jazz musicians who were notorious gamblers

[alocispepraluger102]

ambrose, the oldtime bandleader was a hopeless gambler, as was the late crooner, al martino.

are any of our jazz musician friends notorious for their gambling????

Edited February 3, 2013 by alocispepraluger102

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

I suspect there's an answer in Hardbopjazz' BFT107

(But he won't tell us until the end of the month.)

MG

[Larry Kart]

Harry James, IIRC.

[JETman]

You guys tore someone a new one about "celebrating" one vice, and now it's ok to talk about another vice?

[alocispepraluger102]

Harry James, IIRC.

he led bands in vegas for decades. his early vegas bands were really fine.

[John Tapscott]

Don't know whether he was 'notorious' or whether it got him into trouble, but Count Basie apparently liked to play the horses.

[sgcim]

Clark Terry admits that he had a severe gambling problem in his autobiography. He lost many a gig's pay in crap games in the back of the bus.

One musician friend of mine said that Matt Matthews had so many gambling debts, that he had to get out of NY before you-know-who would do him in.The same person claimed that gambling debts were also responsible for the disappearance of Dick Garcia from the NY scene, although Garcia still lives in NY.

[brownie]

Django Reinhardt

[robertoart]

Were Black Jazz musicians welcome in non-Black gambling situations or organised crime activities in earlier times?

[Hardbopjazz]

I suspect there's an answer in Hardbopjazz' BFT107

(But he won't tell us until the end of the month.)

MG

No I won't. This one should be real easy to guess.

[John Tapscott]

It's said that when Nat Pierce was Woody Herman's pianist and band manger, he gambled away the band's two week payroll one night in Vegas. Had to work with Herman a year longer than he planned to pay it back.

But it a non-musician named Abe Turchen who really did Herman in. When Turchen was the band manger he gambled away the band's withholding taxes over a number of years. Herman didn't know what was happening and was later held liable for all of it, since the band was unincorporated. Almost put Herman on the street. He could never retire because he had to keep the band working just to put a dent in the debt (which had been inflated by the IRS beyond all reasonableness).

[BillF]

It's said that when Nat Pierce was Woody Herman's pianist and band manger, he gambled away the band's two week payroll one night in Vegas. Had to work with Herman a year longer than he planned to pay it back.

But it a non-musician named Abe Turchen who really did Herman in. When Turchen was the band manger he gambled away the band's withholding taxes over a number of years. Herman didn't know what was happening and was later held liable for all of it, since the band was unincorporated. Almost put Herman on the street. He could never retire because he had to keep the band working just to put a dent in the debt (which had been inflated by the IRS beyond all reasonableness).

Yes, vividly told in this biography which I found in the Music Department of Manchester Central Library.

http://www.langtoninfo.co.uk/showitem.aspx?isbn=0195115740&loc=GBP

[John Tapscott]

It's said that when Nat Pierce was Woody Herman's pianist and band manger, he gambled away the band's two week payroll one night in Vegas. Had to work with Herman a year longer than he planned to pay it back.

But it a non-musician named Abe Turchen who really did Herman in. When Turchen was the band manger he gambled away the band's withholding taxes over a number of years. Herman didn't know what was happening and was later held liable for all of it, since the band was unincorporated. Almost put Herman on the street. He could never retire because he had to keep the band working just to put a dent in the debt (which had been inflated by the IRS beyond all reasonableness).

Yes, vividly told in this biography which I found in the Music Department of Manchester Central Library.

http://www.langtonin...5115740&loc=GBP

Yes, I have that book. A good read. The story is also vividly told (and shown) in the recent Jazzed Media DVD.

[alocispepraluger102]

thank you.

[sidewinder]

Yes, vividly told in this biography which I found in the Music Department of Manchester Central Library.

http://www.langtonin...5115740&loc=GBP

I remember 'Time' magazine doing a whole article on Woody back in the 1980s and the article mentioning this.

As to gamblers - Joe Harriott was keen on the bookies, I believe.

Edited February 6, 2013 by sidewinder

[danasgoodstuff]

Any number of label owners too, Eli Toscano and George goldner amongst them.

[mikeweil]