alocispepraluger102 Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 (edited) (it seems that this artist may have the wrong agent) Spike Wilner If you are ever thinking about opening a jazz club - take a deep breath and really consider it. This is an excerpt from an email I received today from an artists "manager" - I'm not naming names but just wanted folks to see what I deal with... "Spike: I think, at the end of the day, I'm not interested in gate keepers, only in making clubs $$ money. I'm bringing a $ credit worthy cash product. You can pass that up, but on what grounds ? You are too hip for that? Do you feel your actually building and contributing to the career's of Jazz musicians in America ? The way I see it, is your not - your simply working on a niche group of folks like Ari- Hoenig, and you'll give jonathan kreisberg a set. It's like, I don't get it ? You want to keep it in your family, but then you want to make money $$... if you want to make $$, how about putting quality fresh artists in there? Your blowing an artist, that has multiple awards, toured the world already, has built a fan base, is endorsed by many institutions, and top artists in the business. and for what reason? on what grounds ? * I'll have XXXX drop by, and you can meet him. If you really don't like his playing, than by all means, but you'd be in the minority. Good luck to your future, My generations is about rebuilding, embracing change, and making a difference. * If you ever want to sell your club, - give me a call, if I ever had the money - one day maybe I'd take it over and do something different. " Edited September 17, 2012 by alocispepraluger102 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 Right agent, wrong club, perhaps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JETman Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 On a side note, I'd be none too happy if the person representing me communicated like he scraped by with barely a GED! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 You severely underestimate both the intelligence level and motivations of most club bookers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JETman Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 You severely underestimate both the intelligence level and motivations of most club bookers! Read the email again. I know of no person who would purposely use "your" instead of "you're" in order to appear unintelligent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alocispepraluger102 Posted September 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 i'm thinking that the 'agent' might be the would be performer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 i'm thinking that the 'agent' might be the would be performer. Then he/she should go into agenting full-time. The only time a musician should think like that is when they're bitching to their agent about there not being more/better gigs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcello Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Naw, that's a novice "manager" who can't believe that he can't even get his client a gig at Smalls, much less anywhere else in NYC. I'm sure he's been turned down everywhere else up the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 I'd like to know who the artist in question actually is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alocispepraluger102 Posted September 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 I'd like to know who the artist in question actually is. Michael Pedicin(once in dave brubeck's group) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 I never knew him to be a "straight ahead" player until just recently. I only remembered him (and not particularly fondly) from this one: But ok, he sounds good in that clip. But it's a world where everybody "sounds good", ya' know? That agent sounds like he talks the language of the clubs that would book the guy based on that old album, in which case, hey, there's money to be made, if not exactly "artistic respect" to be gained. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aggie87 Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 That looks like a fake audience in that youtube clip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcello Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 I've never heard of him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GA Russell Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 I've never heard of him. Marcello, his last two albums have threads in the New Releases forum. I like him a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenLowe Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Pedicin's a nice guy and plays very well. The biggest and most important issue he raises, really, is the closed-up nature of certain scenes, the failure of people who book places to display basic respect and common courtesies to musicians looking for work. As I have said over and over recently, the thing to realize is that the so-called "friends" of jazz - non profits, clubs owned by musicians and music lovers, pro-jazz organizations - really treat musicians in actually the same nasty/indifferent way as the larger and less personal institutions to whom they supposedly present an alternative, And this is nothing new; I saw it happening back in the '90s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JETman Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 The bottom line is that it's always about the almighty buck. If you run a business using the model you've proposed, you're in the hole before you even get started. Btw, there seem to be some racist undertones present in the agent's email. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 The way I see it, is your not - your simply working on a niche group of folks like Ari- Hoenig, and you'll give jonathan kreisberg a set. It's like, I don't get it ? You want to keep it in your family, but then you want to make money $... Btw, there seem to be some racist undertones present in the agent's email. If that's to what you're referring, I noticed it too & was wondering just what was meant, exactly, by "you want to keep it in your family"and on what grounds it was used. Not sure if it's racist, or an accusation of racism/favoritism/whatever, but it's certainly....something. Outside of any of that though, running clubs and hustling club gigs from those who do is, as a rule, not particularly encouraging of the flexing of humankind's better qualities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JETman Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 The way I see it, is your not - your simply working on a niche group of folks like Ari- Hoenig, and you'll give jonathan kreisberg a set. It's like, I don't get it ? You want to keep it in your family, but then you want to make money $... Btw, there seem to be some racist undertones present in the agent's email. If that's to what you're referring, I noticed it too & was wondering just what was meant, exactly, by "you want to keep it in your family"and on what grounds it was used. Not sure if it's racist, or an accusation of racism/favoritism/whatever, but it's certainly....something. Outside of any of that though, running clubs and hustling club gigs from those who do is, as a rule, not particularly encouraging of the flexing of humankind's better qualities. I understand, but it's not the 40s or 50s anymore, ya know? FWIW, lots of Israeli jazz musicians record for the Small's label and rely on gigs at the club for their living. That's what I think the agent was referring to. Not gonna make many friends that way, especially in NYC. As I said, I would not want someone like that representing me, because by default he becomes a reflection of me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 What else I think is tacky is putting a business email out for public consumption, apparently in the hopes of gaining the sympathies of the club's client base. One-sided, disingenuous, and oh by the way, do we get to hear about EVERY asshole this guy has to deal with, because I'm sure there's more than one, or just this one? If not, why just this one? Forgive for not being moved by any of it, except, perhaps in the general area of my bowels. I understand, but it's not the 40s or 50s anymore, ya know? Ask any working musician here - or anywhere - about how much things have really changed in terms of money and working conditions. It's just the nature of the beast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcello Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Smalls, as the suggests, does not have a large seating capacity. Even though it's in a cellar, it's still in the West Village, and rents are high. It's not the bohemian neighborhood that it once was. There' a freakin' Marc Jacobs store around the corner, for christsakes! I'm sure the landlord could rent out the space for a lot more money than Spike can afford, so he, like all of the clubs in the USA, stick to a combination of what they know will pay the rent and at a reasonable price. The Manager better get used to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GA Russell Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Marcello, I think that the agent agrees with you, and is suggesting that the club owner is turning down the opportunity to make good money to pay that rent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcello Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Yes, but what he doesn't understand that a booker's memory is short and paranoia rules! I bet Spike said something like " Well, I can give you a Tuesday, but I can only pay the band $450", and the manager couldn't or wouldn't accept those terms. Then he basically told him what a fool he was (and worse). Then the artist would have the option to play for expenses and hope that he would eventually draw a following and press. I'm not saying that he should, but that's his option. I'm sure that this artist is a worthy musician, but since it seems that he's spent quite a few years in Philly and in academia, he's really starting at the bottom of the name recognition ladder. You would believe how many small venues make deals for a percentage of the door, by the way. No guarantee. Now, there's lots of young artists who will travel around the world and play as many dates, in as many venues that they can stuff in their schedule with those kind of terms and hope to come out ahead when they get home after the splits and cd sales, but I don't expect a artist of this particular age to enjoy roughing it for minimal economic and artistic gains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alocispepraluger102 Posted September 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 19, 2012 (edited) at his weekly solo gig a few moments ago, spike apologized profusely for 'the facebook' mess, saying that sometimes his fingers 'often type too quickly' and said that he meant no one 'any ill will.' his FB remarks elicited more than 150 responses, including some from the would be performer. Edited September 19, 2012 by alocispepraluger102 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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