Did anyone play organized sports?

[connoisseur series500]

Interesting quotes:

Here's a portion which supports my argument regarding the bloodthirstiness of the game:

But chess has a third--and unique--characteristic that is particularly fatal. It is not just monomaniacal and abstract, but its arena is a playing field on which the other guy really is after you. The essence of the game is constant struggle against an adversary who, by whatever means of deception and disguise, is entirely, relentlessly, unfailingly dedicated to your destruction. It is only a board, but it is a field of dreams for paranoia.

One comment regarding chess as strategy as brought up by Papsrus: good players put themselves in the game because there isn't a single strategic path. Often there are several routes and the route taken ultimately is an individual one which expresses you as a thinker. Chess has its techniques as well, just as tennis and fencing do. These are learned from books and prior experience; but strategy is not a technique. It can be very individual.

Perhaps the game attracts nutcases. I can believe that; but there's no doubt that it intensifies madness if it doesn't create it from scratch. Akiba Rubinstein went off into madness after playing the game for several years. He may have been predisposed but chess sure led him to it. Again, you've got an opponent who threatens your view of life. It leads to paranoia in general.

[A Lark Ascending]

I was one of those kids who was given a ball and then abandoned by the Physical Education teacher whilst he focused on those with natural talent. Not surprisingly, I have an exaggerated dislike of all sport.

That was me too.

No wonder we ended up listening to Henry Cow records!

[Tom Storer]

My ball team would stick me out in right field where I'd get bored and start picking weeds.

I also got the right field treatment. My brother characterized me as standing there saying "I don't care a row of buttons whether it's fair or foul, nature alone is beautiful."

[Jazzmoose]

Interesting quotes:

Here's a portion which supports my argument regarding the bloodthirstiness of the game:

But chess has a third--and unique--characteristic that is particularly fatal. It is not just monomaniacal and abstract, but its arena is a playing field on which the other guy really is after you. The essence of the game is constant struggle against an adversary who, by whatever means of deception and disguise, is entirely, relentlessly, unfailingly dedicated to your destruction. It is only a board, but it is a field of dreams for paranoia.

It doesn't support your argument, because it is completely false. In spite of what you and other chess players may believe, the desire to destroy your opponent is not something that only happens in chess. Or chess and boxing. You're talking about an approach, not something that is inherent in the game. This approach can be applied to almost any endeavor. Naturally, those that rise to the top in the game are going to exhibit this quality more than those who don't; that's what it takes to win. But to think that this is something unique to chess boggles my mind...

[Tom Storer]

I think it's time we recognized "message board argument" as a bloodthirsty sport. Connoisseur series500 and Dan Gould are vying to destroy one another's very manhood!

[connoisseur series500]

nah!

[Niko]

well, what this thread did good is it reminded me to send birthday greetings to my chess playing friend yesterday on time for the first time in years... (that guy btw did his army service in the sports group of the army doing nothing but playing chess for a year)

my brother btw hasn't lost a game of scrabble since he was 13... no idea what's so different in his playing but he always wins

[AndrewHill]

Just learned what this all about....had to ask friends of mine for clarification.

[7/4]

I was one of those kids who was given a ball and then abandoned by the Physical Education teacher whilst he focused on those with natural talent. Not surprisingly, I have an exaggerated dislike of all sport.

That was me too.

No wonder we ended up listening to Henry Cow records!

You may have something there. When I think of all the Cow fans I know, I can see a pattern now.

My ball team would stick me out in right field where I'd get bored and start picking weeds.

I also got the right field treatment. My brother characterized me as standing there saying "I don't care a row of buttons whether it's fair or foul, nature alone is beautiful."

That's the thing about support groups, we all had the same experience.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

I always wanted to be crap at sports - and succeeded magnificently! I couldn't get this idea of winning; couldn't see the point. To me, sports were something to be enjoyed. And, as far as I was concerned, that meant me doing things I wasn't supposed to do. Like taking the piss out of the teacher or other players or the game itself; or cheating obviously; or, grinning broadly, letting an opponent score when I could easily have stopped him; or skiving.

Every so often we were forced to do a cross country run, through the wild parts of a huge park near the school. I lived at the edge of this park and the route ran close to home. So I'd stop off and have a cup of tea and a Jimmy Riddle; get back to school a lot later than everyone else.

MG

[vajerzy]

Baseball was my sport- pitcher and shortstop from Little League through Jr. College. Then played softball for awhile.

Played 30+ adult baseball- pitcher and shortstop in Richmond, VA- that was a lot of fun- last year was 1999. I stopped because it wasn't fun anymore.

My son is 27 so I'll be making a baseball comeback when he's eligible to play in the adult baseball league in 2010- it's now a 28+ league.

I enjoy team sports- everyone has a role and you must do your job for the team to be successful on the field. I like the team concept.

[PHILLYQ]

I didn't play any organized sports but I played a ton of sports on the street- stickball, slapball, stoopball, punchball, king/queen, touch football. Then we had the many games, like two box, five box, etc. My friends and I developed a new thing in the neighborhood we dubbed'push-wrestling'. Two guys stand in two squares of concrete and the object is to push one guy out. Years later I discovered that it was an urban version of sumo wrestling, but without the beefy guys and the diapers. I still play hanball at 52. Oh the joys of growing up in Brooklyn!

[A Lark Ascending]

Every so often we were forced to do a cross country run, through the wild parts of a huge park near the school. I lived at the edge of this park and the route ran close to home. So I'd stop off and have a cup of tea and a Jimmy Riddle; get back to school a lot later than everyone else.

MG

I did cross country every week for a year - but it was approved skiving. We'd run out the school grounds and as soon as a hedge was hiding us have a nice 90 minute walk and chat in the countryside, sometimes stopping at my house where my mum gave us refreshments! We were happy.

The PE staff were happy bucause they did not know what to do with us - with the weedy ones looking after themselves they could focus on those who could kick a ball straight. God knows what the risk assessment form would look like today for that approach.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

God knows what the risk assessment form would look like today for that approach.

The really dreadful thing is, the risk assessment form would be right today.

Same with just getting on your bike and riding out into the country, trespassing on farmland or ruined farmhouses and so on. Any parent now who let their kids do what my mother used to let me and my mate get up to would be out of her mind.

MG

[Jazzmoose]

Well, according to modern laws and parenting practices, we all had no business living past age ten anyway...

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Well, according to modern laws and parenting practices, we all had no business living past age ten anyway...

It really was a different society in the early & mid fifties. Kids of ten-fourteen could cycle around the countryside, go out onto the Yorkshire Moors, or to another town, and no one would fear that any real harm would come to them; and it wouldn't. So long as we were competent cyclists and knew the highway code, we were safe to go and do what we liked.

It beat doing homework by MILES!

MG

[ejp626]

Well, according to modern laws and parenting practices, we all had no business living past age ten anyway...

It really was a different society in the early & mid fifties. ...

MG

Ain't that the truth, but today is even a different world from the 70s. I was telling my wife how I walked my younger brother to school. I was in 3rd grade and he was in 1st grade (so roughly 8 and 6 y.o.)! There was only one busy street we had to cross, and we knew enough not to mess with the crossing guard. And at 8 I could ride my bike to visit friends and generally just had to be back by dinner time during the summer. I can't begin to imagine what restrictions my kids will have on their activities, although if we move to a more residential neighborhood, it might be a little looser.

But I was also thinking about riding in the trunk section of station wagons and in vans (the soccer coach took us to games that way). None of this would be allowed now. Clearly some things were way too dangerous, but the nanny state is in full force and has taken away a lot of the fun of life.

My childhood did have video games, but they were a pretty small part of my life and we were outside a lot more. I don't know this will be the case for my children, growing up in the era when everyone is plugged in and wired at all times (Gameboy, iPod, iPhone). To borrow from Donna Haraway, in the US, we really have become a culture of cyborgs -- and in a relative short timeframe too.

[papsrus]

Yes, the more apt question for today's children will be: Did anyone play unorganized sports? Shame.

[AllenLowe]

late to this and haven't read through - suffice to say that Little League in the 1960s was a haven for neo-Fascist frustrated commandos who'd washed out of boot camp and been cut from the Babe Ruth league for screwing goats and dropping fly balls -

even at the tender age of 14 I was aware of this and basically told my Little League coach this (I was slightly but only slightly more tactful) - the asshole - and I still remember his name - suspended me from the team -

[7/4]

That was part of the problem.

Even at a young age, I noticed that the coaches were assholes.

.

[AllenLowe]

we had some very young and uncoordinated kids on the team and whenever there was a practice they watched and only watched - I pointed out to the coach that it made more sense, at least in practice sessions, to let THEM play more so maybe they could improve their game - as the ones who got all the practice (hitting, fielding) needed it the least - this INFURIATED him - so I quit -

[Dave James]

When my brother and I coached bantam (14-16) ice hockey, we made it a point to meet with the parents before each season. We asked one simple question. Do you want to play to win or do you want everyone to have equal ice time. The answer was always "play to win", so that's what we did. However, when that meant their kid sat more than he played (parents being the least objective talent evaluators on the planet) it was inevitable that someone would start bitching about playing time.

A couple of other related thoughts. The best possible thing that could ever happen to enhance the value of sports for kids would be to remove the parents from the equation entirely. Since that isn't likely to happen, the next best thing would be to not allow fathers to coach their own kids. What a train wreck that is.

Up over and out.

[vajerzy]

we had some very young and uncoordinated kids on the team and whenever there was a practice they watched and only watched - I pointed out to the coach that it made more sense, at least in practice sessions, to let THEM play more so maybe they could improve their game - as the ones who got all the practice (hitting, fielding) needed it the least - this INFURIATED him - so I quit -

That's a terrible coach......I assistant coach my 8 year old daughter's softball team last year and I like having all the kids play different positions during the year and see what they're comfortable with and what they like. Parents appreciated that- because I was being fair to their kids by giving everyone a chance. Natural selection will determine what kids played the "key" positions- like 1st base.

I also believe that the parents of girls softball are nicer and more behaved than with boys baseball.

Scary to think how one coach can scar a kid for life and drive him or her away from a game they love.