Ellington During the Recording Ban

[Teasing the Korean]

I have tons of Duke's studio recordings from all phases of his career, but have nothing recorded for V discs or radio; and very few live items.

In particular, I'm wondering what Ellington is out there dating from the recording ban, which from my understanding runs from August 1942 to late 1944.

In particular, I'm interested in tunes or arrangements that weren't commercially recorded before or after, and also any noteworthy soloists working with Duke who were unrepresented or underrepresented on commercial recordings before or after.

I prefer CDs, but am open to LPs, of course. Preferably stuff that hasn't been no-noised to death.

Feel free to post comprehensive listings, if you have them, but I'd also like to know if there are certain titles that are hands down must-haves.

Thanks in advance.

[ghost of miles]

 

On 4/8/2011 at 7:27 PM, Teasing the Korean said:

I have tons of Duke's studio recordings from all phases of his career, but have nothing recorded for V discs or radio; and very few live items.

 

In particular, I'm wondering what Ellington is out there dating from the recording ban, which from my understanding runs from August 1942 to late 1944.

 

In particular, I'm interested in tunes or arrangements that weren't commercially recorded before or after, and also any noteworthy soloists working with Duke who were unrepresented or underrepresented on commercial recordings before or after.

 

I prefer CDs, but am open to LPs, of course. Preferably stuff that hasn't been no-noised to death.

 

Feel free to post comprehensive listings, if you have them, but I'd also like to know if there are certain titles that are hands down must-haves.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

 

Very interested in this topic myself, TTK--was just talking to a friend about it last week (PM forthcoming). Definitely check out the first three volumes of Circle's DKE World transcriptions (though V. 3 straddles a 1943 and a 1945 session). You're already hip to the 1943 Carnegie Hall concerts (January on Prestige, December on Storyville), I'm sure, but look for the Storyville CD of Duke's 1943 Hurricane broadcasts. (And there's a lot more material from that stand that circulates... I wish a reputable label could gather it all together and issue it as a nice set.) Several of the Treasury 2-CD sets (which cover 1945-46) also include a few broadcasts from 1943.

 

EDIT: there are seven 1943 DKE recordings featuring Betty Roche on this Night Lights show: When Betty Met The Duke. Roche is definitely (IMHO) a generally underrepresented-on-record DKE orchestra member worth seeking out.

Edited January 13, 2021 by ghost of miles

[J.A.W.]

I prefer CDs, but am open to LPs, of course. Preferably stuff that hasn't been no-noised to death.

You're already hip to the 1943 Carnegie Hall concerts (January on Prestige, December on Storyville), I'm sure

The Prestige Carnegie Hall Concerts CDs are no-noised to death. The sound is as dead as can be...

[ghost of miles]

J.A.W. is right re: Prestige Carnegie. That's one to seek out on LP rather than CD if possible.

[Chuck Nessa]

If it is the only way, get the music.

[jeffcrom]

If you can find this 3-CD collection of V-Discs at a reasonable price, it would be worth hearing. There is some incredible music here, including things that Ellington never recorded in the studio at the time, like the complete "Deep South Suite" and "New World a-Comin'." Unfortunately, there is no documentation included, and it's a discographical mess. There are live recordings, studio sides made specifically for V-Disc, and poor transfers of already-released commercial recordings. Some years ago I spent a few hours among the discographies, and I think I have all the correct info for all the tracks, so if you get it, let me know - I'll pass along my info.

[Ken Dryden]

There was also a second recording ban that took up most of 1948.

Among the things issued from that era:

a Nov. 1948 Carnegie Hall concert on the long defunct VJC label (2 CDs)

a series of Raretone LPs originating from broadcasts at Click Restaurant in Philadelphia in Nov. 1948

a Dec. 1948 concert at Cornell University, issued by Musicmasters, reissued by Nimbus

[Tom in RI]

Regarding the 1943 Carnegie concert on vinyl, would the issue to look for be the Book of the Month Club? When I saw the thread title I 1st thought of the 1948 ban as Ben Webster was briefly back and I don't think there are any commercial recordings to document his second, short stay with Ellington.

Hey Ken, you are up early.

Edited April 9, 2011 by Tom in RI

[Ken Dryden]

Also, didn't some of the CD reissues of the Prestige LPs of Carnegie Hall Concerts delete some material? I seem to recall that, though I never replaced any of my LP sets.

[medjuck]

I think the cds are teh same as the Lps but neither contain the complete concerts. There were 2 concerts in 1943, one in January and one in December. The DEcember one is available from Storyville.

[J.A.W.]

There were 2 concerts in 1943, one in January and one in December. The DEcember one is available from Storyville.

As was mentioned in "'>post #2

[miles65]

The "A Duke Ellington Panorama" site (http://www.depanorama.net/) has a discographical section.

The most complete disco of Duke Ellington is Luciano Massagli - Giovanni Volonté "The New Desor" (Desor = Duke Ellington Story On Records). Published in 1999. Updates to this book are made available 3 times a year on the NDesor section of the Ellington Panorama site. I don't know if it is still available somewhere. I got it from Norbert Ruecker Jazz Books some years ago. It's no longer in his catalogue.

Alternatives are:

Eric Raben: Jazz Records 1942-1980 vol. 6 Duke Ellington

W.E. Timner: Ellingtonia The Recorded Music of Duke Ellington and His Sidemen (Scarecrow Press 2007 5th edition).

[Teasing the Korean]

Thanks all for the replies; it looks like there's a lot out there from both '43 and '44; I haven't even scratched the second half of 1942 yet.

[djcavanagh]

On 09/04/2011 at 3:59 AM, jeffcrom said:

If you can find this 3-CD collection of V-Discs at a reasonable price, it would be worth hearing. There is some incredible music here, including things that Ellington never recorded in the studio at the time, like the complete "Deep South Suite" and "New World a-Comin'." Unfortunately, there is no documentation included, and it's a discographical mess. There are live recordings, studio sides made specifically for V-Disc, and poor transfers of already-released commercial recordings. Some years ago I spent a few hours among the discographies, and I think I have all the correct info for all the tracks, so if you get it, let me know - I'll pass along my info.

I don't suppose anyone has @jeffcrom 's breakdown of the 3cd Collector's Choice set? I've just messaged him, but I'm not sure if he still looks in on the forum.

 

Thanks in advance

 

Denis

[hopkins]

There's the Chronological Classics 1942-1944 which contains a number of studio recordings: https://www.discogs.com/Duke-Ellington-And-His-Orchestra-1942-1944/release/11083875

The Chronological Classics does not include all recordings on November 8, 9 & December 1, 1943...

The full list of songs recorded on the two November dates are available on this LP: https://www.discogs.com/Duke-Ellington-And-His-Orchestra-Volume-1-1943/release/13897041. Check this one as well for the December date: https://www.discogs.com/Duke-Ellington-The-Transcription-Years-Volume-1/release/8232409

I have not listened to the full sets. Here is what Eddie Lambert has to say about these sessions (from "A Listener's Guide" - he also wrote the liner notes to one of the above LPs):

"The only studio sessions by the Ellington Orchestra during 1943 inaugurated their series for World Transcriptions. Like the earlier Standard and later Capitol Transcriptions, these have excellent sound quality. A number of them were issued on LP. The first sessions for World were on November 8 and 9, 1943. On the first, the trumpets were temporarily down to three-Jones, Stewart and Jordan-while bassist Wilson Myers subbed for Raglin. On the second, Nance and Baker returned to make the trumpets five, and Raglin was back in place of Myers."

"The established Ellington repertoire recorded on these dates included C Jam Blues; Mood Indigo (with Carney playing the clarinet part); Rockin' In Rhythm (an exciting reading of the score with Carney taking over Bigard's part here too, as he had done on the Carnegie Hall performance); another excellent version of Boy Meets Horn (the one issued on VDisc); Do Nothin' Til You Hear From Me (the pop version of Concerto For Cootie featuring Hibbler and Brown); Sentimental Lady; Main Stem (the excellent version used on VDisc); A Slip Of The Lip; Things Ain't What They Used To Be (another excellent performance also found on V-Disc) and Caravan."

"New numbers included three vocal features for Roche on I Wonder Why, Go Away Blues, and I Don't Want Anybody At All, while Hibbler is heard in Gershwin's Summertime. Johnny Hodges is featured in Hop, Skip and Jump (another V-Disc issue), a score later slightly modified and retitled Rockabye River. Baby Please Stop And Think About Me is a new Ellington song in a nonvocal version featuring Nance and Hamilton, as well as a rather conventional tenor solo by Skippy Williams. Three Cent Stomp (a number on the Stompy Jones chords written to celebrate the controversial issue of a three-cent stamp) remained in the book for a number of years; this initial version featured Baker, Nanton, Nance, Raglin, Stewart, and Williams. During the brief absence of Stewart in mid-1943, Jordan, a former star of the Chick Webb band, had been brought into the Ellington Orchestra, and he was retained on Stewart's return. He is featured on Tea For Two from the series of "Variations On Themes," which presented leading Ellington soloists on standard material. Another one of these, Ain't Misbehavin' featuring Baker, was also recorded at this session. (Other "Variations On Themes," apparently arranged by Mary Lou Williams, were showcases for Hamilton on Honeysuckle Rose, Brown on Somebody Loves Me, and Baker again, on Stardust.) The World Transcription recording of Tea For Two is an admirable setting for Jordan's playing, displaying his sprightly phrasing and powerful swing, while Baker's more mellow trumpet style is poised and restrained on Ain't Misbehavin'. Also recorded at the November 8 session was another arrangement by Mary Lou Williams destined to become famous. The score is based on Irving Berlin's Blue Skies and features Jordan, Brown, Williams, Stewart, Hodges, and Hamilton. Later it became a feature for the trumpet section under the title of Trumpet No End and as such was a regular showstopper at Ellington concerts."

"A further session for World Transcriptions took place on December 1, 1943, and again mixed previously recorded Ellingtonia and new material. Fresh versions were cut of It Don't Mean A Thing (with vocal duet by Nance and Jordan); Johnny Come Lately; Creole Love Call (the version issued on V-Disc, with, unusually, Baker taking the growl solo and Carney both the clarinet choruses); Jack The Bear; Harlem Airshaft (a particularly fine version); and Ring Dem Bells (still in the 1930 arrangement). In addition there was a superb new Rose Room, based on the 1933 arrangement and featuring Hamilton, Brown, and Hodges. Two more of the "Variations On Themes" were recorded at this date-Hamilton's Honeysuckle Rose and Brown's Somebody Loves Me. A second showcase for Jordan, Chopsticks, is another enjoyable score-simple, swinging music which also features Ellington's piano and reminds us that as well as producing concert works Duke could always turn his hand to creating elemental jazz performances of incomparable quality."

Edited January 13, 2021 by hopkins

[ghost of miles]

On 1/10/2021 at 2:49 PM, djcavanagh said:

I don't suppose anyone has @jeffcrom 's breakdown of the 3cd Collector's Choice set? I've just messaged him, but I'm not sure if he still looks in on the forum.

 

Thanks in advance

 

Denis

I'd be interested in that as well.

[Ken Dryden]

Jazzology put out 9 LPs of World Transcriptions on the Circle label and later reissued 5 CDs of them, all taken from the original glass masters.They include the following sessions:

Novemer 8, 1943

November 9, 1943

December 1, 1943

January 2, 1944

Januar 3, 1944

July 31, 1945

August 7, 1945

The LPs include all incomplete takes and false starts, I don't know if the contents are complete on the 5 CDs.

Edited January 13, 2021 by Ken Dryden

[EKE BBB]

20 hours ago, Ken Dryden said:

Jazzology put out 9 LPs of World Transcriptions on the Circle label and later reissued 5 CDs of them, all taken from the original glass masters.They include the following sessions:

Novemer 8, 1943

November 9, 1943

December 1, 1943

January 2, 1944

Januar 3, 1944

July 31, 1945

August 7, 1945

The LPs include all incomplete takes and false starts, I don't know if the contents are complete on the 5 CDs.

According to Tom Lord Discography, they are. Nevertheless, I will check contents with my CDs tonight.

[hopkins]

I recieved the World Transcriptions Vol 1 LP and it is great. Will take a picture of the liner notes by Eddie Lambert - he is more eloquent than I am. "Stomp Caprice" is a fine Strayhorn composition that was never recorded again, it seems, and features Ellington's piano prominently. Nice version of "Pitter.." (duo with Raglin on bass), and much more... Definitely worthwhile getting these recordings. 

Edited January 25, 2021 by hopkins