Marc Ribot: Live at the Village Vanguard

[mjzee]

Curious about this. Any thoughts? Release date is next week:

[BFrank]

Don't know, but I have tickets to see him in a couple of different formats at SFJazz at the end of the month.

[sonnyhill]

Don't hesitate. It's excellent.

[BFrank]

What about this?

[sonnyhill]

I haven't heard Your Turn. The new one, which was recorded at the VV, is really good. If you download, there are three extra tracks available via iTunes that are not on the cd. I usually do not download, but in this case the additional tracks were worth it.

[BFrank]

Good to know. I'll have to check that out.

[Leeway]

Ribot sings on "Ceramic Dog." I don't know if he does on the "VV" CD just out, didn't think he did.

[sonnyhill]

No vocals on the VV cd. Fear of vocals is why I haven't picked up Your Turn.

[mjazzg]

The Trio were red hot live last year (with one vocal tune - ouch). Can't imagine the CD can be anything less than impressive if they caught them right

[Leeway]

I'm actually ambivalent about Ribot. Some of his recordings sound good, although like sonnyhill, I'm not keen on his singing or his rock god pretensions.

I've only seen him once, early this year, with his Ceramic Dog Trio and guest Mary Halvorson. The trio was incredibly loud, and Ribot louder than anyone else; unnecessarily loud in my opinion. Ribot completely drowned out Halvorson, who can dod the shred thing too. Why invite a guest then play right over her? It seemed a very self-indulgent display on Ribot's part. It seems like he demands to be the center of attention, and so often just hammers away. In comparison to someone fairly similar, Nels Cline, he comes off as the inferior talent.

Looking at this, it seems a harsh assessment, but I am open to further thought on Ribot. I just recently picked up 7" vinyl, Ribot and Deerhoof, which I liked, although nobody sung on that one! Some of his online clips are good too. So I remain ambivalent pending further evidence.

[BFrank]

I'm seeing Ceramic Dog next Friday and Los Cubanos Postizos (w/David Hidalgo) on the next night.

Will be interesting to see the contrast.

[Leeway]

Let us know how it goes. Maybe my concert was an anomaly.

[AllenLowe]

what is great about Marc is that he is not just a great player but a creative one; I haven't heard the things referenced above, but I have heard him solo (amazing, varied, fascinating) and I have seen him, in session, just get at the essence of a tune.

[BFrank]

Those shows are at SFJazz, which has excellent sound. So I'd like to think they would do a good job with the audio during the sound check.

[xybert]

I like Ribot, but he's quite the chameleon, and i think in a weird way that makes it harder to embrace him. I love the Zorn Ipos album, where Ribot does like a surf/klezmer/Doors type thing, and then there's The Sun Died, where he does a bluesy/noisey/Hammond B3 sort of thing... then there's that Ayler tribute album... i love albums that he plays on, and his playing on said albums, but i definitely don't feel like i know him at all from what i've heard of him.

[Leeway]

If one is a fan, I suppose that would be seen as versatility. Someone more skeptical (like me), that would be seen as introducing an element of the ersatz, which might be why it is hard to connect with Ribot. For example, I just don't buy his Cuban/Spanish group Los Cubanos Postizos; to me that has that ersatz feel to it.

[AllenLowe]

well, people made the same complaints about Jaki Byard; but Marc, to me, does it all well; it's integrated into his sound and style. And don't forget that he calls one of his projects The Prosthetic Cubans.

[Leeway]

I know you've worked with him Allen, which is cool, and that has allowed you to see Ribot in ways most of us can't. I'm only trying to address the public or performance personas that he presents (and there are more than one). I'm reluctant to completely dismiss him because I do see an interesting mind at work. But I also think there are questions of authenticity; that's why I raised that issue of the ersatz, and maybe why xybert (not speaking for him) admired the talent yet felt disconnected from the performer. The Winter Jazz Fest performance left a hugely bad taste in my mouth, which makes me question what he does. The remaining question for me is his work with Zorn. I'm not a big enough fan of the Zorn body of work to make a judgment on Ribot's work there.

[mjazzg]

I've seen him a few times. Los Cubanos Postizos were great fun and I'm sure to anyone versed in Cuban music probably displayed all manner of deficiency but they could really play what they were playing, Ribot included. With Grimes and Taylor he played a gamut of guitar styles, some of which I enjoyed more than others (hated the singing). In Zorn's Electric Masada he hit the Jewish surf aeschetic square on and again impressed and also managed to shine in the more chamberish Bar Kokhba ensemble. But the best experience was an improvised trio with Han Bennink and Evan Parker - company I didn't expect him to keep and I wondered how he'd hold up - he did by using all his eclecticism and creativity.

I run from Ceramic Dog as far as I can and I've not really been convinced by some of the film music work he's releaseed on Tzadik. Sometimes I think of him as creative and ranging across genre and boundaries in an inventive way but others I just wonder whether he spreads himself too thin. But that's more about me than him. As Allen says above whatever he does is recognisable as him nad often its the context reather than his playing that I don't find convincing.

I think my musical life would be poorer but not empty without his playing and recording

[AllenLowe]

yeah, Marc was very interesting to watch in the studio - he was a sideman but never acted like he was just a hired hand; fully committed, came up with some great ideas.

[A Lark Ascending]

Seeing a live performance of that Cuban band about ten years ago (I'd gone to see Charlie Haden, the other part of the double bill) ignited my interest in Cuban music - I still play those two records regularly.

Also like some of backing to a number of singers. Strikes me as a very interesting musician. I have the Vanguard record downloaded to listen to next week.

[Head Man]

I have the Vanguard record downloaded to listen to next week.

It's good.... I like it!

[PHILLYQ]

If one is a fan, I suppose that would be seen as versatility. Someone more skeptical (like me), that would be seen as introducing an element of the ersatz, which might be why it is hard to connect with Ribot. For example, I just don't buy his Cuban/Spanish group Los Cubanos Postizos; to me that has that ersatz feel to it.

They are the 'Prosthetic' Cubans...

They're having fun with Cuban music, but playing some good stuff in the process.

[Leeway]

His playing at it is more problematic to me than if he really tried, and I think supports my thesis. I'm reminded of Gertrude Stein's comment about Oakland, "There's no there, there." I feel rather the same way about Ribot. Compare him to, let's say, Matt Shipp. There is no doubt with Shipp that there is plenty of there, there. His artistry is absolutely grounded and unmistakable. I just don't get that with Ribot really. He is available for an occasional good time, but not more.

[Steve Reynolds]

His playing at it is more problematic to me than if he really tried, and I think supports my thesis. I'm reminded of Gertrude Stein's comment about Oakland, "There's no there, there." I feel rather the same way about Ribot. Compare him to, let's say, Matt Shipp. There is no doubt with Shipp that there is plenty of there, there. His artistry is absolutely grounded and unmistakable. I just don't get that with Ribot really. He is available for an occasional good time, but not more.

Not that familiar with Ribot but my experience who musicians who dabble in different idioms or variations of those musics renders the music they play as empty and vapid.

Imagine if Monk dabbled in R&B on the side

Or if Cecil Taylor wrote jingles in the 60's rather than dedicating himself to what he felt in his heart, soul and mind.