Paul Flaherty

[NaturalSoul]

Anyone a fan? He's one of the more "out" saxophone players out there, but the man is great. He does alot of work with noise artists (has done alot of work with Thurston Moore of SY). There's the new one sided live LP with The Noise Nomads out on American Tape which is fabulous,

Here's a video with Thurston Moore (the audio for this video was released as a 7" record on the Not not Fun label..)'

[clifford_thornton]

I do like him. The stuff w/ Randall Colbourne is particularly nice, esp. the duos.

[AllenLowe]

can play, but try playing along with him (I met him in Hartford about 25 years ago) - I consider him to be the autistic star of free jazz. Has the social skills of a toad and is about as easy to play with.

Edited June 23, 2009 by AllenLowe

[clifford_thornton]

It's funny that Flaherty doesn't get much press from the jazz (or even "free jazz") public. He got lumped in with the "New Weird America" crowd, like Sunburned Hand of the Man, Wooden Wand, etc., and that placed him on the outside of where his work really lies - with improvised music. Same thing happened with Arthur Doyle. Say what you will about either one's playing within the free/jazz tradition, but I find them both to be intriguing artists and will continue to follow their work.

[Dan Gould]

How anyone can find pleasure or joy in crap like that is completely beyond me. Isn't there enough ugliness in the world without having to look for it in "music"?

Seriously, someone please tell me what is pleasing about that. What should I listen for? Is there actual interaction between those "musicians"? Is the asshat on tenor especially well-known for that "bang the keys with the palm of your hand" move?

It would have been great though if they did something creative like signaling the end of that noise-fest with a Basie ending. Somehow I don't think they know the notes though or could articulate them so you'd know what they'd done.

[clifford_thornton]

I haven't listened to the clip because I am at work. However, I do have about 20 of his recordings, and have seen him w/ Thurston and Corsano before as the Dream Action Unit - nice gig, very enjoyable skronk-fest.

I don't think that "beauty" is a necessary requirement of music or sound. It may be a requirement for you to like it, Dan, but not necessarily for others. FWIW, I would rather listen to Flaherty in another context than with Thurston, though each is a strong player in their own right.

Though on the extreme end of things, Bill Dixon does have a point when he suggests that the only person who can judge a work of art as successful is the one who made it. If Flaherty and Moore succeeded in doing what they set out to do, it's not "crap" though you may not enjoy it yourself.

[Dan Gould]

I didn't say that "beauty" is a necessary part of music but if we agree not to call noise like that "music" then I have no problem with performances of this type. Call it "sound" hell call it "art" or "performance" but don't call it music.

And I'd still like to know what it is that is pleasing about that.

And as for Dixon's comment, well isn't the logical conclusion of that my declaration that my next bowel movement is my greatest work of art yet?

[AllenLowe]

depends on the prior meal -

[JSngry]

And as for Dixon's comment, well isn't the logical conclusion of that my declaration that my next bowel movement is my greatest work of art yet?

Do you intend/attempt for your defecation to be art? If you do, then you got every right to call it like you see it.

Just as I have every right to not be at all interested in checking it out.

But if you can find an audience, capre, or should I say crape diem!

[Chuck Nessa]

Didn't he used to be on SCTV?

[Dan Gould]

And as for Dixon's comment, well isn't the logical conclusion of that my declaration that my next bowel movement is my greatest work of art yet?

Do you intend/attempt for your defecation to be art? If you do, then you got every right to call it like you see it.

Just as I have every right to not be at all interested in checking it out.

But if you can find an audience, capre, or should I say crape diem!

Soon as I get that translucent toilet bowl, I'll have Performance Art as well as the regular kind.

[clifford_thornton]

I watched the duo video and yes, that is some pretty noisy shit. I don't think it's bad at all, but not the arc of either musician's work that I tend to follow.

The above is a bit more "musical."

I think it was Cage who proffered a definition of music as "organized sound," and unless you know the ins and outs of how a particular sound or sounds were organized (i.e., you're the composer), then I don't think you are in a place to say something is or is not music/musical.

[clifford_thornton]

And as for Dixon's comment, well isn't the logical conclusion of that my declaration that my next bowel movement is my greatest work of art yet?

Do you intend/attempt for your defecation to be art? If you do, then you got every right to call it like you see it.

Just as I have every right to not be at all interested in checking it out.

But if you can find an audience, capre, or should I say crape diem!

Defecatory art

[JSngry]

I think it was Cage who proffered a definition of music as "organized sound," and unless you know the ins and outs of how a particular sound or sounds were organized (i.e., you're the composer), then I don't think you are in a place to say something is or is not music/musical.

Definitely true, but there's also something to be said for a composer communicating intent in an atleast somewhat less than obfuscatory manner. I mean, I'm good with it either way, but at this point, if I bother to make something and not care who, if anybody, "gets" it, then I'm not going to sweat if anybody even gets the chance to. And if I want somebody to "get" it, then it's up to me to communicate, not just send out signals into a void, not unless I'm willing to live with the possibility that they might not get picked up...

I mean, I'm totally sympathetic & empathetic to the need, the real need for self-expression. But self-expression and communication only sometimes intersect, and imo, it behooves one to be fully aware of that beforehand, and to proceed accordingly, whichever way one feels compelled to go.

[Cliff Englewood]

I like his GOD look.

[Chuck Nessa]

I think the clip was crap. If that is any indication of his saxophone technique, or "style".............................

[clifford_thornton]

First one, not indicative.

[Chuck Nessa]

First one, not indicative.

He chose to do it.

[NaturalSoul]

It's funny that Flaherty doesn't get much press from the jazz (or even "free jazz") public. He got lumped in with the "New Weird America" crowd, like Sunburned Hand of the Man, Wooden Wand, etc., and that placed him on the outside of where his work really lies - with improvised music. Same thing happened with Arthur Doyle. Say what you will about either one's playing within the free/jazz tradition, but I find them both to be intriguing artists and will continue to follow their work.

Hey,

wodering if you are a fan of artists such as Graveyards, Wolf Eyes / the album anthony braxton did with wolf eyes, cardboard sax, wasteland jazz unit, etc.

[clifford_thornton]

Don't really follow the No Fun angle of things too much, actually, though I am familiar with some of those bands. Wasteland Jazz Unit is pretty hard even for me to take.

[NaturalSoul]

I agree. WJU is pretty harsh, but i enjoy in small doses.

Do you like the label American Tapes (John Olson of Graveyards / Wolf Eyes, etc)'s label. The new Flaherty / noise nomads live LP is on it.

Also, i posted the original clip because i thought there were some Sonic Youth fans on the board. There are definitely better Flaherty clips.

[NaturalSoul]

this will probably get trashed as well, but here's a clip of John Olson And Ben Hall doing a duo, they are 2 of the 3 Graveyards core members:

[P.L.M]

can play, but try playing along with him (I met him in Hartford about 25 years ago) - I consider him to be the autistic star of free jazz. Has the social skills of a toad and is about as easy to play with.

Can't agreed more. I met him a year ago in Hasselt (Belgium) in some sort of informal free jazz meeting. Impossible to talk with him about nothing else but himself. And further than that, when you speak with him in reality, when he seems to answer to you, he is just speaking to himself. A real "personnage", certainly, but, to say the truth not so convincing as a player when you seen him just after a glorious set from Evan Parker/ John Edwards/ Chris Corsano Trio.

Edited June 27, 2009 by P.L.M