Alexander Hawkins Posted August 3, 2006 Report Posted August 3, 2006 (edited) I haven't listened to European Echoes in a while, although remember enjoying it! Edited August 3, 2006 by Red Quote
Alexander Hawkins Posted August 3, 2006 Report Posted August 3, 2006 But for that 'i' in 'Haino', I thought this thread had just come glorious full circle! Hano to Haino - the A-Z of Japanese improv! Quote
Alexander Hawkins Posted August 3, 2006 Report Posted August 3, 2006 Just listening to European Echoes again. I think it's good. It's obviously quite similar to lots of these 'blowout' dates from the time, but I think the solos are often outstanding. Just had two great trumpet solos - I take it they're Rava and Schoof, as I'm not familiar with Hugh Steinmetz's sound. Han is his usual anarchic self, and the bass playing is wonderful (surprise surprise, given Kowald's on board..!) Quote
clifford_thornton Posted August 3, 2006 Report Posted August 3, 2006 Speaking of prime European jazz, when is somebody going to reissue all that Manfred Schoof Quintett material from the '60s? Great shit!!! As long as we're on Schoof (?!)--Is European Echoes worth picking up? The lineup is excellent, but I'm wondering what differentiates this from the dozens of others with similar personnel. It's making the rounds at a reasonable price... It's great, and it has an urgency that makes it profoundly different from some of those other records. They're on FIRE... Quote
Alexander Hawkins Posted August 3, 2006 Report Posted August 3, 2006 (edited) Listen to the piano solo at the end of track 2...that poor instrument is in a bad way! Schlippenbach, Van Hove and Schweizer... p.s. edited for spelling Edited August 3, 2006 by Red Quote
clifford_thornton Posted August 3, 2006 Report Posted August 3, 2006 Well, at least one (probably Van Hove's) is prepared... Quote
Alexander Hawkins Posted August 3, 2006 Report Posted August 3, 2006 No - it's the 'basic' tuning I'm getting at, rather anything preparation might do to the tuning. FWIW, however (and I listened whilst doing other things, so might have missed it) I didn't notice the preparation... It's great late-60s Derek at the start of track 2! Quote
clifford_thornton Posted August 4, 2006 Report Posted August 4, 2006 Huh. On my LP, Bailey's at the beginning of side one. How did Atavistic do the reissue? Quote
Alexander Hawkins Posted August 4, 2006 Report Posted August 4, 2006 You're right - my mistake. But what's peculiar is that side 2 (starting with the drums, then into the basses, etc.) sounds more like a beginning than side 1... p.s. I don't have the UMS reissue as such - rather, I've got the emusic version of it. Quote
clifford_thornton Posted August 5, 2006 Report Posted August 5, 2006 The LP jacket lists the order of soloists on the back, which coincides with drummers starting side 2. I hear you, though. Quote
Nate Dorward Posted August 6, 2006 Report Posted August 6, 2006 May be of interest to some Funny Ratters: http://www.dispatx.com/issue/05/images/syn...tacticsLash.pdf --an article by the bassist Dom Lash on Derek Bailey. Quote
EKE BBB Posted August 7, 2006 Report Posted August 7, 2006 The Thing - Action Jazz (SMJZ) Brief review: If I ever want to quarrel with my new neigbours, this could be a good starting point! Quote
Guest akanalog Posted August 7, 2006 Report Posted August 7, 2006 topography of the lungs is now out on CD, i see. i just picked it up knowing i probably wouldn't like it. it's ok. i didn't think i would like it at all but it isn't bad. i could see it growing on me and i can certainly appreciate the thoughtful interactions of the three musicians. i got another disc with derek bailey, a spontaneous music ensemble album on marmalade (sketchy LP burn CD) and i like this one a lot better. the first of the two tracks is bailey and trevor watts and kenny wheeler and johnny dyani and john stevens and a few other folks. very nice. Quote
Nate Dorward Posted August 7, 2006 Report Posted August 7, 2006 There's actually a piece I did on Topography of the Lungs in the current issue of Paris Transatlantic (www.paristransatlantic.com), FWIW. Just been listening to Pauline Oliveros' The Roots of the Moment in the new reissue. Maybe folks here could help me: I no longer have the original version but I remember it as having some useful information on the accordian/electronics setup (including a diagram/flowchart), which is omitted in the new version. Also, are the track-titles new? I don't remember them from the original version. -- One of those albums that tends to flicker in & out of my attention--basically, after a fairly active opening 5-8 minutes, it settles down to long droney slowly-twisting soundscapes, ranging from a dissonant patch in the middle to a major-key conclusion. I gather in some quarters it's considered a classic; never did a lot for me which is I guess why I got rid of it the first time round. I now wish I kept it just for the liners & the original cover (I hate the new Hatology covers--b&w shots of desolate boring urban architecture, in this case a bridge). Quote
Д.Д. Posted August 7, 2006 Report Posted August 7, 2006 There's actually a piece I did on Topography of the Lungs in the current issue of Paris Transatlantic (www.paristransatlantic.com), FWIW. Just been listening to Pauline Oliveros' The Roots of the Moment in the new reissue. Maybe folks here could help me: I no longer have the original version but I remember it as having some useful information on the accordian/electronics setup (including a diagram/flowchart), which is omitted in the new version. Also, are the track-titles new? I don't remember them from the original version. -- One of those albums that tends to flicker in & out of my attention--basically, after a fairly active opening 5-8 minutes, it settles down to long droney slowly-twisting soundscapes, ranging from a dissonant patch in the middle to a major-key conclusion. I gather in some quarters it's considered a classic; never did a lot for me which is I guess why I got rid of it the first time round. I now wish I kept it just for the liners & the original cover (I hate the new Hatology covers--b&w shots of desolate boring urban architecture, in this case a bridge). Nate, I can't help with the original artwork, but did you try searching in the packaging behind the disc section? A few of the HatHut editions have inserts behind the disc - they are not really noticeable. I am also a bit ambivalent about hatOLOGY cover art - just as ECM's I enjoy many of them individually, but at some point, after 100 of similar covers it's enough... Quote
Nate Dorward Posted August 8, 2006 Report Posted August 8, 2006 Oh I don't care about the original artwork (it was, if memory serves, a yellowish mosaic) but I would like to know a little more about the technical aspects of the disc if possible...! The original Hat Art covers were quite colourful & charming--witness the difference between the original Morning Joy & the reissue for instance! Quote
Guest akanalog Posted August 8, 2006 Report Posted August 8, 2006 i notice on my copy of topography that it is labelled an evan parker album. pretty lame of him. i felt this way about the love cry want album also as larry young is reduced to secondary status on the newer issued CD. maybe it wasn't really his band. i dunno. but it seems like a cooperative effort, at least. Quote
Nate Dorward Posted August 8, 2006 Report Posted August 8, 2006 Well go to the Bagatellen review/discussion (www.bagatellen.com) of Topography if you want a fuller discussion of the re-crediting....... Quote
Nate Dorward Posted August 8, 2006 Report Posted August 8, 2006 My AOTW pick might be of interest to Funny Rat denizens: http://www.organissimo.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=28849 Not sure how much participation it'll get but I thought it worth throwing a curveball at the AOTW, & it's an album I wanted to spend some time with again. Quote
Guest akanalog Posted August 12, 2006 Report Posted August 12, 2006 "topography" is growing on me. evan parker plays with a more fluid and even-keeled kind of intensity than reaching screeching crescendos. i can appreciate the interaction on the disc. speaking of the drummer on this one, i was sort of disappointed by that herbie nichols "change of season" disc. everyone seems pretty restrained, especially he. disappointingly restrained. though on the "dutch masters" album, the energy seems to be up a notch and the album benefits greatly from this. is it the change of bassists? or just the monk/orginal material allowing more fun? an album i am enjoying is amalgam's "over the rainbow" with keith rowe. i don't know too much SME, but amalgam around this time was sort of avante-ey fusion and he fits in well. the previous album ( i think) "deep", had harry miller guesting on bass and he also fits in quite well. i guess he knew how to handle an e-bass, though, as he played on some of those mike westbrook jams. for some reason when i picked "deep" up, i assumed he would be on acoustic, though. i am sure rowe sounds worlds different on the SME stuff, but for anyone who wants to hear what he would sound like in an avante-ey fusion setting, this is probably your best chance. not sure how to describe it-there's some electric bass and some heavy drumming, but watts really occupies the foreground with rowe shadowing him with metallic clings and plinks. one song they basically duet and it works well. rowe really seems to connect with watts and it is too bad they didn't record more. however, as it is a live album, rowe seems to lose out in the volume competition to the other three musicians. and speaking of SME-i was also listening to the konnex john stevens reissue of "big band and quintet". the large group stuff is growing on me though i can do without the formless scrum towards the end. the quintet stuff is probably not funny ratter material, but it's great. kenny wheeler playing some pretty straight ahead and heated stuff.... going to follow this up with some amalgam "plays blackwell and higgins"-live trio sets with watts, stevens and i think clyne/herman on bass. Quote
Guest akanalog Posted August 12, 2006 Report Posted August 12, 2006 does anyone know anything about the takashi kako ECM album "paradox" with oliver johnson and kent carter from the steve lacy crew? i see it is available on CD and i am curious if it is worth a look. Quote
clifford_thornton Posted August 14, 2006 Report Posted August 14, 2006 Considering that was also Noah Howard's rhythm section in the '70s, it's probably a good bet that it's solid... Quote
ep1str0phy Posted August 14, 2006 Report Posted August 14, 2006 "topography" is growing on me. evan parker plays with a more fluid and even-keeled kind of intensity than reaching screeching crescendos. i can appreciate the interaction on the disc. speaking of the drummer on this one, i was sort of disappointed by that herbie nichols "change of season" disc. everyone seems pretty restrained, especially he. disappointingly restrained. though on the "dutch masters" album, the energy seems to be up a notch and the album benefits greatly from this. is it the change of bassists? or just the monk/orginal material allowing more fun? an album i am enjoying is amalgam's "over the rainbow" with keith rowe. i don't know too much SME, but amalgam around this time was sort of avante-ey fusion and he fits in well. the previous album ( i think) "deep", had harry miller guesting on bass and he also fits in quite well. i guess he knew how to handle an e-bass, though, as he played on some of those mike westbrook jams. for some reason when i picked "deep" up, i assumed he would be on acoustic, though. i am sure rowe sounds worlds different on the SME stuff, but for anyone who wants to hear what he would sound like in an avante-ey fusion setting, this is probably your best chance. not sure how to describe it-there's some electric bass and some heavy drumming, but watts really occupies the foreground with rowe shadowing him with metallic clings and plinks. one song they basically duet and it works well. rowe really seems to connect with watts and it is too bad they didn't record more. however, as it is a live album, rowe seems to lose out in the volume competition to the other three musicians. and speaking of SME-i was also listening to the konnex john stevens reissue of "big band and quintet". the large group stuff is growing on me though i can do without the formless scrum towards the end. the quintet stuff is probably not funny ratter material, but it's great. kenny wheeler playing some pretty straight ahead and heated stuff.... going to follow this up with some amalgam "plays blackwell and higgins"-live trio sets with watts, stevens and i think clyne/herman on bass. Just (today) got a copy of Topography--haven't listened long enough to formulate a cohesive opinion, but I like what I hear (the transparency of the ensemble does the group considerable justice). I got a copy of Air Time, too (a new spin--but that one is hot, no doubt). -On the SME album: nice to hear someone else talk about it. The big band material is sort of plodding in spots, and the small group work veers toward the more conservative at times, but in its best spots (esp. the horn solos on the quintet sides), the music is brilliant. Quote
Nate Dorward Posted August 14, 2006 Report Posted August 14, 2006 The quintet is the Chemistry session, right? (Warleigh, Watts, Wheeler, Clyne, Stevens). Did they fix the printthrough problem on the original LP for the CD reissue? Quote
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