Sunny Murray and BAG

[clifford_thornton]

I could email him and ask him if you want... judging, however, from his disdain for not being treated well in the industry, I doubt he'd want one to download his shit for free.

[clifford_thornton]

  ChaunceyMorehouse said:

Note also the last song on "Big Chief" is "This Nearly Was Mine" which, last time I checked, was a Richard Rodgers-Oscar Hammerstein composition from "South Pacific."

Great version of the tune.

[Rupertdacat]

  clifford_thornton said:

... judging, however, from his disdain for not being treated well in the industry, I doubt he'd want one to download his shit for free.

O.K., I get it. You don't care about the question I asked. You have some personal agenda you're attending to.

[clifford_thornton]

I DON'T KNOW.

I am surprised that there aren't CDs of this material, but that's how Eremite and the artists set it up.

I myself don't download because, at this point, I don't see how ethically to do it. I don't know if it is ethical to pay $100 for a used copy of Big Chief, a title which I don't believe Murray got a whole lot of compensation for in the first place... but about eight years ago, it seemed like the only way to fulfill my desires.

[eremite records]

hey rupertdacat, as i said to you in an email, i sincerely regret that i am not able to offer _big chief_ in both formats right now. i suppose that a c/d release is a possibiility if the l/p sells out in a reasonable amount of time, but unfortunately i don't control that one. & clifford thornton is correct: whoever owns the work (in this case its sunny) owns it, FULL STOP. the owner does not "forfeit" any rights by choosing to release something in one format & not another. now if someone wanted to license _big chief_ for release on c/d, that would be great. i'm in the process of licensing a record released by eremite, c/d only, to a japan-based label who will issue it l/p only. when dealing with super-specialized recordings for which the audience is very small, that's how it goes sometimes.

just to say, i thought it was cool of the guys over at _inconstant sol_ blog to remove the _big chief_ files when i asked them to. a pleasant surprise. it shows they respect murray & recognize he has rights over his work. seems incredibly straight-forward to me --even more straight forward to murray-- but it's amazing how so many will go on & on about the 'grey areas.' while i certainly understand the desire, i strongly disagree with the idea that if a recording is beyond your access (for whatever reason), you can do whatever you want to acquire it.

finally, thanks for your suggestion about an "exclusive arrangement" with a third party to sell authorized CDRs. a bit tricky, that one. that you give any thought to these matters at all & don't just go find a free download of the album is also cool. there's a lot of great music out there that's vinyl only, sure you don't want to get just a basic turntable? best regards, michael

[eremite records]

hey rupertdacat, as i said to you in an email, i sincerely regret that i am not able to offer _big chief_ in both formats right now. i suppose that a c/d release is a possibiility if the l/p sells out in a reasonable amount of time, but unfortunately i don't control that one. & clifford thornton is correct: whoever owns the work (in this case its sunny) owns it, FULL STOP. the owner does not "forfeit" any rights by choosing to release something in one format & not another. now if someone wanted to license _big chief_ for release on c/d, that would be great. i'm in the process of licensing a record released by eremite, c/d only, to a japan-based label who will issue it l/p only. when dealing with super-specialized recordings for which the audience is very small, that's how it goes sometimes.

just to say, i thought it was cool of the guys over at _inconstant sol_ blog to remove the _big chief_ files when i asked them to. a pleasant surprise. it shows they respect murray & recognize he has rights over his work. seems incredibly straight-forward to me --even more straight forward to murray-- but it's amazing how so many will go on & on about the 'grey areas.' while i certainly understand the desire, i strongly disagree with the idea that if a recording is beyond your access (for whatever reason), you can do whatever you want to acquire it.

finally, thanks for your suggestion about an "exclusive arrangement" with a third party to sell authorized CDRs. a bit tricky, that one. that you give any thought to these matters at all & don't just go find a free download of the album is also cool. there's a lot of great music out there that's vinyl only, sure you don't want to get just a basic turntable? best regards, michael

[Rupertdacat]

.

  eremite records said:

whoever owns the work (in this case its sunny) owns it, FULL STOP.

I have no reason to doubt that what you say is legally the case (at least in this country, and at this time). My question, however, was about ethics.

  Quote

... while i certainly understand the desire, i strongly disagree with the idea that if a recording is beyond your access (for whatever reason), you can do whatever you want to acquire it.

Whatever I want? I find that a quite unfair (between the lines) reading of what I wrote.

Anyway... I will give the matter some more thought as I do find the problem I posed one worth pondering. I don't anticipate making any move to acquire a copy of 'Big Chief'. Perhaps one day I'll get to hear it on the radio, or in someone else's home. And if neither one of those opportunities should come up, I would be the poorer for that. I do wonder in what sense, if any, the musicians on the record might not also be the poorer should I and others ready and eager to give them a sympathetic hearing never get the chance?

Rupe

P.S. FWIW, I have only one CDR in my library- an authorized (I think) copy of Hum Dono sold by Downtown Music Gallery.

[AndrewHill]

  eremite records said:

i sincerely regret that i am not able to offer _big chief_ in both formats right now. i suppose that a c/d release is a possibiility if the l/p sells out in a reasonable amount of time, but unfortunately i don't control that one. & clifford thornton is correct: whoever owns the work (in this case its sunny) owns it, FULL STOP.

  Quote

I respect that. I don't own a turntable, but whatever benefits the artist best, I support that.

[clifford_thornton]

  Rupertdacat said:

P.S. FWIW, I have only one CDR in my library- an authorized (I think) copy of Hum Dono sold by Downtown Music Gallery.

DMG CD-Rs are totally unauthorized. But ya might as well hold onto it - great session!