Is it just me ?

[WorldB3]

I...Andrew Hill then Thad Jones then John Coltrane then Three Sounds and any of them not just my favourites....you would be surprised at how many tracks at the end of a cd you forget about

One example of this is I had a friend tell me that he didn't like Adam's Apple by Wayne shorter because its opens with a Sidewinder type tune in the title track then a blues, then a ballad and then a re-working of Footprints that he felt was tame compared to the Miles Smiles version, in other words same old Blue Note Formula stuff. I asked did you ever play the second half the record/CD?, he said no and was blown away by the variety on Teru, Chief Crazy Horse and The Collector and how forward thinking the playing was on it.

Once you get past the forced Sidewinder type of tune their is tons of great music to explore with the 60's Blue Note's. That said I have gone through periods where I had to take a break from it but when I come back with fresh ears I always enjoy them.

As for RVG am the only one who thinks the recording of the piano is always a bit dull or lacking the harmonic range of what it should sound like? It may have been limitations of the recording equipment of the time.

Edited November 18, 2008 by WorldB3

[Peter Friedman]

The music on Blue Note, Prestige, Riverside, Contemporary, Pacific Jazz, Verve, and a few other labels was what I grew up hearing from the mid-1950's on into the early 1960's as my jazz interest developed and intensified. When certain music plays a vital part of your early jazz experience it is apt to stay highly important to you over the years.

Whenever I put on recordings by Horace Silver, Art Blakey, Jackie McLean, Sonny Clark, Hank Mobley, Stan Getz,Sonny Rollins, Shelly Manne, and other jazz masters of that period I find the experience highly satisfying.

[A Lark Ascending]

I've gone through periods where much of Hard Bop stuff on BN bores me. You let it go for a little while and listen to something else. Come back to it with fresh ears.

My experience too...of most music. I wouldn't go as far as to say it bores me, but I lose the desire to listen to it. Time elsewhere always refreshes the ear.

[Daniel A]

One example of this is I had a friend tell me that he didn't like Adam's Apple by Wayne shorter because its opens with a Sidewinder type tune in the title track then a blues, then a ballad and then a re-working of Footprints that he felt was tame compared to the Miles Smiles version, in other words same old Blue Note Formula stuff. I asked did you ever play the second half the record/CD?, he said no and was blown away by the variety on Teru, Chief Crazy Horse and The Collector and how forward thinking the playing was on it.

The first time I heard 'Adam's Apple' I was slightly underwhelmed (the only Shorter album I'd heard at that point was 'Speak No Evil'), but I learned to like it and the tune I always hear in my head when I think of that album these days is 'El Gaucho', such a good tune. Never heard another version of that tune with the very special vibe of the original! (Which of course goes for most Shorter - or any original jazz - compositions, but anyway...)

[six string]

Paul Secor: "As Chuck pointed out, there was much more to 1960's Blue Note than hard bop."

There was also much more to 1960's jazz releases than Blue Note.

It is the excessive glorification of one label that I find so ludicrous. Ditto the deification of Rudy Van Gelder. I used Rudy for some of my sessions—they were no better than other studios I worked with. In fact, I was often bothered by the slightly cavernous sound.

I think because of the collectability of Bluenote ($$$) Rudy has been swept up in the hysteria of the label. Since it's the most collectable label on earth it would be easy to think that the most collectable label would have the best recording engineer. He gets a lot of attention for being there and putting it down on tape, but did he do anything special? I don't have any experience recording in a studio but I've never heard of Rudy doing anything special in terms of recording goes.

As far as the original poster's remarks go, I love No Room For Squares. It's one of my favorite Mobley albums. I do see his point a little but as others have stated, there is a lot of non BN music out there to hear and I do spread my money around other labels and genres.

Re:Shorter's Adam's Apple, I could say the same about even Lee Morgan's Sidewinder. I've heard that song so much that I usually play side 2 of the lp when I want to hear that album. It sounds a lot fresher than side 1 (to me).

[Teasing the Korean]

I truly believe that Blue Note cover art is one of the reasons that the label has become elevated in status over its Contemporaries. Get it? Contemporary?

[king ubu]

Yeah, reading of BN having some worthwhile contemporaries in Prestige and Riverside, I thought about Contemporary, too... why do folks forget about Contemporary even when they stress that Prestige and Riverside are as great as Blue Note? Also Pacific Jazz has been hijacked more or less by Blue Note...

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

I don't think it's something that's come along because of cover art or even a post-hoc collectors' thing. Back in the early sixties, we all knew Blue Notes were the BIZ. They were the BIZ because they were reliable; you knew you'd be getting something great, whatever you bought. Much though I admire (and indeed prefer) Prestige, you can't say that about that company.

The reliability of Blue Note definitely was the result of a certain uniformity of approach. That included paid rehearsals (which Prestige didn't do), supervision by a very competent musician (Quebec or Pearson) and an agreed approach from Rudy Van Gelder. I don't think you can have it both ways, though. The idea that you can have reliably great product by assembling a bunch of guys outside the office, piling them into cars and driving them into New Jersey, and saying, "well, now we're at the studio, play", as you can see on the sleeve notes of Jug's "The happy blues", is really not accurate.

MG

[king ubu]

Good points - but again: from what I've read (little) and heard (a bit more), Contemporary should be a worthy candidate for similarly high praise? Their product had some kind of concept/planning, was mostly executed very well, and the sound and cover art was - in a different way - very attractive, too! And with Hampton Hawes, Harold Land, Curtis Counce and some of Shelly Manne's bands, they weren't even that far stylistically from Blue Note.

[Christiern]

It works both ways, MG. I think this "they paid for rehearsals" thing is overplayed, but there is also the sound of surprise, as Whitney called it—there is something oxymoronic about rehearsed jazz. Then, too, the fact that so many of these musicians often shared a bandstand and, indeed, some were working groups, makes the rehearsal aspect less important. Big bands or large groups is another matter. I have not heard any complaints about the many, many recordings made by Columbia, Victor, Decca, etc. without formal rehearsals—paid or otherwise.