AllenLowe Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 he's no Herbie Hancock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B. Clugston Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 he's always been a frustrated jazz musician rather than what I think of as a "jazz fan". his forcing himself on stage of a known jazz group just to shake a tambourine has always been embarrassing. by agreeing to MC the Playboy Jazz Festival, they let him have his own group to lead. musicians chosen have always been excellent but his ego has consistently ruined the sets by frantically directing or banging on the drums. His presence certainly didn't help Charles Mingus and Friends in Concert. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kh1958 Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 he's always been a frustrated jazz musician rather than what I think of as a "jazz fan". his forcing himself on stage of a known jazz group just to shake a tambourine has always been embarrassing. by agreeing to MC the Playboy Jazz Festival, they let him have his own group to lead. musicians chosen have always been excellent but his ego has consistently ruined the sets by frantically directing or banging on the drums. His presence certainly didn't help Charles Mingus and Friends in Concert. He was deleted from the expanded CD version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erwbol Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 he's always been a frustrated jazz musician rather than what I think of as a "jazz fan". his forcing himself on stage of a known jazz group just to shake a tambourine has always been embarrassing. by agreeing to MC the Playboy Jazz Festival, they let him have his own group to lead. musicians chosen have always been excellent but his ego has consistently ruined the sets by frantically directing or banging on the drums. His presence certainly didn't help Charles Mingus and Friends in Concert. He was deleted from the expanded CD version. Unfortunately, he is present on the latest version included in The Complete Columbia & RCA Albums Collection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erwbol Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 The title of this thread should be changed to Bill Cosby's lifelong love affair with Spanish Fly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danasgoodstuff Posted January 31, 2015 Report Share Posted January 31, 2015 he's always been a frustrated jazz musician rather than what I think of as a "jazz fan". his forcing himself on stage of a known jazz group just to shake a tambourine has always been embarrassing. by agreeing to MC the Playboy Jazz Festival, they let him have his own group to lead. musicians chosen have always been excellent but his ego has consistently ruined the sets by frantically directing or banging on the drums. That's not love, it's neediness. On the other hand I quite like the project he did with Don Pullen, David Murray, Harold Vick, Scofiled, and Sharrock in various combinations, and they were even better on BET in yet another combo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Berger Posted January 31, 2015 Report Share Posted January 31, 2015 I guess I feel differently than some others on this thread. As an entertainer, Cosby was brilliant. I don't mind his jazz "involvement" - seems like he helped to bring some pretty good, uncompromised music and musicians to the public eye. But in his personal life, he was a monster and at this point that supersedes everything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmonahan Posted January 31, 2015 Report Share Posted January 31, 2015 This has brought back to me some of the interesting discussions we've had on the Board about the connection between the often-problematic personalities/personal lives of some jazz musicians and their art. I think what makes Cosby different is that a lot of his public persona came to be tied up with a moral and ethical mission. He made a lot of his study of child psychology, of the importance of family life, of working hard and all that, and these charges just blast a lot of that out of the water as hopeless hypocrisy. If his humor had been more like that of, say, Redd Fox, would people be more likely to give him a pass? Probably not, but it's an interesting question. gregmo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 If I had never heard of Bill Cosby and heard one of his prime monologues "blind", would I laugh my ass off? Most likely. So, art, person, don't bother trying to merge that with any consistency. Square a circle instead, you'll get that done sooner. Comic genius = comic genius. Rapist = rapist. Time = time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 If I had never heard of Bill Cosby and heard one of his prime monologues "blind", would I laugh my ass off? Most likely. So, art, person, don't bother trying to merge that with any consistency. Square a circle instead, you'll get that done sooner. Comic genius = comic genius. Rapist = rapist. Time = time. This x 1,000. Moral stances and whatnot, blah, blah, blah... Laughing at a funny line is in absolutely no way an endorsement of the person who recites it. Miles hit women. Strangest thing being that when I found that out, I immediately went back and listened to Kind Of Blue. It still sounded just as good as I remember. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erwbol Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Bill Cosby never made me laugh out loud from when I first saw his Cosby show as a child. Didn't know what rape was then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjzee Posted February 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 One of my favorite albums when I was a kid, "Chicken Heart" still cracks me up: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erwbol Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 http://youtu.be/xZdn9ZjgWKI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Old, angry George. Can't stomach it. Carlin was a genius, but he should be in the Guiness Book Of World Records as the man who went from the funniest cat on the planet, to the least funniest cat on the planet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmonahan Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Old, angry George. Can't stomach it. Carlin was a genius, but he should be in the Guiness Book Of World Records as the man who went from the funniest cat on the planet, to the least funniest cat on the planet... Yeah, Carlin could get really mean as he got older. I knew a guy who scheduled acts at Indiana U in Bloomington, and I asked him once who was the worst jerk he ever had to deal with. "George Carlin, hands down" was the answer. I was disappointed (loved some of his midlife comedy a lot) but not too surprised. gregmo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Yeah, he was on one hell of a win streak back in the 80's and early 90's. I remember a buddy of mine took his wife to a comedy club to see Carlin in the late 90's. When he told me about it I said that I was jealous because Carlin was my favorite comedian and I'd have loved seeing him. My buddy quickly said, "you didn't miss anything, he was awful. Just really angry and bitter, I didn't laugh once the entire time." I told him I wasn't buying it for one second. Then I saw his HBO special from that particular tour. Yikes. To call it awful would be incredibly diplomatic. And the last two or three specials he did before his death were even worse. The opening bit from one of those, where he was riffing on being a modern man, was pretty entertaining. Aside from that he said nothing else even mildly entertaining. A very sad downfall, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crisp Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 Bill Cosby never made me laugh out loud from when I first saw his Cosby show as a child. Didn't know what rape was then. Nor me. But it wasn't just the unfunniness. There was something about his whole manner that made my hackles rise. Smug, pompous, "wise"; he's a "community leader" type. Never thought he'd be anything worse than that, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noj Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 Himself was a classic in my household. Something regularly quoted. Hilarious, objectively speaking. I could probably revisit it and still laugh, separating the man from his performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dolan Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 Many comedians consider that to be the "Bible" of comedy. Very funny performance. It was a classic in my household as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 George Carlin was my hero. The older and angrier he got the more I agreed with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgcim Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 This has brought back to me some of the interesting discussions we've had on the Board about the connection between the often-problematic personalities/personal lives of some jazz musicians and their art. I think what makes Cosby different is that a lot of his public persona came to be tied up with a moral and ethical mission. He made a lot of his study of child psychology, of the importance of family life, of working hard and all that, and these charges just blast a lot of that out of the water as hopeless hypocrisy. If his humor had been more like that of, say, Redd Fox, would people be more likely to give him a pass? Probably not, but it's an interesting question. gregmo Some white musicians i knew were doing a recording for one of his shows, and when they were in the studio, they overheard him making some racist comments about them to the black recording engineer. Ever since I heard that, i took everything i heard him say with a grain of salt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erwbol Posted February 3, 2015 Report Share Posted February 3, 2015 http://youtu.be/s-clvDxl8qI Fast forward to 1:14:36 George on why he actually is not an angry man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted February 3, 2015 Report Share Posted February 3, 2015 an aging comic being bitter and angry? Naaahhhh.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted February 3, 2015 Report Share Posted February 3, 2015 ANY comic not being bitter and angry from jump? Naaahhhh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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