All Things Hat

[romualdo]

33 minutes ago, Late said:

Yes. 15 tracks total.

though I think the Hat release is missing the spoken intros by Peter Bergman

[jlhoots]

I don't have the Revenant box, so I bought it. Not the Revenant box, this new ezz-thetics La Cave issue.

Edited February 3, 2022 by jlhoots

[jk666]

I lusted after all the Hat Art releases when I was working at HMV. The retail prices were around $21, but with the employee discount they were around $13. I wish I had bought more at the time. 

Some of my favorites:

Zorn/Lewis/Frisell - News For Lulu and More News For Lulu

Horace Tapscott - The Dark Tree Vol. 1 & 2

Myra Melford Trio

Bley/Koglmann/Peacock - Annette

I'd say it's worth picking any of them up if you see them in the wild.

 

[jlhoots]

8 minutes ago, jk666 said:

I lusted after all the Hat Art releases when I was working at HMV. The retail prices were around $21, but with the employee discount they were around $13. I wish I had bought more at the time. 

Some of my favorites:

Zorn/Lewis/Frisell - News For Lulu and More News For Lulu

Horace Tapscott - The Dark Tree Vol. 1 & 2

Myra Melford Trio

Bley/Koglmann/Peacock - Annette

I'd say it's worth picking any of them up if you see them in the wild.

 

Those are all great.

[Late]

On 2/3/2022 at 9:26 PM, romualdo said:

I think the Hat release is missing the spoken intros by Peter Bergman

I think they're tacked on to the opening tracks (without track separation). I could be wrong though.

14 hours ago, jlhoots said:

I don't have the Revenant box, so I bought it. Not the Revenant box, this new ezz-thetics La Cave issue.

Same! (Hasn't arrived yet.)

[jlhoots]

8 hours ago, Late said:

I think they're tacked on to the opening tracks (without track separation). I could be wrong though.

Same! (Hasn't arrived yet.)

Mine is supposed to arrive on Monday.

[Late]

[MomsMobley]

On 10/5/2021 at 4:14 AM, David Ayers said:

 

Assuming that they can sell CDs at all, which judging by this reissue program they can, it seems like a good idea to pull out these two titles. I hope that we can avoid another “is it legit?“ debate…

well, what * is * it then? and "remastered" from what? WTF are Hat playing at here, becoming a public domain label MUCH less interesting / intrepid than Fresh Sounds (say) or ?? Even if "out of print," why give them anything doing inferior borrowings from Blue Note and here Impulse (the Cecil half of "Into The Hot," because they know better than Gil Evans / Creed Taylor / Nat Hentoff that one should never mix CT & John Carisi?)

Angkor Wat - YouTube

wow, it looks like Werner X. has a "statement," in addition to soliciting donations

I can't upload a second image but PLEASE, scroll down to their Anthony Williams "borrowing" & note the production credits - Alfred Lion NOT included! (Edit - I got snip of producer credits, sorry the resolution is poor.)

Eff Hat.

thank G-D Werner X and friends had the artistic vision and means to record young Anthony, old(er) Sam, et al.

Edited March 4, 2022 by MomsMobley

[mikeweil]

Switzerland is not part of the European Union. Do they have their own copyright regulations? That they do not credit the original session producers indicates, to me, that they did not license the Blue Note recordings.

You would be amazed by what a good engineer like Pfister can do with any CD or other source. I once got a demonstration by a local audio technician who transferred a good sounding LP into a bad sounding and vice versa. When I got the Charlie Parker CDs Pfister remastered I wondered what sources he used. But they probably will not tell.

Edited March 4, 2022 by mikeweil

[MomsMobley]

Mike, I'm a great admirer of Pfister though on the same page Werner notes that Peter is no longer involved with Hat. (Retirement?)

I * was * also a great admirer of Hat going back to the actual Hat logo, the pizza boxes, the superior, mostly red & white designed jewel case CDs etc.

We are all in that of debt-- & Credit Suisse or whoever was the big sponsor for years.

That Werner feels the need to go public domain for $$ * AND * & to outwardly erase those records true historical / cultural / economic provenance -- ALFRED LION & FRANCIS WOLFF; Reid Miles design Blue Note -- is to me unconscionable.

Werner X should bow down to the Blue Note / Impulse etc shrines of his choice to this day; instead, he's playing the common thief, crediting THREE producers on that Tony Williams release... none of whom are named Alfred Lion.

Why? Werner's ego? 

Who's Teo Macero?

Eff Werner X. Uhlinger

Edited March 4, 2022 by MomsMobley

[JSngry]

Gotta love how they have an Honorary Producer, an Executive Producer, and an Associate Producer, but no actual Producer.

Some of the earlier releases had appropriate source-crediting, but stuff like this is just not cool.

[mikeweil]

4 hours ago, MomsMobley said:

Mike, I'm a great admirer of Pfister though on the same page Werner notes that Peter is no longer involved with Hat. (Retirement?)

You're right - some guy unknown to me is credited for remastering the Cherry and Williams reissues. Pfister did the Charlie Parker, but I like the JSP remasters better.

[jazzbo]

Yeah. . . this series has essentially become gray-market bootlegs so to speak, and I haven't been crazy about the sound of many of those I have. But it's nice to see some of this stuff coming out and available.

[Rooster_Ties]

Just seeing the recent postings in this thread about the Cherry / Williams / Taylor titles — which I had noticed on the Dusty Groove site a few weeks ago.

So, they’re NOT legitimately licensed??

Son of a bitch. So there goes my brilliant idea of trying to get them to license The Trainwreck and finally releasing it that way (via Hat).

I’m mean, The Trainwreck deserves a proper Blue Note release (and cover!!) — but if the only way to get it out (legit) was via Hat, I would have taken it.

But I guess that’s even more of a pipe dream than it already was (even if these Cherry / Williams / Taylor 2-fers were legit).

ALSO, are those the only 3 BN artists Hat has done dirty like that? All this PD stuff rubs me the wrong way, and I try to avoid all of it like the plague.

[JSngry]

Ornette.

But Tone Poet ain't doing that right either 

[Late]

Sale through March 17th.

[T.D.]

On 3/3/2022 at 6:26 PM, Rooster_Ties said:

Just seeing the recent postings in this thread about the Cherry / Williams / Taylor titles — which I had noticed on the Dusty Groove site a few weeks ago.

So, they’re NOT legitimately licensed??

Son of a bitch. So there goes my brilliant idea of trying to get them to license The Trainwreck and finally releasing it that way (via Hat).

I’m mean, The Trainwreck deserves a proper Blue Note release (and cover!!) — but if the only way to get it out (legit) was via Hat, I would have taken it.

But I guess that’s even more of a pipe dream than it already was (even if these Cherry / Williams / Taylor 2-fers were legit).

ALSO, are those the only 3 BN artists Hat has done dirty like that? All this PD stuff rubs me the wrong way, and I try to avoid all of it like the plague.

I've recently seen an awful lot of grey market Hat reissues on the Dusty Groove site. Not that many Blue Notes, but they're starting to plunder the Impulse! (e.g. Archie Shepp) and Riverside (e.g. George Russell) catalogs. YMMV, but this also rubs me the wrong way and I find it highly disappointing. Have purchased a lot of Hats over the years but may stop.

[Pim]

16 hours ago, T.D. said:

I've recently seen an awful lot of grey market Hat reissues on the Dusty Groove site. Not that many Blue Notes, but they're starting to plunder the Impulse! (e.g. Archie Shepp) and Riverside (e.g. George Russell) catalogs. YMMV, but this also rubs me the wrong way and I find it highly disappointing. Have purchased a lot of Hats over the years but may stop.

This…. And I also would not know why I would buy material I already own in a better (and original) form. Never liked their packaging too either so if I don’t have to buy a Hat release I don’t and get it on another original and more legal label.

[Д.Д.]

A lot of (justified) scorn for Hat Hut for going the dreaded public domain route. However, Hat Hut in its new ezz-thetics incarnation has put out a lot of really good albums of new music by contemporary musicians that nobody here seems to give a fuck about. What do you want Hat Hut to release?      

[colinmce]

56 minutes ago, Д.Д. said:

A lot of (justified) scorn for Hat Hut for going the dreaded public domain route. However, Hat Hut in its new ezz-thetics incarnation has put out a lot of really good albums of new music by contemporary musicians that nobody here seems to give a fuck about. What do you want Hat Hut to release?      

Agreed, there have been a lot of great ones since this imprint started up. As for the Revisited line, I do think the Ayler items are legit as he's been working with Ayler's estate since the hatOLOGY era and there's a tangible value in having this music available and in the best possible SQ. I wish he would've done more/better with Fontana. The Blue Note and Impulse! items, as well as the live Trane & Miles stuff, is ludicrous to me. 

[Late]

On 8/29/2022 at 12:39 PM, Д.Д. said:

A lot of (justified) scorn for Hat Hut for going the dreaded public domain route. However, Hat Hut in its new ezz-thetics incarnation has put out a lot of really good albums of new music by contemporary musicians that nobody here seems to give a fuck about. What do you want Hat Hut to release?      

Good point.

The first ezz-thetics release, Jimmy Giuffre's 1961 Graz concert, had never seen a digital release; I was grateful for that one. I'd like to see Hat go that route—finding live concerts that have never seen a digital release. There's an even rarer Giuffre concert from 1961, recorded in Tübingen. The vinyl sounds awful. A cleaned up digital version would be very welcome.

[Д.Д.]

13 hours ago, Late said:

Good point.

The first ezz-thetics release, Jimmy Giuffre's 1961 Graz concert, had never seen a digital release; I was grateful for that one. I'd like to see Hat go that route—finding live concerts that have never seen a digital release. There's an even rarer Giuffre concert from 1961, recorded in Tübingen. The vinyl sounds awful. A cleaned up digital version would be very welcome.

Well, by "contemporary musicians" I did not mean the the guys who recorded in 1961.   

Edited December 10, 2022 by Д.Д.

[Late]

20 minutes ago, Д.Д. said:

Well, by "contemporary musicians," I did not mean the guys who recorded in 1961.   

Yes, I know. 😉 I was responding to your question: "What do you want Hat Hut to release?"

[Д.Д.]

 

[colinmce]

Still have a lot of qualms about this whole enterprise, but it's nice to see him moving back towards Fontana and BYG (and to a far lesser extent, ESP). There is also a disc that combines both Noah Howard ESP albums and one that appears to combine Ketchoua and Scorpio both forthcoming. The NYAQ and Howard also don't have any tracks missing, which is good. If he could get Other Afternoons on CD for the first time (maybe paired with the Cyrille solo BYG?) then we'd be getting *somewhere*.

But to keep the negativity flowing, the (admittedly "official") Ayler disc combining Spiritual Unity and a paltry 2 tracks from My Name Is Albert Ayler is ridiculous.