clifford_thornton Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 Oh yeah, the Motian is very good but even better shit exists live, with Brackeen BLOWING on tenor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 I heard a record of Charles Brackeen with Don Cherry, Charlie Haden and Ed Blackwell. Brackeen sounded so much like Ornette, it was astonishing, even the compositions though it was BrackeenĀ“s originals, sounded exactly like something written by Ornette. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenLowe Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 I think the problem with the Byard album is an out-of-tune piano and very little "presence" in the recording - musically it's quite good - Jaki Byard is GOD - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewHill Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 (edited) I heard a record of Charles Brackeen with Don Cherry, Charlie Haden and Ed Blackwell. Brackeen sounded so much like Ornette, it was astonishing, even the compositions though it was BrackeenĀ“s originals, sounded exactly like something written by Ornette. That's got to be one of the coolest Strata East covers I've ever seen! Take that its not available on cd? Edited January 14, 2009 by Holy Ghost Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 I think the problem with the Byard album is an out-of-tune piano and very little "presence" in the recording - musically it's quite good - Jaki Byard is GOD - ahem, you might want to tell this to those britons and their atheist buses... he he Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 I heard a record of Charles Brackeen with Don Cherry, Charlie Haden and Ed Blackwell. Brackeen sounded so much like Ornette, it was astonishing, even the compositions though it was BrackeenĀ“s originals, sounded exactly like something written by Ornette. That's got to be one of the coolest Strata East covers I've ever seen! Take that its not available on cd? Here's another one designed like that: Cecil Payne - Zodiac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul secor Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 I heard a record of Charles Brackeen with Don Cherry, Charlie Haden and Ed Blackwell. Brackeen sounded so much like Ornette, it was astonishing, even the compositions though it was BrackeenĀ“s originals, sounded exactly like something written by Ornette. That's got to be one of the coolest Strata East covers I've ever seen! Take that its not available on cd? Bellaphon Records (Germany) reissued it on CD in 1993 - probably out of print now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewHill Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 I heard a record of Charles Brackeen with Don Cherry, Charlie Haden and Ed Blackwell. Brackeen sounded so much like Ornette, it was astonishing, even the compositions though it was BrackeenĀ“s originals, sounded exactly like something written by Ornette. That's got to be one of the coolest Strata East covers I've ever seen! Take that its not available on cd? Here's another one designed like that: Cecil Payne - Zodiac Nice! This Dolphy Series...any more info on it? There seems to be at least four of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 They were produced by Clifford Jordan for Strata-East. Two of his dates, the Brackeen, the Pharoah, and the Payne - that's all I know of. Nice stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewHill Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 They were produced by Clifford Jordan for Strata-East. Two of his dates, the Brackeen, the Pharoah, and the Payne - that's all I know of. Nice stuff! Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shannon Dickey Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 I really enjoy the Cecil Payne set. I do believe I have one of the Jordan's, hell, now I gotta' go to the garage and hunt!! Best to all, -------HB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shannon Dickey Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 Anybody enjoy the Charles Brackeen titles on Silkheart? I remember getting a bunch of Silkheart vinyl in the early 1990's. The 3 Charles Gayle titles, the fantastic Booker T. lp and the David Ware lps. Any feedback folks??? ---Best, HB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Berger Posted January 15, 2009 Report Share Posted January 15, 2009 In 1977, Izenzon recorded and toured in a trio of Paul Motian's, with Charles Brackeen on tenor and soprano. The album is called "Dance" and is available on ECM: Not my favorite record by Motian, and I think Brackeen is somewhat underutilized, but Izenzon is awesome here. Highly recommended for fans of arco bass playing. Guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Nessa Posted January 15, 2009 Report Share Posted January 15, 2009 They were produced by Clifford Jordan for Strata-East. Two of his dates, the Brackeen, the Pharoah, and the Payne - that's all I know of. Nice stuff! NOT produced for Strata-East. Clifford produced these for a label he was going to operate called Frontier. That enterprise never materialized and he licensed some titles to Strata-East. At some point around 1980 he offered the masters to me. He played unissued dates by Wilbur Ware and Ed Blackwell from this stockpile. He included his own titles "Glass Bead Games and In the World as part of the package. He said he was withholding a Don Cherry date at Don's request. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted January 15, 2009 Report Share Posted January 15, 2009 Oh shit, didn't know that. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ep1str0phy Posted January 15, 2009 Report Share Posted January 15, 2009 Oh yeah, the Motian is very good but even better shit exists live, with Brackeen BLOWING on tenor. Yeah--the playing is maybe a little too tasteful on the date ubu mentioned. I remember being disappointed that there wasn't a little more aggression on the trio disc, although I don't think any of the men involved could be considered bashers, really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul secor Posted January 15, 2009 Report Share Posted January 15, 2009 (edited) They were produced by Clifford Jordan for Strata-East. Two of his dates, the Brackeen, the Pharoah, and the Payne - that's all I know of. Nice stuff! NOT produced for Strata-East. Clifford produced these for a label he was going to operate called Frontier. That enterprise never materialized and he licensed some titles to Strata-East. At some point around 1980 he offered the masters to me. He played unissued dates by Wilbur Ware and Ed Blackwell from this stockpile. He included his own titles "Glass Bead Games and In the World as part of the package. He said he was withholding a Don Cherry date at Don's request. Chuck - Do you know if there was a connection between the stillborn Frontier label and Harvey Brown's Frontier Press which was active during that time frame? edit - Googled Harvey Brown - Frontier Press and answered my own question: From - Olson's Buffalo Michael Boughn The earliest appearance of community in this sense was around Harvey Brownās Frontier Press. Harvey Brown came to Buffalo in the fall of 1964. Like many of the others then flocking to the city, he came from Cleveland, Ohio via the Al Cook connection. Cook, who had been teaching at Case Western, was hired as Chair of the English Department at the new State University of New York, and given tremendous resources to build the Department. Many of those he had worked with and taught at Case Western were hired to teach at Buffalo, or followed others there as students. Unlike most others, however, Brown was a millionaire, a designation that still meant something of consequence in 1964. His grandfather had invented a mechanism that facilitated the off-loading of materials from river barges, and the money he accumulated from his invention propelled his family into the upper echelons of Ohio society. By the time Harvey Brown got to Buffalo, he had rejected both his social position, preferring the company of jazz musicians to debutantes, and his financial position. His relation to the money he inherited was based on the understanding that it embodied two contradictory energies or powers: accumulation and circulation. Call them angels. Brown felt that to capitulate to the angel of accumulation was to give power over your life to money, to allow it to rule your spirit. To give that power over to the angel of circulation, on the other hand, was to subjugate money to spirit. That was the path he chose, and Olson became one of the main instruments he used to realize it. Harvey Brownās connection with Charles Olson was immediate and intense. In so far as they shared a sense of political priorities, Olson fit into Brownās plans to use his money to further certain specific ends. Brown, through his connections with jazz musicians in New York and Cleveland, had started a recording company to further the work of struggling artists such as Don Cherry, Ornette Coleman, Clifford Brown, and Clifford Jordan. Brown understood the work of these artists to constitute the ground of a new American republic, the visionary incarnation of Winthropās City on a Hill. It was an ec-centric community whose importance was both in its antithetical message, and in the method it had pioneered: improvisation based on the call and response of traditional African-American music (see Brownās fascicle āJazz Playingā in The Curriculum of the Soul). That method for Brown resonated precisely with Olsonās sense of the projective, and that correspondence provided the basis for Brownās ongoing support for both the recording project, and for Frontier Press. Though Harvey Brown was a bit late on the scene to record Clifford Brown. Edited January 15, 2009 by paul secor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gheorghe Posted January 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2009 Look for the DVD titled David, Moffett & Ornette - Paris 1966. The company Rhapsody currently publishes and distributes it. Some nice footage of Izenzon there, and one's given some insight into the person as well. Warmly recommended. After I read your answer, I ordered it and got it yesterday. Well really, the musicĀ“s great. ItĀ“s much of the music they played at Golden Circle and itĀ“s really interesting to see them improvising to the film. Too bad it isnĀ“t a bit longer and I didnĀ“t see the excerpt of Ornette playing on piano or Charles Moffett playing xylophone. But itĀ“s great to see all of them playing. Izenzon really looks like a nice kind of person, would have been great to hang around with those people. The longest part of the film is Roland Kirk. Well I was really looking forward seeing that. The short excerps from Ronnie Scott are great, and Kirk at the Zoo also. But I canĀ“t get with that other strange sounds and the John Cage stuff. Well, IĀ“m hip enough to dig more freakish stuff like Ornette on the fiddle and all that, but if itĀ“s just abstract sounds like "western avantgarde" itĀ“s a bit too much for me..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmirBagachelles Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 Fascinating thread. Chuck's info on Clifford Jordan's stash of unissued dates reminds me of another great unissued treasure, the balance of Ornette's Town Hall concert containing Izenzon's epic bass solo, which I believe was largely composed. (Do I have that right?) Let's hope Ornette will one day issue that great concert at full length. For sure, the Blue Note reissues of the Golden Circle records are (for me) the apex of the expanded-edition-CD-era. Those discs are mind blowers. Roll up the windows, turn it up and drive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 From what I understand - and somebody may know more about this - the recordings were badly marred by distortion and the only salvageable (then) material was issued via ESP. I don't know the state of the tapes now or whether any more salvageable music has been found from that concert. Ornette has never been one for going back into his archives. Who knows whether that will change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 From what I understand - and somebody may know more about this - the recordings were badly marred by distortion and the only salvageable (then) material was issued via ESP. I don't know the state of the tapes now or whether any more salvageable music has been found from that concert. Ornette has never been one for going back into his archives. Who knows whether that will change. This is off-topic but wasn't there a disc on A&M that was sort of an archival release? A supplement to - I think - "Dancing in Your Head"? (I'm not a completist of his music post 1970 or so... and before, my collection has various gaps, too) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clifford_thornton Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 Hmm. Not sure, as I have Dancing in Your Head on vinyl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kh1958 Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 From what I understand - and somebody may know more about this - the recordings were badly marred by distortion and the only salvageable (then) material was issued via ESP. I don't know the state of the tapes now or whether any more salvageable music has been found from that concert. Ornette has never been one for going back into his archives. Who knows whether that will change. This is off-topic but wasn't there a disc on A&M that was sort of an archival release? A supplement to - I think - "Dancing in Your Head"? (I'm not a completist of his music post 1970 or so... and before, my collection has various gaps, too) You are probably thinking of the Artists House LP Body Meta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 Hmm. Not sure, as I have Dancing in Your Head on vinyl. I thought "Body Meta" was the supplement to "Dancing" but I might be wrong, AMG says "Body Meta" was the first release of Artists House, so... no idea where I got that idea from, sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted March 4, 2009 Report Share Posted March 4, 2009 Yup, we were posting simultaneously... when did "Body Meta" come out, in 1976 as AMG says? In that case it wouldn't really be a belated second helping... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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