Hammond Organ Oil

[trexrox]

I'm looking for the proper oil used for the tone wheels in a Hammond Organ, specifically an M103. Anyone know the type used and a source for it?

Thanks

[Rooster_Ties]

Welcome to the board!!

I haven't the slightest idea how to answer your question, but there are a handful of oganists around here, and I'm sure they'll be glad to tell you what they use. (Goose grease??? )

And if you don't mind me asking, please introduce yourself (an 'intro' post in this thread is OK) - or failing that, just dive right in, into some other threads too.

Again, welcome aboard!!!

-- Rooster T.

Edited December 2, 2003 by Rooster_Ties

[Jim Alfredson]

You have to use Hammond oil, which you can still purchase. Try Goff Professional, which is a professional Hammond repair and supply company based in Connecticut. I've ordered from them many times. A 4 oz. bottle is $5 and should last you for years.

Remember to oil the tone generator only once a year and then only use about 10 drops in each bowl.

Here's a direct link to the tone generator oil:

http://www.goffprof.com/catalog/accessories/hammond/oil.html

[Rooster_Ties]

Hey - b3-er (and the other organists on this board)...

I was just checkin' out the GOFF links b3-er gave, and it looks like GOFF sells something they call a "B-3 Portable" or "B-3 Cutdown" model. Here's a pic, and their sales pitch...

“Our newly available B-3 Cutdown combines every attractive functional

aspect of the stunning new Hammond model, with the portability necessary

for the serious road player. An eye-catching lightweight collapsible stand

makes this model instantly transportable. Tipping the scales at a scant

173 pounds (79kg), you will save your back and those of your rhythm

section.”

I'm no organists, so my question is purely academic. What do you think of such an animal?? OK for somebody who has one or more regular "church" gigs?? - but otherwise, "what a joke" -- ??? Or is this at least a half-valid option that at least a few serious guys actually use. -- ???

I guess I mean to say, could you invision anyone who was even half a professional using such a beast??

No reason for askin' -- just for the heck of it. Thanks!!

(And don't forget the original topic of this thread too, if you have other sources for tone-wheel oil, for trexrox. I didn't mean to hijack this thread, but it seemed as good a place as any to ask about the "baby B3" model.)

[trexrox]

You have to use Hammond oil, which you can still purchase. Try Goff Professional, which is a professional Hammond repair and supply company based in Connecticut. I've ordered from them many times. A 4 oz. bottle is $5 and should last you for years.

Remember to oil the tone generator only once a year and then only use about 10 drops in each bowl.

Here's a direct link to the tone generator oil:

http://www.goffprof.com/catalog/accessories/hammond/oil.html

Thanks for the info... I just placed an order.

Rooster-- I am a frequent poster from prosoundweb.com, B3groover stopped by there a few times and turned me onto this site. I'm an engineer and maintain all the equipment in my studio.

[Joe G]

"173 pounds."

<Sigh>

[Jim Alfredson]

With most chops you have to supply the organ. It can be either a B2/B3, C2/C3 or an A100. Anything that has B3 guts, basically. But you have to supply the organ to be chopped. So the ideal is find a nice organ that is physically beat-up but mechanically sound.

They take the guts of the organ and put it in a new case that is more easily transported. Usually it has several pieces. A lot of the weight of a B3 comes from the fact that the case is solid wood. It's beautiful wood, but from a strictly practical standpoint it's not neccessary. Unlike a real acoustic instrument, the wood does not alter the sound of the instrument at all. So you could theorectically take the guts and put them into just about anything and it would make the same sound.

Are they a serious thing? Sure, if you have the money. But chops are usually expensive. Like I said, first you have to get an organ. That'll cost $$ even for a badly damaged one. Then you have to get it to the chop shop. There's more $$. Then the chops usually cost at least $2000 to do. By the time you're done you'll probably have $4000 in it. Well, for $4000 you can get a really nice B3!

Yes, it weighs less, but moving the Hammond isn't really that hard. Hell, I do it myself most times. I don't think they're that hard to move... I think most people are just lazy!

Ha!

[Soul Stream]

With most chops you have to supply the organ. It can be either a B2/B3, C2/C3 or an A100. Anything that has B3 guts, basically. But you have to supply the organ to be chopped. So the ideal is find a nice organ that is physically beat-up but mechanically sound.

They take the guts of the organ and put it in a new case that is more easily transported. Usually it has several pieces. A lot of the weight of a B3 comes from the fact that the case is solid wood. It's beautiful wood, but from a strictly practical standpoint it's not neccessary. Unlike a real acoustic instrument, the wood does not alter the sound of the instrument at all. So you could theorectically take the guts and put them into just about anything and it would make the same sound.

Are they a serious thing? Sure, if you have the money. But chops are usually expensive. Like I said, first you have to get an organ. That'll cost $$ even for a badly damaged one. Then you have to get it to the chop shop. There's more $$. Then the chops usually cost at least $2000 to do. By the time you're done you'll probably have $4000 in it. Well, for $4000 you can get a really nice B3!

Yes, it weighs less, but moving the Hammond isn't really that hard. Hell, I do it myself most times. I don't think they're that hard to move... I think most people are just lazy!

Ha!

I agree with Jim. Chops are a waste. I always get a good laugh when I go to the organ repair shop. He usually has at least one organ being chopped. Of course he loves it because it's a ton of dough for him.

Seems like everybody tries to shortcut hauling the B around. But like Jim, I don't think a B and a 122, with organ dollies and either a trailer or van (ie, the proper moving equipment...that stuff IS a must), is all that hard to transport.

After these guys get done making 10 trips back and forth to the van for their chop job and assorted stands, plugs, ect....hey, 173 pounds STILL ain't light. I'm set up and ready to go. Like Jim, I can haul and set up the B by myself pretty much. Once you learn the techniques of doing so, it's fairly simple.

If you're playing the organ. Resign yourself to the fact that you have to haul it around. It's not a big deal. If they did it in the 50's, 60's and 70's day after day, we can do it today. I do it, and I don't even think about it anymore.

To my ears, digital replicants sound like garbage. I haul the B around because I'm fit enough to do it, and that's what I play. If I wanted an easy instrument, I certainly wouldn't have picked the organ.

[Jim Alfredson]

More than that, back in the 50's 60's and 70's there was no "Americans With Disabilities Act" which put elevators in almost every public building!! Those cats had to haul the big B up and down stairs!!!

I thank my lucky stars I live in this day and age where most places I play have an elevator, a ramp to the front door, etc.

[Jim Alfredson]

Rooster-- I am a frequent poster from prosoundweb.com, B3groover stopped by there a few times and turned me onto this site. I'm an engineer and maintain all the equipment in my studio.

Ah, the recpit! That place is crazy! What kind of work does your studio do?

[AfricaBrass]

Regarding the recpit, did Mixerman ever pick up his diary of the Bitchslap sessions?

That was great reading!

[trexrox]

yeah, the recpit... b3-er, it was nice to have you there... hope you weren't turned off by all the misfits... it's really a fun bunch once you get past all the craziness...

the mixerman diaries have been on hiatus for a while now... hopefully it'll start back up again... it was VERY entertaining...

Edited December 3, 2003 by trexrox

[Jim Alfredson]

No, I wasn't turned away by the misfits as you call them! I just have too much stuff on my plate to begin with, what with moderating this site. I check in now and then and I'm sure I'll post again.

[trexrox]

You have to use Hammond oil, which you can still purchase. Try Goff Professional, which is a professional Hammond repair and supply company based in Connecticut. I've ordered from them many times. A 4 oz. bottle is $5 and should last you for years.

Remember to oil the tone generator only once a year and then only use about 10 drops in each bowl.

Here's a direct link to the tone generator oil:

http://www.goffprof.com/catalog/accessories/hammond/oil.html

How do you measure a drop? If I put too much will it likely mess the organ up? I got the oil today, and I was hoping it had some kind of nozzle on it, but it doesn't.

Much thanks!

[Jim Alfredson]

No nozzle? Hmm... well, just fill each cup about 1/4 of the way up. That should do it. Then again, how long has it been since it's been oiled?

[trexrox]

I have no idea, but probably at least 2 years since it's been oiled... I got it less than a year ago from a friend who got it from his dad who kept it maintained very well... but my friend probably did not oil it in the year or two that he had it.

Also, is there any info somewhere on the mechanics of the tonewheels? I'd like to learn more about how they generate sound.

Thanks!

[Jim Alfredson]

And to answer your other question, over-oiling ain't good. Number one, the oil can leak out all over everything and number two, it can gunk stuff up if there's too much there and you get changes in temperature (ie, tubes warming up, motors warming up, etc.)

I'd say 1/4 of a cup should be fine. It doesn't take much.

[trexrox]

I just looked behind the organ and found a sticker that that sayss put .1 Oz in the motor cup and .2 Oz in the tonewheel cup.

Great... but how am I supposed to measure .1 ounces?

[Jim Alfredson]

How A Hammond Works

[Jim Alfredson]

I would just stick with about a 1/4 cup. Maybe a teaspoon a piece. If it's been oiled all it's life (with the exception of a few years, which shouldn't matter) than that should suffice.

[Shrdlu]

I had a good chuckle years ago when the Volvo dealership had a poster which said "Use only genuine Volvo oil"!

My son recently bought a Citröen, and, as it is a diesel, I phoned and asked if it used the same antifreeze as for a gasoline engine (it does, by the way). The guy said to use genuine Citröen antifreeze!!

Maybe that can also be used when playing a B-3 in cold climates.

[trexrox]

I had a good chuckle years ago when the Volvo dealership had a poster which said "Use only genuine Volvo oil"!

My son recently bought a Citröen, and, as it is a diesel, I phoned and asked if it used the same antifreeze as for a gasoline engine (it does, by the way). The guy said to use genuine Citröen antifreeze!!

Maybe that can also be used when playing a B-3 in cold climates.

That's funny, b/c my Volvo manual suggests using Castrol motor oil.

Hammond oil has to be of a certian wieght (it's a fairly light oil) and I'm sure that Hammond suggested using their oil so as not to create confusion about which oil to use. Although they obviously didn't manufacture the oil, they use a specific kind that works best with their machinery. (you wouldn't use car engine oil on a hammond).

Antifreeze has nothing to do with what kind of gas a car engine burns. You could just simply use water, except that it would freeze in the winter, and antifreeze has an anti-rust and lubricating agent that is better for long-term performance. It is contained in a system of pipes, radiator, and a pump (reffered to as a water pump, btw) that cools the engine and keeps it from overheating.

Edited December 15, 2003 by trexrox

[Shrdlu]

That was what I thought must be true about a diesel engine, but I wanted to check, just to be sure. The oil is different, but that mixes with the fuel, unlike the coolant.

[Jim Alfredson]

The Hammond oil is lighter than sewing machine oil. If you put the wrong oil in the Hammond, it'll ruin it.