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[Brad]

Especially the part about how Real Madrid is viewed as Franco’s team even though Madrid held out against the Nationalist forces until the end. 

[mjazzg]

1 minute ago, Brad said:

Especially the part about how Real Madrid is viewed as Franco’s team even though Madrid held out against the Nationalist forces until the end. 

Exactly that. Although I'm waiting to see how the post-war relationship with Franco and the establishment pans out. Could yet be that that perception comes more from the years of dictatorship. I'll see and I'll enjoy seeing too, either way.  Lowe not to florid so far 

[Brad]

There are some interesting stories and anecdotes waiting for you. 

[Brad]

5 hours ago, mjazzg said:

It certainly does. The early Civil War chapters are particularly enlightening so far

Do you have any interest in the Spanish Civil War?

[mjazzg]

7 hours ago, Brad said:

Do you have any interest in the Spanish Civil War?

Thirty years ago I read the Hugh Thomas history and Orwell and others. I think that exhausted my need to read about it for quite a while.  When I used to take annual holidays in Spain back in 80s/90s I was still very interested in it.  I suspect these chapters my reignite an interest. My interest is often still piqued by novels set then. The chapters about pre-war Barcelona sent my mind back to Mendoza's 'City Of Marvels', a marvellous book as I recall

[soulpope]

[Brad]

3 hours ago, mjazzg said:

Thirty years ago I read the Hugh Thomas history and Orwell and others. I think that exhausted my need to read about it for quite a while.  When I used to take annual holidays in Spain back in 80s/90s I was still very interested in it.  I suspect these chapters my reignite an interest. My interest is often still piqued by novels set then. The chapters about pre-war Barcelona sent my mind back to Mendoza's 'City Of Marvels', a marvellous book as I recall

I first read Thomas back in 1966 or 1967 when doing so could get you in a lot of trouble. I’ve read it a few other times over the years and it holds up pretty well. Another one I really like is Ronald Fraser’s Oral History Of the Spanish Civil War. Terrific book. Another one my father gave to me and he was a big SCW fan (he went to a lot of battlefield sites in and around Madrid when we were living there but I was in college) is Dark and Bloody Ground: A Guerilla Diary of the Spanish Civil War by F. Perez Lopez. It reads more like a fictional, picaresque history and we could never decide if it’s fiction or history orca combination of the two. Either way, a great book. You can still find some copies on eBay. 

Edited July 26, 2018 by Brad

[JSngry]

25 minutes ago, Brad said:

I first read Thomas back in 1966 or 1967 when doing so could get you in a lot of trouble

What does this mean? What kind of trouble?

Serious question, I know nothing about the author or the book and would like to learn.

[mjazzg]

1 hour ago, Brad said:

I first read Thomas back in 1966 or 1967 when doing so could get you in a lot of trouble. I’ve read it a few other times over the years and it holds up pretty well. Another one I really like is Ronald Fraser’s Oral History Of the Spanish Civil War. Terrific book. Another one my father gave to me and he was a big SCW fan (he went to a lot of battlefield sites in and around Madrid when we were living there but I was in college) is Dark and Bloody Ground: A Guerilla Diary of the Spanish Civil War by F. Perez Lopez. It reads more like a fictional, picaresque history and we could never decide if it’s fiction or history orca combination of the two. Either way, a great book. You can still find some copies on eBay. 

I'll keep an eye out for it. It does ring some very faint bells, especially the fiction/non-fiction element

Sadly my books are largely inaccessible and I can't remember which ones I particularly enjoyed apart from the Laurie Lee.

[Brad]

40 minutes ago, JSngry said:

What does this mean? What kind of trouble?

Serious question, I know nothing about the author or the book and would like to learn.

Hugh Thomas’ book on the Spanish Civil War first came out in the early 60s during the middle of the Franco regime. It told the full story of the War, including the atrocities committed by the Franco forces (as well as the Republican or government side, although those were much less). It was basically the unvarnished truth, something dictatorships don’t welcome. If a Spaniard had been caught with the book, they would have gone to jail.  Foreigners like us would have probably been kicked out. Since this was the period when Spain was starting to open up economically, I don’t think we would have been beaten up or imprisoned. 

The book is a very readable account of the War and as I mentioned still holds up well today. He was an expert on Spanish history and wrote many other books dealing with Spain, although focusing on the 1500s and 1600s. 

Antony Beevor also wrote a good history of the War, which is a bit more succinct as I believe Thomas’ book is around 1000 pages. 

[JSngry]

Ah, I see, you were in Spain at the time. Got it, thanks!

[Brad]

52 minutes ago, JSngry said:

Ah, I see, you were in Spain at the time. Got it, thanks!

Yes, I lived in Barcelona between 1965 and 1967.  We then returned to the US, where I finished high school.  We then moved to Madrid, where my parents lived between 1969 and 1976 and I used to go back at Christmas time and during the summers. 

[erwbol]

Have any of you read The Revolution and the Civil War in Spain by Pierre Broue and Emile Temime?

[Brad]

I’m not familiar with that one but will look into it. 

[erwbol]

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/184895.The_Revolution_And_The_Civil_War_In_Spain#other_reviews

https://www.amazon.co.uk/REVOLUTION-CIVIL-SPAIN-Pierre-Broue/product-reviews/1931859515/ref=cm_cr_dp_d_acr_sr?ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews

Edited July 26, 2018 by erwbol

[paul secor]

Man in Profile - Joseph Mitchell of the New Yorker by Thomas Kunkel

[Brad]

13 minutes ago, paul secor said:

Man in Profile - Joseph Mitchell of the New Yorker by Thomas Kunkel

Enjoyed the book. A profile of an interesting man. 

[paul secor]

8 hours ago, Brad said:

Enjoyed the book. A profile of an interesting man. 

 

8 hours ago, Brad said:

Enjoyed the book. A profile of an interesting man. 

I felt the same way.

[Brad]

Jill Lepore is supposed to be writing a book about Joe Gould. I think she contends that Mitchell took advantage of him. I know, from reading Mitchell’s bio, that he took a few narrative liberties but his articles were still great. 

[paul secor]

26 minutes ago, Brad said:

Jill Lepore is supposed to be writing a book about Joe Gould. I think she contends that Mitchell took advantage of him. I know, from reading Mitchell’s bio, that he took a few narrative liberties but his articles were still great. 

Lepore did write a book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/27071492-joe-gould-s-teeth?ac=1&from_search=true

I haven't read the book, but I read the original article that she wrote for The New Yorker, and there wasn't much to that. From most of the reviews, it doesn't seem that there was much to what she came up with. Joseph Mitchell seems to have gotten it right in his mid 60's New Yorker articles and later book.

[Brad]

4 minutes ago, paul secor said:

Lepore did write a book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/27071492-joe-gould-s-teeth?ac=1&from_search=true

I haven't read the book, but I read the original article that she wrote for The New Yorker, and there wasn't much to that. From most of the reviews, it doesn't seem that there was much to what she came up with. Joseph Mitchell seems to have gotten it right in his mid 60's New Yorker articles and later book.

Thanks. I read the article but wasn’t impressed, a rarity with her articles.  

[Brad]

On 7/25/2018 at 10:38 AM, Brad said:

I finished this just now.  It’s sort of a precursor or preamble to The Spy Who Came In From the Cold.  I have to confess to never having read it before. 

[mjazzg]

14 hours ago, Brad said:

I finished this just now.  It’s sort of a precursor or preamble to The Spy Who Came In From the Cold.  I have to confess to never having read it before. 

That's interesting. I recently finished 'An Honourable Schoolboy' which I thought a tremendous read. This got me thinking I really needed to read the other Smiley/Karla series (I've only read 'Tinker, Tailor...', years ago) before reading the copy of 'A Legacy Of Spies' that's sitting here. Looks like I may need to start with this then.

[Brad]

1 hour ago, mjazzg said:

That's interesting. I recently finished 'An Honourable Schoolboy' which I thought a tremendous read. This got me thinking I really needed to read the other Smiley/Karla series (I've only read 'Tinker, Tailor...', years ago) before reading the copy of 'A Legacy Of Spies' that's sitting here. Looks like I may need to start with this then.

Before reading a Legacy of Spies, I recommend reading The Spy who came in from the Cold. It will make more sense then. A Call for the Dead introduces characters like Smiley and Guillam and one other I won’t name as I don’t want to ruin the surprise. 

[mjazzg]

1 hour ago, Brad said:

Before reading a Legacy of Spies, I recommend reading The Spy who came in from the Cold. It will make more sense then. A Call for the Dead introduces characters like Smiley and Guillam and one other I won’t name as I don’t want to ruin the surprise. 

Thanks Brad, that's helpful guidance. I had intended to read 'The Spy...' next up but now I'll insert 'A Call for the Dead' ahead of it. 'Legacy Of Spies' is definitely last on the list although already purchased on a whim.

All of those come after learning why Barca always were the team for me to prefer in Spain but now with evidence . The diabolical theft of Di Stefano...and other sins and I haven't even got to Sergio Ramos yet!

Edited July 29, 2018 by mjazzg