Organ albums w/ horn(s), but NO GUITAR -- like Larry Young's UNITY

[Rooster_Ties]

Howdy all,

How many albums can we come up with that have the same instrumentation as Larry Young's magnum opus "Unity" (trumpet, tenor (or alto), organ, and drums)??

Please provide the line-up, and year of recording (if such info is handy). Thanks!!

Perhaps the most obvious one I could think of was...

Larry Young Quartet -- Mother Ship (Blue Note LT 1038)

Lee Morgan (tp) Herbert Mogan (ts) Larry Young (org) Eddie Gladden (d)

Rudy Van Gelder Studio, Englewood Cliffs, NJ, February 7, 1969

EDIT: I've expanded the topic so now it includes ANY organ album with NO GUITAR, but with drums, and any number of horns.

Edited July 1, 2008 by Rooster_Ties

[Joe G]

I think Bill Heid's Dark Secrets has a similar lineup.

[Niko]

i once asked whether what i hear in places is uncredited guitar comping (or just one of the organ's amazing possibilities...)(didn't get an answer) leaving that issue aside

Johnny Hammond Smith - A little taste

qualifies

more info from jazzdisco:

RLP 496 Johnny "Hammond" Smith - A Little Taste

Virgil Jones (tp) Houston Person (ts) Johnny "Hammond" Smith (org) Luis Taylor (d)

NYC, 1963

don't find the album right now (second half of the open house twofer - get them while you can!!); in my old post i claimed the guitar playing was for example in nica's dream in various places including the organ solo...

Edited July 1, 2008 by Niko

[AndrewHill]

If we can allow a conga player, then John Patton's Boogaloo would suffice:

Vincent McEwan (tp), Harold Alexander (fl, ts), George Edward Brown (d) Richie 'Pablo' Landrum (cga)

[JSngry]

Buddy Terry's Prestige side Natural Soul features a core group of Terry, Larry Young, & Eddie Gladden. On two tunes, this core trio is augmented by Woody Shaw, and this quartet (I like to think of it as Pure Newark Unity...) forms the group for the album's highlight/centerpiece/whatever, a cooking 12:28 jam called "The Revealing Time".

If that makes you drool, don't feel bad. It is that good.

[paul secor]

Bill Heid: Da Girl - B3, tenor, trumpet, drums, with congas and percussion added on a couple of tracks

[Jim Alfredson]

Buddy Terry's Prestige side Natural Soul features a core group of Terry, Larry Young, & Eddie Gladden. On two tunes, this core trio is augmented by Woody Shaw, and this quartet (I like to think of it as Pure Newark Unity...) forms the group for the album's highlight/centerpiece/whatever, a cooking 12:28 jam called "The Revealing Time".

If that makes you drool, don't feel bad. It is that good.

Whoa. Never heard of this one. Gonna have to track it down. Thanks!

[DukeCity]

If we further expand the saxophone chair to include baritone, there's a Ronnie Cuber date.

"Live at the Blue Note" ProJazz 629, rec. 1985

Ronnie Cuber, bari

Randy Brecker, trumpet

Lonnie Smith, organ

Ronnie Burrage, drums

[Rooster_Ties]

Wow! So then nothing else (or nearly nothing else) meets the technical requirements of being trumpet, tenor (or alto), organ, and drums (and no other instruments) -- ???

Both those Bill Heid dates have a percussionist and/or conga player on a few tracks, and so does the John Patton date previously mentioned (all GREAT dates, and worthy of mention). And the Buddy Terry date only has the full quartet on two tracks only. And the Ronnie Cuber date is bari (not that I'm not thankful for its mention).

So, then, is the ONLY date that matches exactly (or with alto instead of tenor), that one Johnny Hammond Smith date?? -- which according to the post above, might include some uncredited guitar (don't know, I haven't heard it), which would then bump it from being a match.

I can't believe this instrumentation line-up is THAT rare. So then there's a chance "Mother Ship" could be the ONLY date that matches "Unity" exactly??

Edited July 1, 2008 by Rooster_Ties

[Jim Alfredson]

Not too surprising. Jazz organists like having a guitarist because a) the instruments are so complimentary to each other and b) guitarists can play chords behind the organ solo.

[Chas]

Don Patterson's 1969 Prestige side , Oh Happy Day features Virgil Jones on trumpet , George Coleman or Houston Person on tenor and Frankie Jones on drums .

[Rooster_Ties]

Thanks for that Don Patterson side -- that appears to match UNITY's instrumentation.

Not too surprising. Jazz organists like having a guitarist because a) the instruments are so complimentary to each other and b) guitarists can play chords behind the organ solo.

OK, I've expanded the topic to include any organ album that DOESN'T include guitar, but WITH any number of horns, plus drums.

Edited July 1, 2008 by Rooster_Ties

[AndrewHill]

John Patton's Understanding: Harold Alexander (fl, ts) Hugh Walker (d).

[kh1958]

Sonny Stitt and Booker Ervin--Soul People (Prestige)

Sonny Stitt--Night Crawler (Prestige)

Don Patterson--The Boss Man (Prestige)

With Don Patterson and Billy James, the latter two with only Sonny Stitt.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Don Patterson - Mellow soul - Prestige with David Newman (ts, fl), Billy James (d)

Sonny Stitt - The way it was: live at the Left Bank - Label M with Patterson & James.

Rhoda Scott - Live at the Key Club - TruSound with Joe Thomas (ts), Bill Elliott (d)

Rhoda Scott - Live at the Olympia - Barclay (Jazz in Paris) with Joe Thomas (ts, fl), Cees Kranenburg (d)

Shirley Scott - Blue seven - Prestige with Joe Newman (tp), Oliver Nelson (ts), George Tucker (b), Roy Brooks (d)

Eddie "Lockjaw" Davis & Shirley Scott

Cookbook vols 1, 2 & 3 - Prestige with Jerome Richardson (fl, ts, bars), Duvuvier (b) Edgehill (d)

Misty - MV no Richardson + Ray Barretto (cga)

Eddie Davis Trio - Roulette Davis, Scott, Duvuvier (b) Edgehill (d)

Goodies from Davis - Roulette ditto

Jaws - Prestige ditto

Smokin' - Prestige ditto + Jerome

Very saxy - Prestige FOUR horns - Hawk, Arnett, Buddy Tate & Jaws, Scott, Duvuvier (b) Edgehill (d)

Jaws in orbit - PR with Steve Pulliam (tb) Duvuvier (b) Edgehill (d)

Bacalao - PR with Duvuvier (b) Edgehill (d) Ray Barretto Luis Perez (cga bgo)

Probably some of the Jaws/Scott albums on King would also qualify but I ain't got any of those.

Shirley Scott & Stanley Turrentine

Dearly beloved - BN with Roy Brooks (d)

Let it go - Impulse with Ron Carter (b), Mack Simpkins (d)

Never let me go - BN with Ray Barretto and either Major Holley, Al Harewood or Sam Jones Clarence Johnston

Chip off the old block - BN with Blue Mitchell, Earl May, Al Harewood

Hip soul - PR with herbie Lewis, Roy Brooks

Hip twist - PR with George Tucker, Candy Finch

Blue flames - PR Cranshaw, Finch

The soul is willing - PR Holley, Grasella Oliphant

Soul shoutin' - PR Earl May, Oliphant

Queen of the organ - Impulse with Cranshaw, Finch

Shirley Scott - Oasis - Muse with Virgil Jones (tp), Houston Person & Charles Davis (ts) Arthur Harper (b), Mickey Roker (d)

Shirley Scott - One for me - Strata East with Harold Vick (ts) Billy Higgins (d)

Chester Thompson - Powerhouse - Black Jazz with Rudy Johnson (ts), Al Hall (tb), Ray Pounds on the drums

Wild Bill Davis - That's all - Jazz Connaisseur with Plas Johnson (ts) Butch Miles (d)

Teddy Edwards - Heart & soul - Contemporary with Gerry Wiggins (org), Leroy Vin (b) Milt Turner (d)

Wild Bill Moore - Bottom groove - Jzld with Johnny "Hammond" Smith Joe Benjamin (b0, Ben Riley (d) Ray Barretto (cga)

Jesse Jones Jr (as, fl) - Soul serenade - Contemporary with Melton Mustapha (tp), Lonnie Smith (org, p), Curtis Lundy (b), Danny Burger (d)

Don Patterson - Oh happy day - PR with Virgil Jones (tp) Houston Person (ts) George Coleman (ts 3 tx), Frankie Jones (d)

Don Patterson - The exciting organ of - PR with Booker Ervin, Billy James (d)

Don Patterson - Hip cake walk - PR same + Leonard Houston (as 1 tk)

Sonny Stitt - At DJ Lounge - Argo with Johnny Board (ts), Eddie Buster (org) Joe Shelton (d)

Gene Ammons - Live in Chicago - PR with Eddie Buster & Gerald Donovan (d)

Gene Ammons - Preachin' - PR with Sleepy Anderson (org), Sylvester Hickman (b) Dorral Anderson (d)

More later, I'm going out for a fag.

MG

[Soulstation1]

MG = Greazzzze God

[paul secor]

Think Rooster's opened up the gates with his expansion of limitations.

[Rooster_Ties]

So, then I guess the key factor seems to be finding trumpet on organ albums. And I even seem to remember there being something in John Zorn's liner-notes to John Patton's "Boogaloo" about the relative absense of trumpet players on organ albums (in general). [That date did have trumpet, maybe one of few such Patton dates.]

So it's not so much a lack of organ albums WITHOUT guitar, as it is finding them both WITHOUT guitar, but then also WITH trumpet (at the same time).

So, what's the deal with there being fewer trumpet players on organ albums??

Edited July 1, 2008 by Rooster_Ties

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Odell Brown & the Organ-izers - Raisin' the roof - Cadet with Artee Duke Payne (as, ts), Tommy Purvis (ts) Curtis Prince (d)

Odell Brown & the Organ-izers - Mellow yellow - Cadet with Artee Duke Payne (as, ts), Tommy Purvis (ts) Curtis Prince (d) Louis Satterfield (b) Master Henry Gibson (cga)

Milt Buckner & Buddy Tate - Crazy rhythm - B&B with Wallace Bishop (d)

Milt Buckner & Buddy Tate - Midnight slows vol 4 - B&B with Jo Jones (d)

Milt Buckner - Midnight slows vol 6 - B&B with Arnett & Eddie Chamblee (ts) Panama Francis (d)

Jack McDuff - Tough 'Duff - PR with Jimmy Forrest (ts), Lem winchester (vib) Bill Elliott (d)

Melvin Rhyne - Organizing - Jzld with Johnny Griffin, Blue Mitchell, Gene Harris (p), Andy Simpkins (b) Albert Heath (d)

Shirley Scott - A walkin' thing - Candid with Terrell Stafford (tp), Tim Warfield (ts) Arthur Harper (b) Aaron Walker (d)

Arnett Cobb - Smooth sailin' - PR with Buster Cooper (tb), Austin Mitchell (org) Duvivier (b) Osie Johnson (d)

A Cobb - - Blow Arnett blow - Witih Jaws, Wild Bill Davis, Duvuivier Edgehill

Dinner time

MG

[king ubu]

just Rhoda & Klook - and a great disc!

currently Barbara Dennerlein also seems to mostly work in a duo format, but then she has all kinds of midi stuff hooked up to her organ - I'm not much of a fan of hers.

[Chuck Nessa]

[Niko]

had another candidate in the mail today

Johnny Hammond Smith - Talk That Talk

(from 1960 with Oliver Nelson (on some tunes only), George Tucker, Art Taylor and Ray Barretto)

and then one with an interesting looking line-up that i don't own:

Sarah Morrow & The American All Stars In Paris (2005)

Sarah Morrow (trombone); Hal Singer (tenor saxophone); Rhoda Scott (Hammond b-3 organ); Wayne Dockery, Peter Giron (bass instrument); John Betsch, Jeff Boudreaux (drums)

two more in the tenor/organ/drums format (available cheaply on cd the last time i looked)

Jimmy Forrest - Heart of the Forrest (with Shirley Scott and Randissimo Marsh)

John Simon - Legacy (with Don Patterson and Greg McDonald)

two albums by trombonist Nils Wogram featuring Florian Ross on organ and Dejan Terzic on drums

Daddy's Bones and Affinity

Edited July 2, 2008 by Niko

[king ubu]

Speaking of trombone players...

Nils Wogram heads a trio with just organ (Florian Ross) and drums (Dejan Terzic), which he calls "Nostalgia Trio". They're quite good! (And Wogram is a friggin' great 'bonist, believe me!)

Christophe Schweizer who has several projects going on, leads one with tb (Schweizer), ts (Ohad Talmor), organ (Sam Bar Sheshet) and drums (Tyshawn Sorey), called "Full Circle Rainbow". He also did a CD with that title (on TCB) with the line-up of Talmor, Jason Moran or George Colligan (both organ exclusively, only one appearing at the time), and Billy Hart. Not a bad disc, but "Physique" (OmniTone, with Alex Sipiagin, Donny McCaslin a.o. and off topic in this thread) is much, much better!

[Chuck Nessa]

[Niko]

can we post albums with bass players and/or conga drummers?