Stan Getz At Large - nice budget find

[MartyJazz]

This is a 2 day marathon session from January 1960 that resulted in a double LP release on the Verve label. I've had the LP(s) for quite a few years, but could not resist picking up a double CD reissue for only $5 at of all places, a Big Lots, located here in southeast Florida. According to the package that only contains a repeating photo of Getz and the titles of the tunes, it's on the "Music Moods" label ostensibly based in the U.S. While I can locate a couple of CD reissues of this session on Amazon, none match the photo and label of the reissue I copped. A Google search likewise does not produce a CD photo or information that matches my purchase.

Incidentally, this reissue adds the 3 tracks left off of the Verve double LP because of what I assume were the vinyl time constraints, making for a total of 17 tracks. And for those not familiar with this session that was recorded in Copenhagen, it's a bit unusual in that it's Getz backed by a relatively unknown rhythm section, Jan Johansson (p), Daniel Jordan (b), and William Schiopffe (d). None of the discographical information apart from the tune titles is listed on the package.

Anyway, I recommend this budget find if you can spot it at a Big Lots or similar discount store.

Edited January 19, 2013 by MartyJazz

[GA Russell]

Thanks for that info, Marty! I too found it at Big Lots in mid-December, and gave it to myself for Christmas. I haven't opened it up yet, though.

Big Lots had a number of interesting jazz titles for five dollars that day, including Erroll Garner - The Elf on Savoy and Sonny Rollins - The Sound of Sonny on Riverside.

[Big Beat Steve]

And for those not familiar with this session that was recorded in Copenhagen, it's a bit unusual in that it's Getz backed by a relatively unknown rhythm section, Jan Johansson (p), Daniel Jordan (b), and William Schioffe (d).

Unknown by what yardstick?

I can assure you that Jan Johansson and William Schiøpffe (he's Danish) are quite well-known among anybody with even a passing interest in European jazz of that period. And judging by their presence on recordings, many visiting US jazzmen who called upon their services must have appreciated them too. Stan Getz, for example, had recorded with Johanssson and Schiøpffe on several ocasions before that 1960 date.

I have some of Getz' live and studio recordings from this European period of his. Fine indeed ...

Edited January 18, 2013 by Big Beat Steve

[JSngry]

I recently obtained the LP. but it's such a good session that I'd like the bonus cuts. Now I gotta go back inside a Big Lots.

Dammit, I thought I was done with that shit.

[Big Beat Steve]

Talking about reissues of this session, WTF is this???

http://www.amazon.com/At-Large-Stan-Getz/dp/B00AYJCCSA/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1358554229&sr=8-5&keywords=Stan+Getz+At+LARGE

Bill Perkins forced to pass for Stan Getz??

Another one for the liner notes/booklets goofs threads?

[Dan Gould]

Wait a sec, music at Big Lots? I only see DVDs. Guess I need to take a look soon.

[MartyJazz]

Wait a sec, music at Big Lots? I only see DVDs. Guess I need to take a look soon.

And I found it at the Big Lots on Atlantic & Military.

[Head Man]

Talking about reissues of this session, WTF is this???

http://www.amazon.co...n Getz At LARGE

Bill Perkins forced to pass for Stan Getz??

Another one for the liner notes/booklets goofs threads?

I presume this is the budget release referred to above...or is it?

It looks like a straight copy of the Storyville 2xCD but with a slightly different track order. BTW the Storyville album is still widely available and isn't that expensive....and it has picture of Stan on the cover!

Edited January 19, 2013 by Head Man

[JETman]

All very strange. I did notice that Storyville released this within the last year. How the material reverted to them (they don't usually bootleg material) is anyone's guess. I have a VERVE Japanese 2xcd mini lp version released in the late 90s or early 00s, I think.

[king ubu]

They don't have to bootleg it, it's beyond 50 years ... still have to get me a copy of the Storyville, sounds like a nice enough session!

[Larry Kart]

Remember, gentlemen, forum rules prohibit linking to bootlegs. Tell me if you can why that rule doesn't apply here, or those posts/links will be deleted shortly.

[J.A.W.]

They don't have to bootleg it, it's beyond 50 years ...

But it's still illegal in the United States with its different copyright laws, and that's where this board is based And it's 70 years now in the European Union for recordings that were not yet in the public domain when the rule was changed - yep, I know, Switzerland is not a member state; what do your country's copyright laws say, by the way?

Edited January 19, 2013 by J.A.W.

[king ubu]

They don't have to bootleg it, it's beyond 50 years ...

But it's still illegal in the United States with its different copyright laws, and that's where this board is based And it's 70 years now in the European Union - yep, I know, Switzerland is not a member state; what do your country's copyright laws say, by the way?

I think it's the same as in the EU.

I was just pointing out that Storyville isn't *releasing* a bootleg. Where they operate, it's fine.

In the US, it's obviously possible that it is a bootleg (that is if they didn't license it from Verve/Universal ... I'd be rather astonished to learn they did), but that doesn't per so make it one.

's all.

[J.A.W.]

I was just pointing out that Storyville isn't *releasing* a bootleg. Where they operate, it's fine.

Yep, that's true.

Why would it not be illegal in the United States if it wasn't licensed?

Edited January 19, 2013 by J.A.W.

[king ubu]

Too many negations ....

licensed = okay

not licensed = boot

m kay?

[J.A.W.]

Why would it not be illegal in the United States if it wasn't licensed?

Too many negations ....

But not wrong

licensed = okay

not licensed = boot

m kay?

Clear.

Edited January 19, 2013 by J.A.W.

[mjzee]

My guess is the Storyville's not a bootleg. It's very possible Verve licensed the sessions for a certain number of years.

[Chuck Nessa]

Has anyone compared the At Large contents with the 2 cd set on Dragon?

[Larry Kart]

Has anyone compared the At Large contents with the 2 cd set on Dragon?

Different stuff (if indeed the Dragon set below is the one you mean):

http://www.storyvill...t-large-1038422

http://www.amazon.co...ks_all_1#disc_1

[JSngry]

Went inside Big Lots today...they had this one (several copies, actually), as well as a few other things.

Looks like Concord is dumping some stock into Cutout World...no OJCs, some other stuff.

Edited January 19, 2013 by JSngry

[Peter Friedman]

This is getting a bit complicated. I originally had the 2 LP set on Verve. Some time back I got this material on 2 Separate CDs on the Jazz Unlimited label. There are 3 tunes total on the 2 CDs that were not on the Verve set.

[MartyJazz]

Talking about reissues of this session, WTF is this???

http://www.amazon.co...n Getz At LARGE

Bill Perkins forced to pass for Stan Getz??

Another one for the liner notes/booklets goofs threads?

I presume this is the budget release referred to above...or is it?

It looks like a straight copy of the Storyville 2xCD but with a slightly different track order. BTW the Storyville album is still widely available and isn't that expensive....and it has picture of Stan on the cover!

As I indicated in my first post about this purchase, none of the available images including the ones you post above match the cover of the double CD (Music Moods label) I purchased at Big Lots.

[JSngry]

Ok, this is interesting...the set itself is manufactured in the EU, and "licensed by Music Moods 1471 Rozelle Street, Memphis, TN 38106"

That address belongs to Express contract Packaging, Inc. http://www.expresscp.com/

A little bit about them:

Founded in 1996, Express Contract Packaging offers outsourcing for labor-intensive projects too expensive to process internally. With over 60 years of packaging and distribution experience to draw from, our management staff can offer effective and time-sensitive solutions that will fit your project needs.

Starting with just three employees, today Express Contract Packaging operates with a staff of over 100. We operate five days a week with multi-shifts and optional weekend production staff. With over 270,000 square feet of space, we can accommodate all of your warehousing and production requirements.

We know that demands and deadlines can often change in mid-project. Our success has been achieved through our commitment to quality service while being flexible enough to meet our customers' evolving needs. Contact us today to see how we can custom design a project solution for you.

A little more about them: http://www.expresscp.com/distribution.htm

Warehousing and Distribution

We operate more than 270,000 square feet of safe, well-lit, secure warehousing space with over 20 truck doors. We have specialized experience working with:

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A little MORE about them: http://www.expresscp.com/ecommerce.htm

At Express Contract Packaging, we also offer order-fulfillment services via eBay, Amazon, and other online retailers.

We can monitor your existing accounts, or create new ones for you. Take a look at some of the existing listings we currently have by clicking on the links below.

So...if I was a betting man, I'd wager that "Music Moods" is a Euro-Pirate operation that has retained the services of some totally clueless fulfillment service in Memphis strictly for the sole purpose of dumping their product on what's left of the American remainder market.

Or maybe the Memphis guys are in on it... I just called them @ 901-274-6366 to ask them if they were home of "Music Moods" records and then see what happened from there, but it's late Saturday afternoon & nobody was home. But a full list of contacts can be found here: http://www.expresscp.com/contact.htm

[JSngry]

Also on the back of the CD was a logo for something called MCPS, which turns out to be a licensing service: http://www.prsformusic.com/users/recordedmedia/cdsandvinyl/Pages/AP1AP2.aspx

I found this wording to be of interest:

Rights – mechanical rights are separate from sound recording rights

The AP Licences cover the payment of Mechanical Royalties only, which are paid to Music Publishers for the use of Musical Works. Sound Recording rights must be licensed directly from record companies (where applicable).

So,,,who actually owns the masters to the At Large sessions? My LP labels say "Recorded under the personal supervision of Norman Granz", but...really? I always wondered why this session never saw a proper US/Verve CD issue. Maybe because it wasn't their's to release by then, like mjzee gets at.

And maybe the stuff is now in Aubrey Mayhew Land, gonna be licensed and released anywhere anytime by anybody who's got the price, which is starting to look like it might be pretty affordable?

Oh, but wait - the MCPS thing also offers pressing services with this nifty little waiver available!

http://www.prsformusic.com/users/recordedmedia/pressingplants/Pages/pressingplants.aspx

The MCPS Waiver Agreement

In December 2006, we launched a new Waiver Agreement for manufacturers of audio and audio-visual products for retail and non-retail distribution. This replaced our existing Code of Practice for Manufacturers.

Who do we offer the Waiver Agreement to?

The Waiver Agreement is offered to companies who manufacture audio and audio-visual products in the United Kingdom (including work that is sub-contracted from other manufacturers), whether or not instructions for manufacture are given directly by the customer or through a broker or agent.

What are the benefits of signing up to the Waiver Agreement?

By signing up and adhering to the terms of the Agreement, you (the manufacturer) benefit in the following ways:

• We waive any rights that we may have to take action against you for copyright infringement where you have manufactured product (or authorised the manufacture of product) containing our repertoire for a third party who does not have the necessary licence(s) in place
  
• In certain circumstances, you will be able to manufacture product without seeing the clearance first, but still benefit from the waiver
  

YEAH!

[JSngry]

Want to "license" Stan Getz At Large? You can!

http://www.greenlightmusic.com/music-licensing/album/1361767/stan-getz-at-large/

But be aware:

GreenLight Music offers synchronization licenses, a type of license that allows the user to synchronize copyrighted music to another medium, such as a company video or presentation, web site, live production, advertisement, film or TV program. A mechanical license allows a song to be re-recorded, sampled, manipulated, or distributed by someone besides the rightsholder. We suggest you contact the Harry Fox Agency for your mechanical licensing needs.

so the only licensing that appears to be of concern is publishing, which is proper, of course, but...who owns the masters? Yeah, I get PD and all that, but still...this session has been a little "obscure" for all these years and now (relatively) all of a sudden it's in Big Lots for 5 bucks, and per Amazon on an upcoming (February 2013) release with Bill Perkins on the cover (traceable back to this label: http://www.play24-7.co.uk/ ) so...what's going on?