first before finding out about its place in McLean's opus but found it very nice to listen to. I have that plus Presenting Jackie McLean (with Donald Byrd, Mal Waldron, Doug Watkins and Ronald Tucker) on Ad Lib, which was a Japanese facsimile mini LP and I like them both. I like them fine, certainly on par with most of the Prestige dates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Friedman Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 (edited) I was a relatively young jazz listener when I recall finding a copy of the original Ad Lib Jackie McLean LP in a small shop in Detroit. It had just been released. I liked it a lot then, and still do today though I now have a CD copy. Not long after I acquired the original McLean Prestige LPs as each one was issued. The intensity of Jackie's playing was something that thrilled me. My three favorite Prestige sessions by Jackie are - Lights Out - Jackie McLean & Co. - Jackie's Pal. I do also enjoy the other Prestige recordings by Jackie McLean as both leader and sideman. McLean was one of the first jazz musicians for whom I wanted to acquire every single album on which he appeared. I prefer the Prestige albums to those on Steeplechase, and I get as much pleasure from them as i do with most of the Blue Note sessions. Edited November 27, 2014 by Peter Friedman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted November 28, 2014 Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 Not that big on McLean's Prestiges either, I'm afraid ... but always found "Lights Out" pretty nice, what with Elmo Hope ... But I agree with JSngry's wish for a box set - would indeed be an interesting way to re-evaluate all of this material. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clunky Posted November 28, 2014 Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 spinning OJC issues of 4,5, and 6 and Alto Madness this evening. Both excellent with the former just nosing ahead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenLowe Posted November 28, 2014 Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 (edited) Chuck is essentially right about the drug thing/red herring; but it is true that McLean very specifically (at least when I knew him) didn't want to talk much about those days; his thought was that Weinstock had taken advantage of the drug problems of these musicians and had gotten them to record for very little. Of course one might say it wasn't Weinstock's responsibility to make sure their lives were in order. He offered, they accepted. And McLean is absolutely brilliant in those years, providing, inadvertently or not, an emotional template for a lot of post-bop saxophonists (as Larry has implied). and as for taking financial advantage, Dolly made sure he worked with young guys whom he did not have to pay much. So I guess he learned from that business model.... Edited November 28, 2014 by AllenLowe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted November 28, 2014 Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 I'd like to hear Jackie's two Jubilee dates in great sound. Kind of nit-picky, but doesn't Jackie only have one date on Jubilee (i.e. Fat Jazz)? I thought his debut was on Ad Lib, and then later reissued on Jubilee. (So, I guess there are two Jubilee dates.) yeah, correct. The Ad Lib pressing is extremely rare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewHill Posted November 29, 2014 Report Share Posted November 29, 2014 Mcleans scene is a fav just because it really shows his erupt style in the prestige era: flawed brutal and brilliant all wrapped up in a sleeve photo that really shows his state: wicked package n a wicked date. 456 is a near top fav too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Head Man Posted November 29, 2014 Report Share Posted November 29, 2014 (edited) But I agree with JSngry's wish for a box set - would indeed be an interesting way to re-evaluate all of this material. Several years ago I created my own boxset of his Prestige recordings, in session order. Can't say it improved my understanding of his playing at that time but it was certainly an intense listening experience. Whenever I now listen to these recordings, which isn't often, I play them by album. My favourite has always been "4, 5 and 6". I much prefer his Blue Note recordings; "Let Freedom Ring" and "Destination Out" and "One Step Beyond" are wonderful. Edited November 29, 2014 by Head Man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Posted November 29, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 29, 2014 Several years ago I created my own boxset of his Prestige recordings, in session order. I did the same thing. I tried listening that way, and then went back to the (random?) Weinstock order. The only "session order" date that I continue to listen to is the February 15, 1957 (the "Arthur Phipps" session) date that was spread over multiple records. Great playing there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted November 30, 2014 Report Share Posted November 30, 2014 I've always loved the Prestige years, particularly A Long Tall Drink. It just seems that his BN years have drawn more attention, maybe because it was at an earlier point of his career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjzee Posted December 1, 2014 Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 Let's not forget this almost magical pairing with Art Farmer: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Posted December 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 Let's not forget this almost magical pairing ... Nor the one-record effort of Ferris Benda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Head Man Posted December 1, 2014 Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 Let's not forget this almost magical pairing ... Nor the one-record effort of Ferris Benda. This is his Prestige Records thread....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjzee Posted December 1, 2014 Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 Let's not forget this almost magical pairing ... Nor the one-record effort of Ferris Benda. This is his Prestige Records thread....... It's evolved into Jackie's 50's thread, to compliment the 60's and 70's-and-beyond threads. Having said that, "Ferris Benda" must be one of those cool, inside references I don't know about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Kart Posted December 1, 2014 Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 "Ferris Benda" was Jackie's pseudonym on this RCA Jazz Messengers album: http://www.allmusic.com/album/a-night-in-tunisia-1957-mw0001986964 no doubt because he was under contract to Prestige. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjzee Posted December 1, 2014 Report Share Posted December 1, 2014 Ah, OK. I have this on a Collectables twofer, where the cover is reproduced so small that I'd never noticed before. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 The only "session order" date that I continue to listen to is the February 15, 1957 (the "Arthur Phipps" session) date that was spread over multiple records. Great playing there.Ok, so it's not just me, then. Try reconstructing that into what appears to be recording order...mindblowing..And whatever became of Mr. Phipps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Posted October 22, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Still haven't wrapped my head around the concept of living in a world where wearing a tie was something you did without thinking about it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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