Musical instruments you could do without in jazz.

[JSngry]

Red McKenzie, step down!

[Parkertown]

Congas

I've yet to warm up to the Lou Donaldson dates on the Mosaic that include a conguero.

[GregK]

I've never liked the vibes, marimba, etc. Guess that's why I could never appreciate Dolphy's Out to Lunch, or Dave Holland's current band. That sound just instantly make me think of Lawrence Welk or ultra-smooth music!!!

[Saxophone__Vagina]

Violin just doesn't do it for me.  No tears shed when that Stuff Smith set went bye bye.

Yea me too, the sound of the violin just doesn't mix in well for me, always sounds out of place.

I use to be anti-vibes too, but then they just grew on me some how, now most of the time i love their sound.

Edited February 17, 2004 by Saxophone__Vagina

[bertrand]

Interesting moniker, dude (or dudette?).

[BruceH]

Unfortunately, it's also a very difficult instrument to play well so there are fewer good trombonists than there are good players of saxophone, trumpet etc. Coordinating tongue (articulation) and slide is the main challenge for most players

Like any instrument, in the wrong hands it can sound pretty bad. This really returns to something I brought up on another thread- the two most important elements (to me) of playing jazz are SOUND and TIME. The trombone players I DON'T like have issues in one or both of these areas- uncontrolled sound and/or sloppy technique which makes the instrument sound cumbersome. Nothing else matters (melody, rhythm, harmony) if SOUND and TIME are not happening. They are fundamental elements of playing upon which all other things depend, IMHO. Count me in as someone who hates bad trombone as much or more than anyone here!

What do you think of Curtis Fuller?

[Free For All]

Unfortunately, it's also a very difficult instrument to play well so there are fewer good trombonists than there are good players of saxophone, trumpet etc. Coordinating tongue (articulation) and slide is the main challenge for most players

Like any instrument, in the wrong hands it can sound pretty bad. This really returns to something I brought up on another thread- the two most important elements (to me) of playing jazz are SOUND and TIME. The trombone players I DON'T like have issues in one or both of these areas- uncontrolled sound and/or sloppy technique which makes the instrument sound cumbersome. Nothing else matters (melody, rhythm, harmony) if SOUND and TIME are not happening. They are fundamental elements of playing upon which all other things depend, IMHO. Count me in as someone who hates bad trombone as much or more than anyone here!

What do you think of Curtis Fuller?

Bruce, I'm a big fan of Curtis Fuller. I consider him to be one of the main cats who brought the trombone into the front line. He was the only trombonist to record with Bud Powell and Coltrane. He and JJ were among the first players I heard that got me interested in pursuing trombone.

That being said, I must say that I find his oeuvre to be a bit inconsistent. Sometimes his sound is pretty rough, like he's played a little too long that day, which may very well be the case. I'm thinking specifically about some of the Blakey sides, and I realize that recording quality is partially to blame. Sometimes, though, I feel like he's having to play louder than he'd like to, and when that happens, sound quality and control are definitely compromised. It's like having to shout to be heard- not much of a chance for subtlety.

He was an innovator in the concept of legato double-tonguing (AKA "doodle"-tonguing)- he wasn't the first to do it, but he and Carl Fontana made it into a "household" technique. He uses a pretty heavy tonguing accent which sometimes makes his articulation a bit cumbersome (IMHO), but he has his own sound and is a highly emulated player (listen to Steve Davis, for example). I've transcribed and studied several of his solos. There are some great ones, although he did have a pretty rough time on Moment's Notice- I sure wouldn't want to have been in his shoes on that session. Coltrane brought in a tune that he'd been shedding for who knows how long. Poor Curtis, Lee and Kenny had to practically sightread it. When Mr. Fuller is in a situation where he's clearly playing by his rules, though, no one can touch him.

I would love to meet Curtis one day- I hear he's a great person. In spite of a few sub-par moments (which all great players have experienced) I consider him one of the top half-dozen. And I love his Mosaic set.

[ScreaminJayHawkins]

There is none I can think of I believe. The closest thing would be those elevator-music-sounding keyboard... Sorry if you like Michael Brecker, Now You See It...Now You Don't, but the keyboard on this album is exactly what I'm talking about... I have a total aversion for this album for this very reason... Also, the synth used in this album nearly discust me.

[Jazzdog]

I've never liked the vibes, marimba, etc. Guess that's why I could never appreciate Dolphy's Out to Lunch, or Dave Holland's current band. That sound just instantly make me think of Lawrence Welk or ultra-smooth music!!!

Then you NEED to go see Hutcherson play live! He whups the doo-doo out of that Vibraphone!

[Hardbopjazz]

I would have say bagpipes.

But... Sonny Rollins used bagpipes during his 1974 European tour. Can't image someone soloing on bagpipes.

http://montreuxsounds.com/

SONNY ROLLINS

Jul 6, 1974

Congrés Montreux

Sonny Rollins (ts)

Rufus Harley (bagpipes)

Stanely Cowell (p)

Bob Cranshaw (B)

Masuo (g)

Mtume (congas, perc)

David Lee (dr)

1. The Cutting Edge (06:35)

2. A House Is Not A Home (05:57)

3. Direct Line (06:45)

4. Swing Low Sweet Chariot (19:30)

5. Alfie's Theme (10:52)

6. To A Wild Rose (08:25)

7. Don't Stop The Carnival (Calypso Everywhere) (05:35)

8. Sonnymoon For Two (19:03)

[connoisseur series500]

Bruce, I'm a big fan of Curtis Fuller. I consider him to be one of the main cats who brought the trombone into the front line. He was the only trombonist to record with Bud Powell and Coltrane. He and JJ were among the first players I heard that got me interested in pursuing trombone.

That being said, I must say that I find his oeuvre to be a bit inconsistent. Sometimes his sound is pretty rough, like he's played a little too long that day, which may very well be the case. I'm thinking specifically about some of the Blakey sides, and I realize that recording quality is partially to blame. Sometimes, though, I feel like he's having to play louder than he'd like to, and when that happens, sound quality and control are definitely compromised. It's like having to shout to be heard- not much of a chance for subtlety.

He was an innovator in the concept of legato double-tonguing (AKA "doodle"-tonguing)- he wasn't the first to do it, but he and Carl Fontana made it into a "household" technique. He uses a pretty heavy tonguing accent which sometimes makes his articulation a bit cumbersome (IMHO), but he has his own sound and is a highly emulated player (listen to Steve Davis, for example). I've transcribed and studied several of his solos. There are some great ones, although he did have a pretty rough time on Moment's Notice- I sure wouldn't want to have been in his shoes on that session. Coltrane brought in a tune that he'd been shedding for who knows how long. Poor Curtis, Lee and Kenny had to practically sightread it. When Mr. Fuller is in a situation where he's clearly playing by his rules, though, no one can touch him.

I would love to meet Curtis one day- I hear he's a great person. In spite of a few sub-par moments (which all great players have experienced) I consider him one of the top half-dozen. And I love his Mosaic set.

What was that baggy thing he had attached to his bell on the "One Night with Blue Note" DVD? Looked like a discarded piece of swiss cheese.

It's bad enough when you have to follow Freddie Hubbard and Johnny Griffin to start your solo, but then you've got this ungainly looking instrument with a slab of swiss cheese attached to your horn...didn't exactly look cool. The guy can play though.

[Free For All]

I haven't seen the DVD yet, conn, but I assume it's the same thing he often uses when he plays. It functions as a type of mute which darkens the sound- he's been using it for quite awhile, so he must like the effect. I need to get that Blue Note DVD.