Woody Shaw - Elektra Musician Reissues

[fasstrack]

But me, I think of melody and rhythm as equal partners. Harmony got a little cocky lately and I think we have to put him in his place and put melody back---well---on top. Just my opinion.

To me, putting what's pretty much the same thought a bit differently, it's that melody and rhythm (and harmony, and let's not forget timbre/tone color) are always potentially talking to each other. Further, in jazz especially, any thought or act that's arguably melodic, rhythmic, etc. in origin/inspiration can be transformed into/flow into a thought/deed in one of the other "realms." In any case, if the pulse ain't in potentially open dialogue with some or all of the other realms, then my bottom will be moving with the bottom,

That's pretty much what I feel: melody and rhythm are the main event. The guy walking down the street ain't whistling the changes. But they're important too, don't get me wrong. The average listener can tell if you're playing the right changes or are in the wrong key. They won't know how to put it into words neccesarily, but they'll feel vaguely uncomfortable and maybe say something like 'that sounded off-key'. But if you go to any Latino community where live music is part of everyday life, if a band speeds up or slows down the tempo, or isn't groovin'----asses can and have been kicked over that.

There's a corallary to this larger theme of modal/simplicity vs. 'progress' (read: resolving) harmony in classical, anyway: after what many considered the chromatic excesses of late-romantic composers, notably R. Strauss and Wagner, you had a change in direction in Impressionism to scale-based and more coloristic---but definitely harmonically more static---compositions. Also the interest in Oriental materials such as certain pentatonic and other scales was prominent then. I'm not sure when they actually began in Western music, maybe someone can clue us in. But to me classical harmony has always been way in advance of jazz and after around 50 years of digesting this stuff it began to surface in jazz in pentatonic-based materials. Actually whole-tones were very big in even the 30s (Chant of The Weed comes to mind, and many others). I wish they would bring that one back. I think they stopped b/c it's just too hard to improvise on that after a while. It wants to 'land' somewhere, that's what our Western ears seem to be used to. Pentatonics were here from when they first started writing melodies. The famous examples like In a Sentimental Mood and Someone to Watch Over Me (same exact melody, actually, for the first 7 notes) show that those things were pretty common as early as the 20s/30s. It's just that players started taking it 'out' a bit more later.

And naturally thought they were hipper than hip for doing what Mr. Debussy did in like 1903.......

Edited April 23, 2009 by fasstrack

[felser]

I mean, "open dailogue" pretty much guarantees a lack of passivity, no?

Perhaps that would be a better way to put it - I have no use for playing or hearing any mushc where the pulse (which again, does not have to be "a beat", much less "regular" or "metered" is passive in the face of any other element. Now, for some, that might not be the same as being "driven by" the pulse, but in my life, musical and otherwise, the best things happen when one first finds/feels the pulse and then brings it to life through the other things. The "dialogue" still occurs, but it's inevitably one of seeking resolution with the pulse, not of seeking dominance over it.

Maybe not everybody hears/feels/plays it that way. In fact, I'm sure that they don't. Oh well about that. They got their lives, I got mine. To thine own self, and all that.

Just spare me "beauty" that just sits there. Please.

Way back when his writing mattered, Christgau talked about how the music we were drawn to was that which reflected what we recognized as the rhythm of life. I'll try to find the exact quote at home, somewhere is his book of 70's Record Reviews.

[fasstrack]

I mean, "open dailogue" pretty much guarantees a lack of passivity, no?

Perhaps that would be a better way to put it - I have no use for playing or hearing any mushc where the pulse (which again, does not have to be "a beat", much less "regular" or "metered" is passive in the face of any other element. Now, for some, that might not be the same as being "driven by" the pulse, but in my life, musical and otherwise, the best things happen when one first finds/feels the pulse and then brings it to life through the other things. The "dialogue" still occurs, but it's inevitably one of seeking resolution with the pulse, not of seeking dominance over it.

Maybe not everybody hears/feels/plays it that way. In fact, I'm sure that they don't. Oh well about that. They got their lives, I got mine. To thine own self, and all that.

Just spare me "beauty" that just sits there. Please.

Way back when his writing mattered, Christgau talked about how the music we were drawn to was that which reflected what we recognized as the rhythm of life. I'll try to find the exact quote at home, somewhere is his book of 70's Record Reviews.

I get him mixed up with Lester Bangs. Which one died? Maybe that's why he can't write anymore, he croaked. To quote that nonpareil actor Billy Crystal in a great and cruelly neglected dramatic role performance in the American classic tragi-comedy, Throw Momma From the Train (supported by an equally unforgettable performance by Branford Marsalis):

'She's not answering the phone 'cause she's dead!

'You don't answer the phone......when you're dead!!'

[CJ Shearn]

Finally purchased the two discs off Ebay, sound clips are great. I was reading a Woody Shaw discography where the reviewer thought "Night Music" was a better album than "Master of The Art" which he felt was uninspired, but I don't get that sense from the sound samples at all. Looking forward to receiving them.

[felser]

I mean, "open dailogue" pretty much guarantees a lack of passivity, no?

Perhaps that would be a better way to put it - I have no use for playing or hearing any mushc where the pulse (which again, does not have to be "a beat", much less "regular" or "metered" is passive in the face of any other element. Now, for some, that might not be the same as being "driven by" the pulse, but in my life, musical and otherwise, the best things happen when one first finds/feels the pulse and then brings it to life through the other things. The "dialogue" still occurs, but it's inevitably one of seeking resolution with the pulse, not of seeking dominance over it.

Maybe not everybody hears/feels/plays it that way. In fact, I'm sure that they don't. Oh well about that. They got their lives, I got mine. To thine own self, and all that.

Just spare me "beauty" that just sits there. Please.

Way back when his writing mattered, Christgau talked about how the music we were drawn to was that which reflected what we recognized as the rhythm of life. I'll try to find the exact quote at home, somewhere is his book of 70's Record Reviews.

I get him mixed up with Lester Bangs. Which one died? Maybe that's why he can't write anymore, he croaked. To quote that nonpareil actor Billy Crystal in a great and cruelly neglected dramatic role performance in the American classic tragi-comedy, Throw Momma From the Train (supported by an equally unforgettable performance by Branford Marsalis):

'She's not answering the phone 'cause she's dead!

'You don't answer the phone......when you're dead!!'

Lester Bangs is the one who died early. Their writing styles weren't actually all that similar. Bangs was a gonzo journalist type.