Forming pressure group to protect the working poor driver

[fasstrack]

Especially if you are working poor and dependent on driving this message is for you. I am looking for like-minded people who believe the reason for excessive ticketing, towing, impounds is money for cities. Period. People who are tired of having their mistakes endlessly taken advantage of by city fathers using police as collectors for the city's undeclared, unfair, and regressive taxes on drivers. Have you had a nightmare experience? Is your car still in the tow pound? Are you tired of being a 'chump', a 'pigeon' because the city feels they can do what they want since no one will rise up? THERE IS STRENGTH IN NUMBERS!

I want to form an organization with the goal of pressuring politicians to make the laws regarding driving, parking offenses fairer to the working poor. I would like to hear from people who would like to be activists to lobby to change the laws and participate in protests and civil disobedience. Perhaps a pool of money could be created to help poor drivers whose cars get taken and lack funds to retrieve them. I would also like to hear from attorneys whose God is not money and would like to make a difference in the lives of people already struggling in very tough times. Please contact me at fasstrack@yahoo.com

PLEASE PASS THIS MESSAGE ALONG!!

Edited July 14, 2009 by fasstrack

[Drew Peacock]

Are you suggesting a tiered ticket structure - one for the poor and one for the rest? I'm not sure how that gets implemented.

I was in this situation when I was a recent college grad. I drove a piece of crap car that had an expired registration sticker on it because I was to poor to pay the $50 fee. I got stopped by the same cop on two consecutive days. I found out that these were classified as moving violations that also carried premiums on my insurance policy. Double whammy x 2. I can see your point as it relates to these types of violations.

I'm not in agreement with parking at a meter. I can see abuse of all kinds that impacts other people's rights.

[papsrus]

Are you suggesting a tiered ticket structure - one for the poor and one for the rest? I'm not sure how that gets implemented.

I think Denmark, or Norway has a tiered ticket structure.

It definitely seems like this sort of activity -- speed traps, etc., -- picks up toward the end of each month.

[fasstrack]

Are you suggesting a tiered ticket structure - one for the poor and one for the rest? I'm not sure how that gets implemented.

I was in this situation when I was a recent college grad. I drove a piece of crap car that had an expired registration sticker on it because I was to poor to pay the $50 fee. I got stopped by the same cop on two consecutive days. I found out that these were classified as moving violations that also carried premiums on my insurance policy. Double whammy x 2. I can see your point as it relates to these types of violations.

I'm not in agreement with parking at a meter. I can see abuse of all kinds that impacts other people's rights.

I'm suggesting that cities and towns stop towing and impounding first and asking questions later. Legal larceny it is, and people should not be taken advantage of. If you have a legit ticket, pay it. If you think it's not, fight it, but IMO it's a stacked deck if you're poor. But people should not have to countenence whatever mistakes they made being capitalized on by thieving cities and towns who figure everyone's too busy keeping their heads above water and will basically accept the passed Vaseline. If people stop complaining and act to change laws and protest and don't let up things might change. Maybe not overnight, but some forward motion is better than lying down and taking it. People need to keep hammering the point that it's just about the money and it's unfair. And make a few politicians get off their asses or risk losing their jobs. That usually works, but you have to keep the pressure up and the flame on the right asses.

I'm not in the position to lead this, BTW. But if I'm the impetus for anything happening and I can attract gifted, organized activists that can help others that went through what I have I'll be thrilled.

Edited July 14, 2009 by fasstrack

[fasstrack]

Are you suggesting a tiered ticket structure - one for the poor and one for the rest? I'm not sure how that gets implemented.

I think Denmark, or Norway has a tiered ticket structure.

It definitely seems like this sort of activity -- speed traps, etc., -- picks up toward the end of each month.

It's picking up now b/c everyone's broke, especially cities. When times get tough, the greedy get greedier.

[Rooster_Ties]

I think Denmark, or Norway has a tiered ticket structure.

And/or Finland I think.

Basically they set the fine as a percentage of gross income. Say 0.1% of one's monthly income, for instance, which would be quite different for someone very rich, vs. someone working for double-minimum wage (or less).

The notion is that this is "fair" because the percentage is the same. And I rather like this idea, myself. Make the fat cats feel it just as much as those who don't make much. Otherwise a $35 parking ticket, or a $120 speeding ticket amounts to nothing more than a drop in the bucket for some Executive VP or CEO.

[fasstrack]

I think Denmark, or Norway has a tiered ticket structure.

And/or Finland I think.

Basically they set the fine as a percentage of gross income. Say 0.1% of one's monthly income, for instance, which would be quite different for someone very rich, vs. someone working for double-minimum wage (or less).

The notion is that this is "fair" because the percentage is the same. And I rather like this idea, myself. Make the fat cats feel it just as much as those who don't make much. Otherwise a $35 parking ticket, or a $120 speeding ticket amounts to nothing more than a drop in the bucket for some Executive VP or CEO.

Do you think I'll get any real response to this? I really hope I do. I doubt we'll catch up to Finland anytime soon, but I feel many people are fed up but just don't have a vehicle. They're also caught up in treading water, but that's how the pocketpickers get over.

[fasstrack]

I got not a single email (from putting this on Craigslist). I'm disappointed. Should I just accept things for the crappy way they are? I don't want to. I need a young lawyer with Christ complex to spearhead this. Any ideas?

[Drew Peacock]

I live in a college town so using a % of gross income as a penalty for college students would be the equivalent of free parking for them. The rub is that most of these college kids come from wealthy families who could well afford to pay a greater than average penalty.

I also see many out of state plates from these same college kids. They pay insurance based on where the car is registered and end up paying less than had they registered their car in this state. If this is abused there is no reason why parking tickets wouldn't also be abused.

In MA we have a program where we give free cars, insurance, and gas to the unemployed. This type of program may be something for you to focus on as it has the net result you're looking for and may be easier to both find supports and get some legislation passed for your state.

[papsrus]

I got not a single email (from putting this on Craigslist). I'm disappointed. Should I just accept things for the crappy way they are? I don't want to. I need a young lawyer with Christ complex to spearhead this. Any ideas?

There are a lot of problems with what you propose. Assuming you could get enough people interested to raise enough money to pay a lawyer to dig into this, what is the legal basis of your complaint? The laws are in place. When you violate them, you pay a penalty. Only solution: change the laws. Unlikely.

Have you looked into whether your city has some kind of permit allowing people who drive as part of their jobs to avoid these fines? I can't imagine every delivery truck that double parks for 5 minutes is subject to ticketing. There must be some system in place allowing for deliveries, etc.

My 2 cents.

[fasstrack]

I got not a single email (from putting this on Craigslist). I'm disappointed. Should I just accept things for the crappy way they are? I don't want to. I need a young lawyer with Christ complex to spearhead this. Any ideas?

There are a lot of problems with what you propose. Assuming you could get enough people interested to raise enough money to pay a lawyer to dig into this, what is the legal basis of your complaint? The laws are in place. When you violate them, you pay a penalty. Only solution: change the laws. Unlikely.

Have you looked into whether your city has some kind of permit allowing people who drive as part of their jobs to avoid these fines? I can't imagine every delivery truck that double parks for 5 minutes is subject to ticketing. There must be some system in place allowing for deliveries, etc.

My 2 cents.

It's only unlikely if you try and try again and get nowhere. If it's not impossible it's worth a shot. To answer your question about legal basis and getting people involved: 1: the timing couldn't be better b/c people are very pissed off and feel betrayed by bankers, politicians, and pretty much anyone in authority. Everyone's getting hammered especially with cars, b/c cities, always greedy and always viewing drivers as prime income, are broke, thereby more desperate. I, insane as it sounds, would like to get some young attorney as crazily idealistic and moralistic as myself, to look into a class action suit (or more than one) based on misuse of police forces. The sworn duty of police is to protect the public and uphold laws. They have the latitude to give drivers breaks but almost never do b/c they are told to collect for the city----in towing and tickets. Turning cops into collectors is misuse of the force IMO. Theay all want to work traffic, b/c they won't get shot and get overtime when they go to court. It's a scam everyone wins but the poor driver. Towing and impounds are my big beef. If you're wrong pay the fine (although it should be tiered if we were a compassionate society), but grabbing your car and holding it hostage is little more than legal theft. The laws have to be changed. Poor people dependent on cars are stuck if they can't afford to get the car out. If they plead hardship, they're told too bad. This happened to me and I know what I'm talking about. It's bullshit, nothing but greed.

My car, which I need for work and now medical reasons, is sitting in a private lot since May 1 in a city I despise, White Plains, NY, with equipment I need to work (my amplifier) b/c I don't have the money to get it out. I gave up on the car, now I just want my stuff and they won't even give me that. I don't want anyone ever to go through what I did. I'm tired of 'I'm doing my job', 'my hands are tied', 'can't fight City Hall'. Bullshit! Who says so? That's how they get over on us, when the sheep lie down in the meadow.

At the very least, until laws can be changed (by lobbying, and especially voting and getting rid of politicians who play ball with the thieves) there should be a pool of money generated by members of this proposed organization to help drivers who are working poor and get caught up in these Kafkaesque situations get their cars back. They can pay into it themselves modestly and then there are always 'angels'.

We all have to pay for our mistakes. But make it affordable. And have a heart for people who are honest but struggling, b/c there's a lot of us out there now. There's a reason America is shit in the eyes of the world---several, actually, but when anyone asks if we have compassion for our people and we come up short people will shake their heads, and rightly. We're better than that. We just have to stop lying down and weed out the greedmeisters.

And for the record, drunk drivers, people who flout the law and drive with suspended licenses, etc. should have the book thrown at them. I'm talking about poor working people who make mistakes and get the Vaseline passed their way.

[fasstrack]

In MA we have a program where we give free cars, insurance, and gas to the unemployed. This type of program may be something for you to focus on as it has the net result you're looking for and may be easier to both find supports and get some legislation passed for your state.

That's a great idea! What's the program called and how I get info?

[Jazzmoose]

My car, which I need for work and now medical reasons, is sitting in a private lot since May 1 in a city I despise, White Plains, NY, with equipment I need to work (my amplifier) b/c I don't have the money to get it out. I gave up on the car, now I just want my stuff and they won't even give me that.

I'd be very surprised if that is legal. I know in California, they have to give you your stuff, even if you just tell them to park their new car up their ass.

[fasstrack]

My car, which I need for work and now medical reasons, is sitting in a private lot since May 1 in a city I despise, White Plains, NY, with equipment I need to work (my amplifier) b/c I don't have the money to get it out. I gave up on the car, now I just want my stuff and they won't even give me that.

I'd be very surprised if that is legal. I know in California, they have to give you your stuff, even if you just tell them to park their new car up their ass.

Unfortunately, it is legal. Or else everyone in the world is a moron, an idea I like very much......

[fasstrack]

I spoke to a reporter for a Westchester paper, the Journal News. He had written an article yesterday about the amount of White Plains pliticos getting free cars as perks. I figured he'd see the irony. He wouldn't write about this, but said he'd get my letter to the editor published. I don't know if it's worth it now, with everything else I have to deal with. I was drug that I got zero response from Craigslist, except some lady trying to sell me something. This is why nothing ever changes.

Pass the Vaseline. It's over, I guess.............

Edited July 20, 2009 by fasstrack