BLINDFOLD TEST #4 - DISCUSSION

[king ubu]

I would be surprised if I was to learn that James Brown had recorded with Louis Bellson's orchestra, and with Oliver Nelson arranging.  Anybody (besides Jim, of course) know if that ever happened?

Have a gander at this site and scroll down.

now this record would be a cool one to have!

ubu

It is.

OH HELL! SOMEONE SEND ME SOME $$$ AND I'LL GONNA PICK UP ALMOST EVERY ALBUM FROM YOU F#?&ING BLINDFOLD TEST!

I'm heading directly for bankruptcy!

ubu

[Jim R]

Ok, as for the latest item under debate, I will tell you that the item is listed on AMG under the singer's name, with a photo of the cover, no commentary, and a woefully inaccurate rating. So if you got the patience, you can find it!

Not a whole lotta MEAT (baby), but this could be SWEET!

Uh... I think a few of you guys overlooked this link I posted yesterday. I had already seen the "Ballads" CD compilation at AMG (with the Bellson/Nelson names included), and Jim indicated that he took the track from a non-CD source (pretty obvious the LP is OOP), and gave the hint about the AMG page I linked above. I had been searching for the tune at AMG, and since the LP listing didn't include the song titles, I wasn't finding it that way. So, I Googled™ it and found a King discography, where I got the LP title. Plugged that in at AMG, and voila.

[mikeweil]

After a few more spins of 1-1 I'm pretty sure it is that Horace LP. Found details on the fifth Silveto LP, but that too can't be the one. I suspect Moore and Harris don't play together. This sure is Moore - saw him live with Cedar Walton and know his style quite well.

These Silver Silveto LPs sure would make a nice Mosaic Select!!!!!

Some tracks I have not commented on so far:

Disc 2 - 1: I was pretty sure at first listen this is Chick Corea on Rhodes, Dave Holland on bass and Jack deJohnette on drums, so this has to be the 1969 Eric Kloss LP they recorded for Prestige. Has a vibe similar to Bitches Brew and the Corea "Is" sessions. I like this almost better than their companions ... Kloss was very, very good, a child prodigy that is kind of overlooked in retrospect, but he sure was at the edge of the current developments. Recently got me his Prestige debut sessions with Don Patterson (a Prestige twofer CD), highly recommended, but he had grown considerably and very fast till this here. I dig deJohnette very much on this one, I often find him too busy, but it fits in perfectly here! There is no "Nature Boy" on this LP, but I'm pretty sure about this. This was reissued on CD by Fantasy, I'll get me this one. As Ubu already complained, these Blindfold tests are an assault to our financial resources!

Disc 2 -2: Reminds me of the stuff Kahil el Zabar did. Don't know if it is him. This combination of a hand drummer keeping the earthy groove and the horns blowing freely sure works nice, but I would like to hear the drummer take some chances as well!

2 - 3: No idea - I'm not that much at home with that soul music. I love Marvin Gaye but couldn't say wether that's him. I have heard him do other stuff I like much better.

2-4 to 2-7 I already covered.

2-8: Of course Basie is an obvious guess, but this sounds a little too jumpy to me, and there's something in the sound and phrasing of the tenor making me doubt it is Prez or the Vice-Prez. And I don't hear any Freddie Green!

2-9: I understand many think this is a European live recording of Rollins, but this soemhow doesn't sound like Rollins to me, it is great but he uses some inflections untypical of Rollins, who also has a darker sound. If it is from Europe, the drummer could well be Humair, but he once confessed in an interview he had played with practically every name musician except for Rollins and Miles ..... Like the previous track, I'll patiently wait for the solution.

2-10: As I said, that hollow voice sounds like Percy Mayfield to me. A unique character!

2-11: Read through the discussion on this - I don't know Threadgill's music enough - this is something to check out! Nice mixture of Jazz, African and Carribean grooves.

Additional commentary to Disc 1:

1-13 could well be a Woody Herman Herd track.

1-14 somehow reminds me of the John Lewis / Bill Perkins collaboration with Chico Hamilton and Jim Hall, this is not from that Pacific Jazz disc, but who knows wether they had a reunion ....

1-11 I somehow fell asleep during this and overheard that wargame rap .... no idea.

Thanks a lot Jim for this great and variable anthology - there's some stuff in here I sure will get. Disc 1-2 is the one I'm most curious about.

Edited December 14, 2003 by mikeweil

[Rooster_Ties]

FYI, I just got my BFT#4 in the mail today (Dec. 12th), and I got through about the first 2/3rd of disc #1 this afternoon -- while I was running around town, doing errands.

I should have some thoughts to post about one or both of the discs, hopefully by sometime this weekend.

I've been good, and I haven't looked at this thread -- not even one tiny bit!!!

[RDK]

Alright, moving on to disc 2...

1. This starts out like something that I wouldn't like - too screechy for my tastes - but it quickly settles into something that I'm digging more and more with each listen. The e-piano dates it to the early 70's (at least post-Bitches Brew) but it's probably someone that I'm not familiar with (meaning it's not hancock or corea ). It almost sounds early-ECM-ish, like something Dave Liebman might have done (but I don't think it's him either). Interesting...

2. I know/have this one. Damn it, Jim, this was gonna be on my blindfold test! This is the tune I keep humming long after the disc is over.

3. This is pretty obvious too. May not be jazz, but you can still make out to it...

4. I'm bad at identifying specific players based on tone, but I'm thinking this may be off of one of Ron Carter's (Milestone?) albums from the 70s. Either that or a more modern cat like David Friesen... Nice, but doesn't knock me out. I'm not sure I'd want to listen to an entire album of this.

5. This sounds like a "modern" version of trad jazz - maybe from the late-50's/early 60's revival? No idea as to specific players. The tune itself sounds vaguely familiar...

6. No clue. Not my favorite cut on the disc, but I wouldn't kick it out of bed...

7. I like this, but I can't put my finger on it at all. It's part conventional big band, but has a freer, more modern aspect to it as well (and no piano!). Parts of it reminds me of Andrew Hill's big band album from last year. It's free but still swinging. This is about as far out as I really like to go but still "enjoy" my jazz if you know what I mean. Kinda like Braxton playing the standards.

8. This tune also sounds vaguely familiar - and almost Basie-ish. But not sure...

9. Sonny Rollins? "Doxy?" If not Sonny, then he at least played it at some point as that's who this cut reminds me of.

10. Leon Redbone? I could listen to this stuff all day long. And my wife would dig it too.

11. Man, I like this cut! Latin, but with a tuba? Mike Westbrook goes South o' the Border? (Now *that* would be a cool disc!) The tuba's of course throwing me off, otherwise I might guess Gato Barbieri. Heck, I'll still guess Gato. I'm really digging the various textures and rhythms of this cut. The more I listen to it the more I think I've heard it before - heck, I wouldn't be surprised to learn that I have this at home.

Okay, I'm sure I've embarrassed myself enough for one day...

[Saint Vitus]

1-1. Sounds like something from the 70s (or the early 80s). Pianist first revealed a Tyner influence and then turned into a Horace Silver. Nondescriptive trumpet sound ... it could be anybody. Tenor man's influenced by Coltrane. Can it ever be a more generic opening to the blindfold test? I thought the tune sounded like "I Surrender, Dear" in some spots, but "Ask Me Now"? What did I hear?

1-2. How much did the pianist pay the others to sit back?

1-3. Was the pianist trying deliberately not to swing? All sorts of influences (hints of free playing here, counterpoints there) but I just don't get the point of this.

1-4. This has got to be from a movie soundtrack. Is this Duke Pearson’s arrangement? Sounds similar rhythmically but the brass section is too hot to think it’s Pearson. Bari reminded me of Pepper Adams but it's probably not him. Clarinet sounded nice but the solo was disappointing.

1-5. The band is probably led by a pianist. Reminded me of first Ray Charles and also James Brown … Sounded like a woman but could be a man.

1-6. Is this Rosemary Clooney? Sure sounded like someone from Broadway. Some hint of Streisandism here and there.

1-7. Monk. I think I have this recording ... I'll have to check but if I'm right, I got it from a trade with a fellow member. I like how they leave all the space during the interaction.

[to be continued]

1-8. Tenor is a bit too smooth for my taste.

1-9. I have no reaction to this piece ... except to say it sounds raw and elemental. I thought the main point in making a drum record was to show off.

1-10. A bit more complex rhythm than the last one. Don't think this is Blakey.

1-11. What's with the sound effects thrown in?

1-12. Hey, a waltz section in the middle? These guys must like their Sun Ra records.

1-13. Miles would say this sounds white. Light and gently swinging. Tenor sounds like Zoot.

1-14. Almost like Stan Getz. Don't like the echo ... drowning out the rhythm. Conservative ideas from the pianist ... even though this sounds like it's from the 80s. I like the exchanges of short solo breaks. Drummer must be a name player, huh?

1-15. Walk that walk! A fun record, I should say. Lionel Hampton would be too obvious an answer ... Even the pianist sounds like him ... which brings a thought that it could be either Terry Gibbs or Victor Feldman.

[Kinda late to add comments for Disc 2 ... but before I go to find out the answers here goes ...]

2-1. Fusion done ECM style … Echoes of “Round Midnight” … Corea and Holland, it sounds like … The tenor player sounds so familiar I’m upset I cannot come up with an educated guess. Drum solo brings swinging swagger to the proceeding, but it doesn't quite belong here.

2-2. More swinging grooves! Two brass players compliment one another very well … George Lewis and Lester Bowie? Monk’s influence is everywhere … Was that “I Mean You” these guys are quoting? Tenor has a nice, attractive tone. Today, this type of playing would be considered to be on the conservative side. “Ornette Coleman” chant done like “A Love Supreme”!!!

2-3. Oh, Marvin Gaye!!! Definitely need this record!!! Instruments augment what Marvin’s singing very well … but that’s all they do, which is well and good. And the way the music moves … Got that pulse, and the groove, and the flow … He creates “What’s Going On” with those ingredients, and then builds on it and refine it … Heavenly.

2-4. The guitar player is from the Jaco Pastorius school, which took in more guitar players than it did bass players. I love the mood created by the synth and the piano … but it’s the guitar player who dictates everything. I wish Pat Metheny Group were more like this. The horns jump in late in the game and so does the bass (which adds an altogether different color to the composition). Very nicely thought and done. Like it for what it is, a thinking man’s background music.

2-5. Great! Music from the 30s! But look, it is on stereo!!! What is this??? Tenor listened to Herschel Evans a lot, clearly. This is killing me! Since bass is quite prominent with piano way in the back … this is probably a drummer’s band. One of Armstrong’s all stars? But I didn't hear Louis. I’m stumped.

2-6. Another big band outing … with a spacious arrangement … This sounds as if something’s missing but this was beboppers’ idea of big band music. Alto sounds very nice and piano’s comp sounds very self-assured. Tenor is clunky and piano sound gets murkier with him as well.

2-7. We have something more recent here, but this sounds a bit crowded and tiresome. I cannot listen to this much longer. Horns making runs together to create discords after discords … Been there one too many time, don’t you think?

2-8. It is the Basie outfit … the band that takes swing music down to its essentials. Recording quality is horrible, I should say.

2-9. He’s the best. It’s Sonny Rollins with Henry Grimes and Pete La Roca. His integrity in his approach to improvisation is unquestionable. When he plays, you just shut up and listen.

2-10. A nice bluesy groove … but the vocalist fails to get me. Kinda like a sleazy version of Leonard Cohen. Probably he has many followers but I’m going to have to pass this time.

2-11. The finale … and let’s get this party going … one more time!!! A not-so-subtle New Orleans influence … If only the Marsalis clan were half this fun … Along with the Marvin Gaye record, this one gets the highest mark from me. Being fun without being condescending … what makes listening to music such a joyous experience.

Edited December 26, 2003 by Saint Vitus

[Jim Dye]

FYI, I just got my BFT#4 in the mail today (Dec. 12th)...

Wow! I can't believe it took that long to get there. I sent it out last Saturday?!!?

Must have been slowed down by the high volume this time of year.

Maybe i'll try a different post office next time. Anyone else just get their discs? Anyone not receive them at all?!

Edited December 13, 2003 by Jim Dye

[Dan Gould]

Not sure if you guys are still on Silver's Spiritualizing The Senses for the very first track but I can say definitively that's not it.

[relyles]

Okay. I neglected my children for a little while and gave disc two a listen. For the most part my listening was truly "blind"

1. Not sure how I feel about the special effects on the tenor. I enjoyed the electric piano solo and the tenor after the piano solo. Overall I enjoyed the track - specifically the feeling of intensity and urgency.

2. Sounds like Kahil El'Zabar's Ethnic Heritage Ensemble with I believe Joseph Bowie on trombone and possibly Ed Wilkerson, Jr. on sax. I like the meditative effect of the simple repetitive percussion pattern. Thies piece definately sounds familiar. It is not complicated, but it has a lot of feeling.

3. Before listening to the second disc I did see a reference to a cut featuring Marvin gaye while reading some of the thread. I will assume this is that track although this is not the "sexual healing" Marvin Gaye that is my last memory of him. I think Gaye is one of those most soulful singers ever. I am not familiar with this track. You guys sure this is Marvin Gaye?

4. Pleasant track. Not much more than background music to me as opposed to something that would grab my attention.

5. Nice swinging tune in an older style of the music. Good concise solos by all.

6. When listening to the beginning I was thinking that the ensemble playing reminded me of a Tristano line. By the time we got to the two saxophone solos I was convinced. I have been listening to a lot of Marsh in the past year. By coincidence today I listened to Warne Out. As a result I know Marsh's sound very well. I also think that was Tristano and Konitz, although I am not familiar with any recording they did with a large ensemble. Could be Gary Foster. I always love the interplay that goes on between the horns of Marsh, Konitz and/or Foster. Nice track.

7. There was something about this track that was similar to the Tristano tune in the previous track except faster. For some reason I kept thinking about Anthony Braxton - not because I know he was a fan of Konitz and Marsh - but because of something I heard in the phrasing in the ensemble section. I really liked the first baritone solo and the arrangement of the piece as a whole. If you are going to have an expanded instrumentation you might as well use all the horns.

8. An older recording. Is the tenor Lester Young? Something in the tenor solo sounded like this person could have been an influence on Marsh.

9. Familiar bebop tune although I do not know the name of it. Tenor sounds a little like Lew Tabackin or Bennie Wallace, but I am pretty sure it is not either. Nice tenor work nonetheless. Confident solo with a muscular attack and tone.

10. Vocalist that sounds vaguely familiar, but does nothing for me.

11. Sounds a lot like Henry Threadgill's Very Very Circus - or in the alternative some African music. I always liked threadgill, and the Very Very Circus is one of my favorite groups of his. The use of guitar and the low end of Tubas was always fascinating and noone writes tunes like Threadgill.

Wow. I listened to both discs. I am almost proud of myself. Yo Jim, where is the Quartet Out track?

[RDK]

Yeah, and which one's George Coleman?

[RDK]

Okay - now I'm confused. I was 95% sure I knew what 2-2 was, but I just put on what I *thought* it was and it's not it. And yet I'm pretty sure that I have it (or have at least heard it) but the suggestions by other participants don't ring any bells either! Me gotta listen to that cool shit again...

[mikeweil]

Not sure if you guys are still on Silver's Spiritualizing The Senses for the very first track but I can say definitively that's not it.

Any suggestions Dan, beyond your initial post? I know just as certain this is not Monk's tune as you thought.

Edited December 13, 2003 by mikeweil

[Dan Gould]

'Fraid not, Mike. At least I wasn't the only one to hear "Ask Me Now"! Its that interspersion of those notes (or something very close) that threw me

[Jim R]

Disc 1

7. Got the “Little Rootie Tootie” quote. The alto has that avant kind of sound, always ready to boil over, but it hasn’t quite made it to boiling yet. Hm, so now we’re playing LRT for real. Mal Waldron never really played like this to my knowledge, but he was my best guess. The sax player sounds very much like a clarinet during the quietest passages. I'm going to cheat a little and guess it's this version. I've never even heard of the guy.

Rather, Brokaw, and Jennings are all now projecting this to be correct. (I wonder if Big Wheel "cheated" the same way I did... )

[Jim R]

Earlier in the thread there was a reference to "cartoons" and D1/T2 ("Almost Good"). The only connection I've come up with is that David Seville and the Chipmunks recorded a song called "Almost Good". I don't own it, but if I did, I'd slow that sucker down.

[Big Wheel]

Congrats to Mike for figuring out D1T8! Rather, Brokaw and Jennings have also had their projections confirmed courtesy of my radio station library.

[mikeweil]

At least I wasn't the only one to hear "Ask Me Now"!  Its that interspersion of those notes (or something very close)  that threw me

I clearly hear what phrase it was that lead you to thinking it was "Ask Me Now", and all the other suggestions. Noone to blame.

This has become one of the most interesting items in the test, it seems! Great choice, Jim!

Edited December 14, 2003 by mikeweil

[Harold_Z]

Mike...Is there a Fender Bass on the Moody Hip Organ Trio album?

[randyhersom]

Disc 1

1. Long piano intro, later becoming similar in feel to Maiden Voyage. I'd be mildly surprised if this isn't on Blue Note. The tenor is too cutting to be Wayne, so I'll rule out the VSOP band. Chick Corea with Joe Henderson is a possibility, but I don't remember a trumpet on that date (I haven't heard it enough to be sure I would). I have a Billy Harper Steeplechase that I haven't listened to enough, with Francesca Tanksley and Eddie Henderson, and I'm wondering if this might be it. OK, as good as any guess. Billy Harper.

2. The pianist feels like a modern player that is very skilled in older styles. That would make me think Jaki Byard, but the vocal interjections lead me away from that thought. The words that are being said would seem out of place coming from the piano player, leading me to conjecture that the date is led by a bassist or drummer of great experience, urging on a younger piano player. None of the vocalizing along with the bass one associates with Major Holley. I think of Ray Brown as too polished and cosmopolitan in style to be the utterer, so my guess is Milt Hinton.

3. The composition feels like Milestone era McCoy Tyner, but his piano sound just isn't there. I really need to listen to some more Thad Jones- Mel Lewis stuff. I can't remember if they sounded this modern. Every time I hear a largish ensemble I wonder if it's them. I'll go with Jones-Lewis.

4. I'm thinking Don Ellis. Big band with some rockish underpinning and tricky charts.

5. James Brown. Not uncomfortable at all with the style, and singing his ass off.

6. I'm thinking Dinah Washington.

7. Andrew Hill, duetting with an alto sax, perhaps James Vass.

8. Shirley Scott and Eddie Lockjaw Davis. I think the tone is a little harder than I would expect from Stanley Turrentine.

9. No real clue. I know Jim's fond of the Baby Dodds session, but this isn't really what I expected that to sound like. Maybe this is part

of the John Carter ongoing series.

10. For a while I believed the featured soloist here was on tap shoes, but I changed my mind to believing it was two percussionists duetting. Would Andrew Cyrille and Milford Graves be this groove oriented, or do I need to look for somebody a little less cutting edge, maybe Bob Moses and Billy Martin. I'll go with Bob Moses and Billy Martin.

11. Older sound with vocalist. Lyrics seem to indicate a wartime release. Reminds me of some of the vocalists on the Duke Ellington pre-1947 box, but the band doesn't sound like Duke at all. Totally off the wall guess, just on the odd chance I might luck out: Bob Crosby.

12. I initially heard this as two separate tracks. I considered Mingus for the first one and the Art Ensemble of Chicago for the second. When I realized it was all the same track I was pretty sure it was the Art Ensemble of Chicago.

13. Tight and swinging, larger ensemble. Basie or Woody Herman come to mind. Woody incorporated a lot more rock elements over the years that I don't hear here. Later Count Basie.

14. Strongly reminiscent of Paul Desmond. The piano plays with more delicacy than one associates with Dave Brubeck. Now wait a minute where's this guitar coming from. That almost surely rules out Brubeck and Desmond. I guess I'll roll out a backup guess. Art Pepper.

15. Milt Jackson. The shuffling beat could point to Lionel Hampton, but the piano seems of a later generation.

Disc 2 :

1. There was an unusual Mainstream date that Jim has spoken of on a couple occasions, and I'm wondering if this is it. Too bad I can't remember the artist. Ah, well, Plan B. The horn is reminiscent enough of Bennie Maupin for me to guess Mwandishi-era Herbie Hancock.

2. The "Ornette Coleman" chants at the end led me to abandon a pretty tenuous guess of Gary Bartz. Conga, sax and trombone. Lets try Arthur Blythe.

3. Marvin Gaye.

4. This is somewhat reminiscent of Issac Hayes soundtrack instrumentals. If that's not it then the bass guitar seems to be featured prominently. Having little knowledge of smoothish bass guitar players (Wayman Tisdale???), I'll stick with Isaac Hayes as my guess.

5. This was already feeling like a later band playing some New Orleans style before the piano came in, so I'm ruling out bands whose whole output is in the New Orleans style. It could well be Wynton or Ellis Marsalis. I'll go with Wynton.

6. Tight, big band jazz with style that seems to indicate late 60s at the earliest, probably later. Having used up my quota of Jones-Lewis guesses, I'm tempted to try Gil Evans, but I don't think that's it. For lack of anything better to do, I'll guess Oliver Nelson.

7. Glad I saved my Gil Evans guess. It's still a guess but feels a little more appropriate here than on the last track.

8. This has the looseness and creativity I associate with Duke Ellington.

9. I'm liking Sonny Rollins for this one.

10. This is coming from the blues side. It seems like all the blues singers I am familiar with have lower voices, so the best I can do is guess someone I am pretty unfamiliar with. Grittier than Jon Hendricks, less whimsical and white than Mose Allison. O. V. Wright?

11. Tuba groove. Something in the voicings reminded me of Abdullah Ibrahim.

[mikeweil]

Mike...Is there a Fender Bass on the Moody Hip Organ Trio album?

Yes, played by Roland Wilson. Tucker plays organ, Eddie Gladden on drums. Was a Xanadu LP, reissued on CD in Japan, but I regrettably don't have it ...

[randyhersom]

I make a point of not looking at the discussion thread until I have written my first response to the disc(s) in WordPad. Now having read through the responses, I have a few more reactions. I too initially heard 1-5 as a female voice, was getting ready to type Ann Peebles when the JBisms started to connect for me. On 1-6 I'm feeling considerably less confident of my Dinah Washington guess in the face of all the Rosemary Clooney guesses. I have fond memories of the Braxton Creative Orchestra Music 1976 album and that seems a better guess than my Gil Evans.

I often mistake Getz-style tenor for alto and I think that happened a couple times here.

Very enjoyable set, only Puttin up Dog failed to connect for me.

I'll be impressed and amused if I turn out to have momentarily confused Baby Dodds and Milford Graves!

[randyhersom]

Further mild embarrasment. I've recently been listening to a Carla Bley Band Live cassette in my car and commenting to myself how recognizable Steve Swallow is on bass. #2-4 sure snookered me on that count.

[paul secor]

Here goes for disc two - mostly guesses on this one:

Again, I haven't looked at any discussion, gone to AMG, etc. Did play a few things in my collection, but that didn't seem to help much.

1 - No idea who it could be. I don't listen to this type of thing, and I thought that I'd hate it when it began, but it was okay. The drummer in particular plays with a lot of imagination.

2 - Trombone/tenor/percussion. No clue. I thought maybe it was some obscure NY Art 4tet side, but I think I have just about all their stuff and I don't remember anything like this. I was happy when the percussionist got to open up a little toward the end - I always feel that it must be frustrating to play the same thing over and over and not get to break out. I'm not a musician, so maybe not. I'll be interested in finding out who this is. The "Ornette Coleman" chant threw me off, too.

3 - R&B thing - didn't interest me at lot. The rap at the beginning made me think that I'd enjoy it more than I did. No guess.

4 - Sounded like a soundtrack for a tv movie. No interest - no guess.

5 - Like this a lot, except I didn't enjoy the dixieland style theme. These guys all sounded like fine musicians. I probably have records by most or all of them in my collection, but I can't identify them. Liked the piano solo, but all solos were very good. These guys sound like they played in a somewhat later era than the style they're playing in on this tune. Maybe guys like Sweets Edison who played in the late swing era and went on to play with some of the boppers?

6 - Tristano (I'm guessing) with a big band - maybe one of the 40's all star sessions for Esquire? Loved the arrangement. Didn't dig the solos nearly as much. Listening to this and the arrangements on the previous and following tracks, I understood perhaps what Jim was trying to do when he programmed these cuts.

7 - When I first listened to this cut, I thought that the arrangement was intricate just for the sake of being intricate. On a further listening, I got caught up in the spirit of it and enjoyed it more. Didn't dig the solos that much - they were okay, but didn't grab me very much. Just a guess - perhaps a Muhal thing.

8 - Well, I'm guessing Pres, as I'm sure most will, but perhaps it's a trick. I'm assuming with the Basie band, though I'm not totally sure of that - maybe that's the trick. Anyway, Pres was wailing. I want to get this.

9 - More of Jim's thematic programming. I can hear where this tenor player came out of the honking, wailing part of Pres, rather than the smoother, floating side of Pres, like most of his followers. (Though Pres' wailing side still had a lot of subtlety to it.) The tenor cat has a world of imagination. You have to, to play with just bass and drums, and play like he does. I would have liked his playing better if I liked his tone more, but he's still a player! Just a guess - perhaps Bennie Wallace? I know he did at least one live record, though I don't have it. Hey' maybe this a real trick cut, and it's Jim Sangrey!

10 - One word into the vocal, and I knew who it was. I won't say, but he's a great songwriter/vocalist. I didn't realize that he made a record with a funk group. I wonder if this is on a recent reissue that I don't have (yet).

11 - Not my kind of thing. Okay, but nothing special - didn't seem that the soloists were doing much, though it's obviously a group thing, rather than a setting for soloists. I did enjoy the drummer - seemed to me to be the most musical musician in the band. Another guess - perhaps a Ronald Shannon Jackson group?

That's it for me. I'm going to read the rest of the discussion this afternoon - it's snowing heavily here, so I'm not going anywhere. There seems to be a lot of discussion, so it may take me the entire afternoon to read it.

Jim, thanks for the music. I was actually surprised - it wasn't as weird as I thought it would be (perhaps next time). There are a number of things I couldn't identify, and that I hope to add to my collection, so thanks for that, too.

Edited December 14, 2003 by paul secor

[Tom Storer]

[disk 2] 10: The bizarre voicings & timbres made me think it was late Zappa, but the voice isn’t that of any Zappa vocalist I know of and the guitar and lyrics certainly aren’t Zappa’s. There’s the distinctive possibility therefore that the ridiculous backdrop isn’t actually parodic.

Nate, I wanted to comment on your comment. I too was thinking Zappa before the vocal came in! But with the non-ironic vocal the background ends up working fine, I think. My first thought was Sly Stone, and I do think he sounds very Sly-like, but in the end I thought it was someone older but couldn't put a name on him. Others have guessed Percy Mayfield and I'll go along with that, without any particular degree of certainty. But it's the influence I perceive of this singer on Sly Stone that was most interesting for me, since I'd never particularly placed Sly in an inheritance tree before.

[fent99]

First time Blindfold post.

Can I say how much I've enjoyed this and hope to return to it once I know who's on it! I think of havin eclectic taste and being a bit of a Jazz fan so quite perplexed that I could only positively i.d. JB, Marvin and Steve Swallow. Lots of interesting stuff and I might say that a lot.

Here's my 2p worth

cd1

1. Like this a lot, both the piano and the horns. Guessing its from the 70's, a period I like lots of things from. Guessing Cedar Walton but its really a guess since it doesnt sound like the Cliff Jordan bands I'm familiar with

2. Interesting and just about good... Not really something I'd listen to but nice to hear vinyl as tired as some of my own.

3. Opening sounds like something I should know but then turns into something else. Like this a lot though.

4. Not so keen on big bands but this is fine. Again no idea who it is though.

5. Definitely JB. Much prefer him funky but its incredible to realise he went from this to funk, a fabulous journey.

6. Lovely singer and nice song. No-one I recognise and the arrangement and voice are a little too "vanilla" for me.

7. Can't read my notes other than free-ish

8. Nice organ and sax. Don't listen to too much of this kinda stuff but enjoy the sound when I do

9. No idea who thi could be

10. Interesting percussion but answers as above

11. Bit before my realm of interest and don't really get this

12. Again no idea though reminds me of Sun Ra doing Pink Elephants on parade on a Disney tribute

13. Don't tend to listen to bigger ensembles but this isnice sounding an dI would listen to this.

14. Like this too. Quite cool and was thinking Konitz or Desmond?

15. I'd Guess Hamp but have none of his records at all

cd2

1. Evan Parker style intro but then he calms down so its unlikely to be Evan

2. Like this both the Rhythm and Trombone. nice combination

3. Marvin. Off a great though patchy album Here my Dear. Like most doubles better editing would have made it a masterpiece. That said I don't know how you could edit this kind of personal music and lyrics

4. Steve Swallow so it must be Carla Bley? I Keep buying her records but I'm never sure if I like them. I like the idea of them more than I listen to them

5. Not my thing. There is still a lot of trad in the UK and when I first discovered jazz through Charlie Parker and Miles Davis they made sure it was modern. Just don't get trad.

6. Like this but no idea who it is. Nice bop feel.

7. Interesting fairly large ensemble

8. Again a bit before my interest era though the sax is real nice. My guess is Lester Young and I realise I need to listen to more of his music.

9. Feel like I should know this but can't place it

10. JB horns feel but don't recognise this at all.

11. Love the tuba and guess Bob Stewart doesn't help pin down the band though I like this kind of thing a lot.

All in all a fine mix with a few new favourites for me. Looking forward to the blindfold being revealed