Ingrid Laubrock

[David Ayers]

We must all now admire Ingrid Laubrock. Although Ingrid appears on Illusionary Sea, I only investigated her after I read an unhelpful review of her Zürich Concert in Downbeat this summer. By happy coincidence I was able to hear her tonight with Haste trio (Veryan Weston, Hannah Marshall) tonight. Oh my goodness. The most amazing tone throughout the tenor and a huge bag of original ideas. She is a real great and a must-hear. This was the first gig in a UK tour alongside Lauren Kinsella/Chris Batchelor/Liam Noble. I suggest UK-ites google forthwith to check for a gig near you. The tour ends at Oto on 9 October. Don't say I didn't tell you.

[johnblitweiler]

she is certainly one of the very best tenor saxophonists in jazz these days - she creates symphonies as she improviseds

[Steve Reynolds]

I just switched plans for this Saturday night from the Ches Smith shows to Capricorn Climber which features Ingrid

My experience is that he continues to get better and it helps that she is pushed by all the great musicians she plays with very regularly.

With this band the last time I saw them in the spring she was NOT overwhelmed by the viola player which is a huge deal.

Last time I saw her with Mary Halvorsen and Tom Rainey, she was damn near great.

Edited October 2, 2014 by Steve Reynolds

[xybert]

I've heard her on other people's albums but haven't heard anything by her as a leader/co-leader. Any suggestions? I'm guessing that Anti-House would be most up my alley; Paradoxical Frog and the Rainey Trio don't really appeal based on what they sound like in my head although i should really give them a try.

[Leeway]

I really do like Paradoxical Frog, especially as a starting place, especially the first album (with the green frog). Then either of the Anti-House albums. I also really like the duo album with Rainey on Relative Pitch, "And Other Desert Town." I happen to like sax-drums duos generally, but I find this one so fluid, conversational, and yet full of ideas; might want to give it a try.

Edited October 2, 2014 by Leeway

[xybert]

Cheers. Kind of regretting not including the duo with Rainey when i placed an order with Relative Pitch recently (ordered the new Halvorson and the recent Mat Shipp trio). I'm long overdue to give Laubrock a decent listen but i'm getting there... will look to get the Paradoxical Frog album if/when i do a clean feed order next.

[jlhoots]

Great soprano saxophone player too.

[CraigP]

To jlhoots point, I love her on tenor but she's got a distinctive style on soprano as well, which is a horn that can make some players sound anonymous.

[clifford_thornton]

That DB review of Zurich Concert was surprisingly lukewarm. I like the disc a lot, but I was even more floored by the ensemble live (with Alessi on trumpet). I don't think her compositions are quite as "undercooked" as certain reviewers make them out to be.

And more importantly, her playing is rigorous and individualistic (again, I've noticed people calling her a "Tony Malaby clone" - imo, far from reality), and getting warmer by the day. Anti-House and Sleepthief are both excellent bands, with the former perhaps her most successful vehicle for writing and improvisation. I look forward to continually hearing what she comes up with.

[colinmce]

I think people underestimate just how much her playing is invested in small gestures, which is something I like about it. I think a lot of people sort of cram her into a more extroverted box than she belongs in. I'd love to hear a recording of the trio with Tom Rainey and Dan Peck:

xybert, maybe you'll be put off by Paradoxical Frog, maybe not. This is my favorite context to hear her in, but the Anti-House albums are awesome, too.

[Steve Reynolds]

That DB review of Zurich Concert was surprisingly lukewarm. I like the disc a lot, but I was even more floored by the ensemble live (with Alessi on trumpet). I don't think her compositions are quite as "undercooked" as certain reviewers make them out to be.

And more importantly, her playing is rigorous and individualistic (again, I've noticed people calling her a "Tony Malaby clone" - imo, far from reality), and getting warmer by the day. Anti-House and Sleepthief are both excellent bands, with the former perhaps her most successful vehicle for writing and improvisation. I look forward to continually hearing what she comes up with.

I don't think she sounds like Malaby in the least nor is her approach at all similar.

I'm not yet impressed by her soprano playing but I'm rarely impressed by anyone's soprano playing outside of the usual well known great soprano players. I do like that she uses the straight horn as a supplement and doesn't use it when it doesn't need to be used.

In that way it would be a similarity to Malaby.

Her sound on the tenor is cleaner (or smoother), less aggressive or assertive, and certainly she doesn't go near the limits of sanity as Tony does in the areas of free smaller or very abstract improvisation (some might say he blows right past sanity at times in bands like Paloma Recio - or any band with Ben Monder!!! - or often when he pushes into spaces or areas unknown).

IMO, Ingrid is not nearly as adventurous (yet?) as Malaby - then again, very few are nor does Laubrock come near the almost ultra romantic tinge that Malaby veers towards in his balladic or slow playing. She has a much more standard tone and has nowhere near the vocal quality that Malaby has developed.

So Tony, Jr?? Not hearing it

I'm glad this discussion came up - I will be listening even closer on Saturday night to what I think is the most fascinating band she plays in. This quintet is the most mysterious band I've heard on years. Great ying and yang between sound, space, groove and the thoroughly oblique and she fits in perfect as she has improved as she has played with these musicians who have a bit to much more experience in these sorts of semi-abstract/free improvisation musical areas.

Being married to one of the great drummers alive today doesn't hurt, either!

Fwiw - I saw Anti-House a couple of years back at Vision Fest and I was thoroughly dissaponted as the compositions were too strenuous inorganic sounding (does that description work?!?!?) and took all the drive and energy out of the band. Halvorsen and Rainey were especially hamstrung by the structures. I kept waiting for the energy level or excitement to happen and I waited the whole hour until it simply ended. Not going back for more.

On the other hand, Rainey's trio with Ingrid and Mary is one of my 3 or 4 favorite working units that play somewhat regularly in NYC. A perfect blend of compositional elements (no sheet music both times I've seen them) yet much more than improvisation. In fact, the trio is one of the finest examples of that ultimate balance.

Edited October 3, 2014 by Steve Reynolds

[clifford_thornton]

Certainly not every IL gig/band I've heard has jelled but she works for the sound, and I appreciate that.

Not a big fan of Malaby these days but I've heard him play some excellent stuff (less so on record).

One Laubrock/Rainey duo gig I caught was just superb - she was blowing her head off, really going beyond her (admittedly strong) technical mastery. Those moments are something to see.

[sidewinder]

Caught her quite a lot at gigs over here in the early 2000s, in particularly those with the London-based F-IRE Collective. In addition to excellent tenor and soprano, she can sing as well. Have been digging that early 'Forensic' CD again this week - thoufthfull and varied programme of music.

Edited October 3, 2014 by sidewinder

[relyles]

I have heard quite a bit of Laubrock - both live and in recordings. As Clifford suggested, I have enjoyed her more in some settings than othes. I loved the Sleepthief trio, but the similarly constructed Paradoxical Frog bored me when I heard them live and on their recordings. I enjoy her work in Tom Rainey's trio and agree that the duo recording on Relative Pitch is strong - even more than I expected it to be. My very best live experiences featuring Laubrock were when she was the featured guest in Joe Morris and Stephen Haynes' Improvisations series in Hartford, and most recently two nights in a row her quintet with Tim Berne, Ben Gerstein, Dan Peck and Tom Rainey.

Edited October 3, 2014 by relyles

[clifford_thornton]

I'm not too into Tyshawn for whatever reason (I've tried), so for me that's the issue with Paradoxical Frog. Davis is not a leader I particularly go for, but her playing with Laubrock has been excellent.

[A Lark Ascending]

Would have liked to have seen one of those concerts but they are not playing around here.

She was a mainstay of Cheltenham in the noughties. I remember seeing her music change from relatively straight to increasingly abstract over those years.

She also played lovely, melodic Brazilian in Monica Vasconcelos' bands and in a sort of world-jazz band called Oriole. A different side to her music than what she seems to have chosen to focus on.

'Forensic' which Sidewinder mentions seemed to mark a turning point in her central drive.

If you want to hear the distance she's come, listen to 'Who Is It?' from 1998 - almost a smooth jazz album. It's on Spotify (I don't think it's one you'd play much so not worth owning).

Edited October 3, 2014 by A Lark Ascending

[king ubu]

What's the gist of the DB review? And who wrote it?

Problem was: music was good, but the high-school-teacher-like announcements took the momentum out of it all ... here's my report from back then:

[Leeway]

I guess I'll put my oar in here too. I've been attending IL concerts since 2010, I think shortly after she came over from England. First concert I saw was Paradoxical Frog. I think there were about 9 people in the audience, including someone who kept disrupting the performance. I've discussed it elsewhere so won't go into it again. But her playing hooked me then and there. Probably have seen her a couple of dozen times since then.

I like her soprano playing, but I like her tenor even more. I think she is slightly superior on the latter.

I don't see any comparison between her playing and that of Malaby, in the sense that they are not at all similar. They each have their own different language.

I would push back a little that somehow IL is a product of the players around her, including Rainey. Every player benefits from their cohort and their contemporaries, but IL's talent and ambition are her own, and she has led her development. I think she has benefited from playing with Rainey, but then I think Rainey has benefited from playing with her. Rainey himself seems to have entered a renascence.

I've been toying with the idea that IL is a lot like Mary Halvorson. Both are immensely talented, have technical proficiency, and really fluid and complex musical languages that yet are pleasing to listen to. Usually going to one or two of their concerts converts most people to fans.

The Relative Pitch duo album with Rainey comes closest to capturing how she sounds in concert.

[king ubu]

I would push back a little that somehow IL is a product of the players around her, including Rainey. Every player benefits from their cohort and their contemporaries, but IL's talent and ambition are her own, and she has led her development. I think she has benefited from playing with Rainey, but then I think Rainey has benefited from playing with her. Rainey himself seems to have entered a renascence.

Thanks for stating that.

[Steve Reynolds]

I would push back a little that somehow IL is a product of the players around her, including Rainey. Every player benefits from their cohort and their contemporaries, but IL's talent and ambition are her own, and she has led her development. I think she has benefited from playing with Rainey, but then I think Rainey has benefited from playing with her. Rainey himself seems to have entered a renascence.

Thanks for stating that.

I sure think she has improved Tom's attitude!

Leeway - On a serious note, maybe there is some truth to all of it. I was NOT taken in right away by Laubrock. The SECOND time I saw her was in the Spring of 2011 with Halvorsen and Rainey and I was floored by the trio - but it was still mostly Rainey as he was exceptionally awesome that night. That was also the FIRST time I saw Mary and for me, I was stunned by what I heard from her.

So I'm sure they are all learning and building on each other and it will be at some point in the future to look back and maybe realize a bit more what was happening.

What is thrilling for me is to be right in the middle of it - at least more than most - happy to get to the shows I'm able to get to.

[David Ayers]

Too much here for me to respond to but I am taking it all on board.

Re. Zürich Concert, the DB reviewer kind of said what ubu said and focussed on questions about solos. In my opinion that solo-centered way of thinking doesn't fit the project, and the DB reviewer didn't really find a way of talking about what he HAD heard. That opens an issue in general about how review vocabulary signals an aporia in how we think about 'jazz' in general - what we hear, what we think we hear, what it is and what it is not.

Re. my only direct hearing of Laubrock last night, it was as I said all about the tone, notably low registers, but also here use of the very high false registers (well, we hear them so often we don't think of them as false) which she used with orderliness and elaborate melodic invention quite unlike any energy player - absolutely unlike.

Edited October 3, 2014 by David Ayers

[mjazzg]

Best show i saw her play was a trio with Mark Sanders and I think, Ollie Brice on bass. She'd beeen to NY for a bit and came back for a short tour. On tenor she was knock out - I'm glad to see Ubu also heard a Henderson comparison because that's what I heard that night. Someone who didn't need to hurry to a crescendo but constructed a solo with precision and aplomb - she gave herself space and time to say something and she had things to say.

Since then I've enjoyed the Paradoxical Frog and Catatumbo albums, blown a bit hot and cold with the anti-House ones (too dense? too long?) and would very much like to hear the Zurich concert, after a brief sample on spotify, and the duet with Rainey.

I'd love to hear her live with Halvorsen. The Haste tour that's happening now does indeed seem an intriguing prospect

[A Lark Ascending]

That opens an issue in general about how review vocabulary signals an aporia in how we think about 'jazz' in general - what we hear, what we think we hear, what it is and what it is not.

Re. my only direct hearing of Laubrock last night, it was as I said all about the tone, notably low registers, but also here use of the very high false registers (well, we hear them so often we don't think of them as false) which she used with orderliness and elaborate melodic invention quite unlike any energy player - absolutely unlike.

Big, big question there.

I know my understanding of music doesn't allow me to go much beyond 'I really liked that' or 'was thrilled by this' (I'd have never have noticed what you mention in the second paragraph). And articulating it in writing becomes nigh on impossible for me - I end up collapsing into metaphors. I tried a bit of online reviewing in the noughties and stopped because I knew I couldn't go beyond vague impressionism.

I rarely read reviews or online comments that do much more. I recall a free/avant music periodical that operated over here in the 90s called 'Avanti' that was packed with words but never left me any closer to what was happening in the music. Probably explains why so much discussion of jazz revolves around formats (or in the classical world, the relative importance of maestros).

When people who understand the technicalities of music articulate what is going on (and have an awareness that much of the reading audience don't) it can be revelatory.

Probably an issue for another thread. Do most people who write about jazz really know what they are on about?*

* Which is different from 'Do they really like what they listen to?' which I'd take as given. But explaining why?

Edited October 3, 2014 by A Lark Ascending

[Steve Reynolds]

Bev: *I* understand what I'm writing about!! As far as anyone else, it is up to them. I believe it is a very helpful tool for me to try to express myself about what I see and hear. Certainly much of it is simply an impression. It is very challenging not being schooled in music and never playing an instrument to even try.

I'm sure my results are better than what they were 15 years ago when it was ALL fanboy rantings!!!

The music which is different then more mainstream jazz or not purely free improvised music is often the most exciting to try to explain as I am trying to find out a little bit of what they are doing.

The best aspect of this is that a good amount of the music being played near me (in NY), that I am interested in, is this "in between" music. It often defies categorization which ends up being a very good thing.

Check out the recent pointofdeparture.org and go to the review of the recent Tamarindo CD. This is the best analysis if this band that I have read

[A Lark Ascending]

Your enthusiasm always comes across, Steve. I've tried out many a recording based on that.

'This thrilled me' is one thing. I can do that. And I respond to it from others.

'This matters.' Well....

What I constantly miss is the common criteria on which the judgement is based. And you can't make judgements in any area without commonly agreed criteria (feel my pain: years of dealing with school inspectors coming in with their own woolly criteria, changing goalposts or personal agendas).

Too often it is 'this thrilled me so it matters'.

[Where I think David is onto something is that he's gone beyond an assertion of 'this is amazing' to articulating exactly what he found amazing. That doesn't happen very often].

Edited October 3, 2014 by A Lark Ascending