are there jazz standards you strongly dislike?

[JSngry]

Tempo. Most people got three tempos in them. Them that's got more stands a chance.

[Peter Friedman]

I don't tend to dislike jazz versions of GAS songs even those played very frequently, such as many named above. I still very much like to hear Willow Weep For Me, All The Things You Are,

What Is This Thing Called Love, Stella By Starlight, Lady Be Good, Sweet Georgia Brown, etc.

But certain tunes written by jazz musicians I find overdone and often uninteresting. The ones I prefer not to hear include

Blues March, Satin Doll, Mood Indigo, Round Midnight, Caravan, Take The A Train, Take 5, A Child Is Born, & Undecided.

Of course it all comes down to who are the musicians playing a tune, and the specific performance.

Even the tunes I dislike, or have become tired of hearing can be enjoyable in certain cases.

[colinmce]

I have never heard a version of either "Stella" or "Valentine" that didn't bore me stiff. Torpid and melodically inert, both. I would also say "Lullabye of Birdland", but Lee Konitz's recent version on the ECM album takes it someplace.

I love "Someone to Watch Over Me" but haven't really ever heard a satisfying jazz performance of it.

[Mark Stryker]

There's a very nice version of Silver's "The Outlaw" on the SF album. Did anyone else ever cover that excellent composition?

Two nice covers of "The Outlaw" come to mind:

Trumpeter Brian Lynch recorded it on "Peer Pressure" (Criss Cross) in the mid' 80s with Ralph Moore, Jim Snidero (out on this track) Kirk Lightsey, Jay Anderson and Victor Lewis. http://www.amazon.com/Peer-Pressure-Brian-Lynch/dp/B000A1QMSI/ref=sr_1_23?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1333476135&sr=1-23

It's on youtube here:

Then there's the Blue Note 7, a band formed in conjunction with Blue Note's 70th anniversary in 2009 (Ravi Coltrane, Steve Wilson, Nicholas Payton, Peter Bernstein, Bill Charlap, Peter Washington, Lewis Nash.) I thought the studio record they made was dull, but "The Outlaw" was one of the stronger tracks. More interesting: I heard the group live after touring for a while with the material and by then it was animiated, loose and a lot of fun.

Here's a taste of their "The Outlaw" from youtube.

Edited April 3, 2012 by Mark Stryker

[colinmce]

Also not a fan of "Round Midnight" aside from Monk.

[Pete C]

I love "Someone to Watch Over Me" but haven't really ever heard a satisfying jazz performance of it.

Not even Ben Webster? For me, he owns it.

[Pete C]

It's like jazz's Send in the Clowns or even its Feelings

One could easily make a compilation of Sarah Vaughan performances of songs detested on Organissimo. She also did Love Story and Rainy Days and Mondays.

[Larry Kart]

I have never heard a version of either "Stella" or "Valentine" that didn't bore me stiff. Torpid and melodically inert, both. I would also say "Lullabye of Birdland", but Lee Konitz's recent version on the ECM album takes it someplace.

I love "Someone to Watch Over Me" but haven't really ever heard a satisfying jazz performance of it.

Handsome "Someone" by Brookmeyer here, followed by Zoot's lovely "My Old Flame":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1M0adkRMFP0

[felser]

"Blue Monk"

[Larry Kart]

There's a very nice version of Silver's "The Outlaw" on the SF album. Did anyone else ever cover that excellent composition?

Two nice covers of "The Outlaw" come to mind:

Trumpeter Brian Lynch recorded it on "Peer Pressure" (Criss Cross) in the mid' 80s with Ralph Moore, Jim Snidero (out on this track) Kirk Lightsey, Jay Anderson and Victor Lewis. http://www.amazon.com/Peer-Pressure-Brian-Lynch/dp/B000A1QMSI/ref=sr_1_23?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1333476135&sr=1-23

It's on youtube here:

Then there's the Blue Note 7, a band formed in conjunction with Blue Note's 70th anniversary in 2009 (Ravi Coltrane, Steve Wilson, Nicholas Payton, Peter Bernstein, Bill Charlap, Peter Washington, Lewis Nash.) I thought the studio record they made was dull, but "The Outlaw" was one of the stronger tracks. More interesting: I heard the group live after touring for a while with the material and by then it was animiated, loose and a lot of fun.

Here's a taste of their "The Outlaw" from youtube.

Don't care for either of those versions. Like Dameron's "Tadd's Delight," with its similarly shifting accents, it's a hard tune to get right rhythmically, and Horace and Louis Hayes do both times -- on the original recording with Art Farmer and Clifford Jordan and at Newport in 1958 with Blue Mitchell and Junior Cook. Indeed, by comparison with Hayes, the normally fine Victor Lewis sounds quite "off" and jumpy to me with Lynch's group -- perhaps through lack of enough rehearsal time. Also, particularly on the original recording the horns get a lovely "glide" feel going; the accents are hit but also are somehow sort of slid into/rounded off. I think that's what the piece calls for. Horace was something else.

[colinmce]

I have heard both the Webster and Sims-Brookmeyer renditions. I enjoy them but there's still just a je ne sais quoi about the more straightforward vocal versions I've heard.

[king ubu]

I used to stronly dislike "Somewhere Over the Rainbow", but that changed... not just because of but also thanks to Judy Garland (yea, can you believe it?)

I can believe it. Judy Garland is often maligned as campy and fake, but she usually strikes me as very real and sincere.

I have never heard a version of either "Stella" or "Valentine" that didn't bore me stiff. Torpid and melodically inert, both. I would also say "Lullabye of Birdland", but Lee Konitz's recent version on the ECM album takes it someplace.

Try Konitz, he does "Stella" very often and I've never been bored a bit by his takes on it!

[colinmce]

Lee should almost be exempt from this conversation. I think he could make just about any tune into something interesting.

[Larry Kart]

Lee can play anything.

I once heard Roscoe Mitchell and Maurice McIntyre play the crap out of "Happy Birthday" and not at all in a joking manner.

P.S. I see that Colin and I think alike.

[BeBop]

Lee should almost be exempt from this conversation. I think he could make just about any tune into something interesting.

Rather like Lennie Tristano, methinks.

[king ubu]

Yeah, I brought Lee in because the tone of this thread is a bit too... generalizing for my linking

[aparxa]

I second "Blue Monk".

[Mark Stryker]

There's a very nice version of Silver's "The Outlaw" on the SF album. Did anyone else ever cover that excellent composition?

Two nice covers of "The Outlaw" come to mind:

Trumpeter Brian Lynch recorded it on "Peer Pressure" (Criss Cross) in the mid' 80s with Ralph Moore, Jim Snidero (out on this track) Kirk Lightsey, Jay Anderson and Victor Lewis. http://www.amazon.com/Peer-Pressure-Brian-Lynch/dp/B000A1QMSI/ref=sr_1_23?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1333476135&sr=1-23

It's on youtube here:

Then there's the Blue Note 7, a band formed in conjunction with Blue Note's 70th anniversary in 2009 (Ravi Coltrane, Steve Wilson, Nicholas Payton, Peter Bernstein, Bill Charlap, Peter Washington, Lewis Nash.) I thought the studio record they made was dull, but "The Outlaw" was one of the stronger tracks. More interesting: I heard the group live after touring for a while with the material and by then it was animiated, loose and a lot of fun.

Here's a taste of their "The Outlaw" from youtube.

Don't care for either of those versions. Like Dameron's "Tadd's Delight," with its similarly shifting accents, it's a hard tune to get right rhythmically, and Horace and Louis Hayes do both times -- on the original recording with Art Farmer and Clifford Jordan and at Newport in 1958 with Blue Mitchell and Junior Cook. Indeed, by comparison with Hayes, the normally fine Victor Lewis sounds quite "off" and jumpy to me with Lynch's group -- perhaps through lack of enough rehearsal time. Also, particularly on the original recording the horns get a lovely "glide" feel going; the accents are hit but also are somehow sort of slid into/rounded off. I think that's what the piece calls for. Horace was something else.

I hear you. Part of it might have been rehearsal issues but also the pick-up group vs. working band and recording today with head phones/isolation booths. More importantly probably, the whole hard bop rhythmic language and feel of the '50s/'60s is just very, very difficult to reproduce (though can be done) and a tune like "The Outlaw" that digs deep into the DNA of that feel is going to highlight any awkwardness. As great as Victor Lewis is -- and he's a hero of mine -- his fundamental conception of swing (and Latin) is really rooted in post-bop (60s -- TonyElvinJackBillyHart) rather than '50s hard bop, though he of course knows that language too, but it's certainly not his bread and butter.

One correction: you have Blue Mitchell on the Newport '58 recording but it's actually Louis Smith.

[Larry Kart]

"More importantly probably, the whole hard bop rhythmic language and feel of the '50s/'60s is just very, very difficult to reproduce..."

Sure is. Just listen to the Davis Quintet play "Tadd's Delight" and imagine any group of players today getting that feel.

[Pete C]

My favorite vocal version of Someone to Watch Over Me:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvTvR4DpWTc

Edited April 3, 2012 by Pete C

[PHILLYQ]

Don't hear it much these days, except on earlier records but, back in the 60's, "Sunny" drove me nuts (not in a good way) when I heard it.

Yes, but Pat Martino playing it live is amazing.

i've never ever :blush: :blush: been able to hack jitterburg waltz in any incarnation, including the one with woody shaw i'm now hearing.

If it EVER gets reissued on cd, Arthur Blythe did a great version on 'In The Tradition'.

[PHILLYQ]

I used to stronly dislike "Somewhere Over the Rainbow", but that changed... not just because of but also thanks to Judy Garland (yea, can you believe it?)

Jeff Beck did a nice version of it:

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=jeff+beck%2Fsomewhere+over+the+rainbow&oq=jeff+beck%2Fsomewhere+over+the+rainbow&aq=f&aqi=g-C7&aql=&gs_l=youtube-psuggest.3..0i33l7.4172l21560l0l22065l36l36l0l1l1l0l368l4872l12j21j1j1l35l0.

[jeffcrom]

The material is immaterial. Yeah, there are tunes I don't like as "tunes." But there are always musicians who can make something incredible out of them.

[JSngry]

The material is immaterial. Yeah, there are tunes I don't like as "tunes." But there are always musicians who can make something incredible out of them.

Yeah, Dave Liebman tells the story of him telling Miles that he was having a hard time finding something new to play on Stella, to which Miles replied, "well, don't blame the tune!".

[Mark Stryker]

"More importantly probably, the whole hard bop rhythmic language and feel of the '50s/'60s is just very, very difficult to reproduce..."

Sure is. Just listen to the Davis Quintet play "Tadd's Delight" and imagine any group of players today getting that feel.

Closing the circle: Far from comprehensive Amazon search yields two other contemporary covers of "The Outlaw," neither of which I've heard.

Joe Chambers: http://www.amazon.com/Outlaw-Joe-Chambers/dp/B000E40Q6K/ref=sr_1_9?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1333543717&sr=1-9

Danny D'Imperio: http://www.amazon.com/The-Outlaw-Danny-Group-DImperio/dp/B00000JFRP/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1333544183&sr=1-1

Edited April 4, 2012 by Mark Stryker