Rooster_Ties Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 I wonder if Sam Rivers will ever get the RVG treatment?? Now that Andrew Hill will have a title in this series other than Point of Departure, we can all start crossing our fingers for Contours. Can't we? I wish. But look, (IMHO) the only Sam Rivers title worthy of being an RVG was "Fuschia Swing Song", and they went and made it a Conn. Seems that seeing "Contours" as an RVG is about a 1 in a million shot, at best. I've said it 100 times before.... They shoulda made "Fuschia Swing Song" an RVG, and followed it up with "Contours" as a Conn about a year later. Quote
Peter Johnson Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 Tom. I agree with you re fuchschia swing & contours. And another thought. Sixth sense A-FUCKIN'gain? WTF??? There's SO much else to release...... Quote
David Ayers Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 Tom. I agree with you re fuchschia swing & contours. And another thought. Sixth sense A-FUCKIN'gain? WTF??? There's SO much else to release...... I'm puzzled by that too. I don't rate it that highly and I thought not many people did. Perhaps they think it will come up well in sonic terms and decided to put it out for that reason? Quote
David Ayers Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 I'm actually glad to see this series taking a pause on Mobley. While I would like to see an RVG of Hi Voltage, I appreciate that this series is branching out some. Late As you probably already know, the JRVG of Hi Voltage comes out this month. Worth investigating, I should think... Quote
Son-of-a-Weizen Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 The big screw up (*), of course, is RVG-ing The Night of the Cookers instead of Here to Stay, which may very well be Freddie's finest moment on Blue Note. This just never would have happened had we been back on the good ship BNBB. Someone would have started a thread......everyone would have lined up to give the thumbs up to 'Here to Stay' (BFrank would still be **tching about not being able to find a copy B) ) & trashed the 'Cookers'......then transmited the message to Tom who would do the right thing or suffer the consequences. Those folks at BN have been adrift without proper counsel for too long now and are starting to make questionable decisions. Quote
Matthew Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 Can't say that I'm too excited about the two Jimmy Smith RVGs. Both of them are very average dates to my mind. Better choices would have been The Incredible Jimmy Smith at Club Baby Grand and make that a two-fer, though the TOCJs sounds mighty fine. Even something like Lonesome Road could have been an interesting RVG. Those, along with the usual suspects, Midnight Special, Back at the Chicken Shack, & Crazy! Baby. I just get tired of spending so much on JRVGs to get decent sounding Smith cds. Quote
Ed S Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 It's really nice to see that the RVG series has been successful enough to warrant a list as large as this one. It's great for those who have come to BN later in the game and missed the first and sometimes second releases of these titles. Also great for those who like to "upgrade". Once again I'm thankful for my combination of lousy ears and crappy equipment. Looks like I'm going to save a bundle that I can put to good use elsewhere as I'll pick up the 2 or three titles that I don't already have in one form or other. Quote
DrJ Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 I am continually amazed at how people react to reissue news. I mean jeez, there may be a few somewhat questionable titles in there (I also raised both eyebrows at SIXTH SENSE) but there's a lot of really great ones as well, including some that people have been asking for forever, literally since the early days of the old BN board (GOIN' WEST, READDY FOR FREDDIE, etc), and a good chunk of these titles are only available in the U.S. in aged remasterings (the Hendersons, Byrds, etc). Not to mention that many have been OOP here for some time...and in case you haven't noticed, SIXTH SENSE is one of those OOP titles - so for people who missed out on it, this will be the way they can hear it. It's like people actually expect Cuscuna/BN to consult with each of us personally before they dare make a move in deciding what to reissue. Is it that hard to conceive that maybe some other people out there were actually waiting for some of the titles that are being singled out as "questionable" here to be RVG'd? The unseemly side of my personality wanted to post "get over yourself, get a real life, quit griping, and just deal with it, the world will continue to rotate even though THE GIGOLO will apparently not be in the next batch of RVGs," but that wouldn't have been very nice so my diplomatic side intevened...hey, wait a minute... Quote
DrJ Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 (edited) I went through the entire list and have noted my observations on whether the title is OOP and what the sound quality on either the OOP or currently available older US version is like. Based on these criteria alone, the selections make a lot of sense. That doesn't even get into musical merit, and I would say each and every one of these is highly worthy of listening, with the possible exception of NIGHT OF THE COOKERS (and I'm curious to see if the sonic upgrade makes that one more listenable - I wouldn't put it out of the question). Really the only one that doesn't make sense on any level is HOME COOKIN' (and I could be wrong about that, the more I think about it, it may very well be OOP - chime in and correct me if it is). February Sweet Honey Bee / Duke Pearson OOP, crappy remastering on old version Ready For Freddie / Freddie Hubbard OOP, crappy remastering on old version At The Half Note Cafe Vol. 1& 2 / Donald Byrd (Double) OOP Rockin' The Boat / Jimmy Smith ? Never on CD in US? Goin' West / Grant Green Never on CD in US, long sought after Right Now / Jackie McLean OOP, crappy remastering on old version March Newk's Time / Sonny Rollins crappy remastering on old version Never Let Me Go / Stanley Turrentine OOP, crappy remastering on old version The Cape Verdean Blues - Horace Silver OOP, truly awful remastering old version Free Form / Donald Byrd crappy remastering old version Conquistador / Cecil Taylor OOP, crappy remastering old version Prayer Meeting / Jimmy Smith * crappy remastering old version * This was originally scheduled to be Breaking Point / Freddie Hubbard The following titles are scheduled to come between May and August of 2004 Breaking Point / Freddie Hubbard crappy remastering old version (crov) Dexter Calling / Dexter Gordon crov Home Cookin' / Jimmy Smith Inner Urge / Joe Henderson crov The Sixth Sense / Lee Morgan OOP Destination Out / Jackie McLean OOP (except in Mosaic box), fair remaster old Buhaina's Delight / Art Blakey crov Free For All / Art Blakey crov Blue Spirits / Freddie Hubbard OOP, crov The Thing To Do / Blue Mitchell OOP (except in Mosaic box), crov The Night Of The Cookers Vol. & 2/ Freddie Hubbard (Double) OOP, crov Serenade To A Soul Sister - Horace Silver OOP, crov Action / Jackie McLean ? Never on CD in US? Andrew Hill / Black Fire OOP, crov Doin' Allright / Dexter Gordon crov One Flight Up / Dexter Gordon crov In 'N Out / Joe Henderson fair remastering old version Tender Moments / McCoy Tyner OOP, crov I was just kidding in my last post about getting a real life and all - I am just as much a collector as anyone and always am impatient about my pet titles getting reissued - but given the success of the series and the list above, I think people can rest assured most of those pet titles will see light of day sometime soon. Edited October 4, 2003 by DrJ Quote
Matthew Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 (edited) I am continually amazed at how people react to reissue news. I mean jeez, there may be a few somewhat questionable titles in there (I also raised both eyebrows at SIXTH SENSE) but there's a lot of really great ones as well, including some that people have been asking for forever, literally since the early days of the old BN board (GOIN' WEST, READDY FOR FREDDIE, etc), and a good chunk of these titles are only available in the U.S. in aged remasterings (the Hendersons, Byrds, etc). Not to mention that many have been OOP here for some time...and in case you haven't noticed, SIXTH SENSE is one of those OOP titles - so for people who missed out on it, this will be the way they can hear it. It's like people actually expect Cuscuna/BN to consult with each of us personally before they dare make a move in deciding what to reissue. Is it that hard to conceive that maybe some other people out there were actually waiting for some of the titles that are being singled out as "questionable" here to be RVG'd? The unseemly side of my personality wanted to post "get over yourself, get a real life, quit griping, and just deal with it, the world will continue to rotate even though THE GIGOLO will apparently not be in the next batch of RVGs," but that wouldn't have been very nice so my diplomatic side intevened...hey, wait a minute... ************************************** Sorry DrJ. I decided to deleate my smartass response since it doesn't add anything good to the topic. Wasn't in a good mood, just spent $31.00 ordering a JRVG of "Midnight Special" because it's not on the list. Edited October 4, 2003 by Matthew Quote
Brad Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 This is truly a very nice list. There's at least half of them I don't probably have and a few like Sweet Honey Bee that could use a sonic upgrade (although that's less of a few priority). There's also a few like Prayer Meeting, the Half Notes and Going West that I expect to receive next week from Hiroshi. I guess the joke's on me in that regard. Looks like it could be the beginning of an expensive year. Quote
Morganized Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 February Sweet Honey Bee / Duke Pearson OOP, crappy remastering on old version Ready For Freddie / Freddie Hubbard OOP, crappy remastering on old version At The Half Note Cafe Vol. 1& 2 / Donald Byrd (Double) OOP Rockin' The Boat / Jimmy Smith ? Never on CD in US? Goin' West / Grant Green Never on CD in US, long sought after Right Now / Jackie McLean OOP, crappy remastering on old version March Newk's Time / Sonny Rollins crappy remastering on old version Never Let Me Go / Stanley Turrentine OOP, crappy remastering on old version The Cape Verdean Blues - Horace Silver OOP, truly awful remastering old version Free Form / Donald Byrd crappy remastering old version Conquistador / Cecil Taylor OOP, crappy remastering old version Prayer Meeting / Jimmy Smith * crappy remastering old version etc. etc. etc. Gee Dr J, With such a lofty opinion of all the previous versions it is amazing that any of us bought them in the first place! On balance I think this is a pretty good list. I am really looking forward to Ready for Freddie and Sweet Honey Bee. Quote
Brad Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 One more point. Do we really Night of the Cookers. This wasn't worth being issued, let alone reissued, in the first place. How about some of the older BN stuff. I recently picked up as a lucky find Sal Salvador Quintet/Quartet on JRVG. That's a great cd. Or even Wynton Kelly's Piano Interpretations. That hasn't seen the light of day in a loooooong time. Quote
BruceH Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 Have Silver's Soul Sister only on LP, this may come on my list too. I don't have Soul Sister in any form, so it makes my short list of titles that should be RVGed ASAP. (Along with Davis Cup and Here To Stay.) Quote
BruceH Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 (edited) BTW: Big thumbs up for At the Half Note Cafe, v. 1 & 2 by Donald Byrd!! Edited October 4, 2003 by BruceH Quote
CJ Shearn Posted October 4, 2003 Report Posted October 4, 2003 (edited) I will upgrade my copy of "Prayer Meetin", I've had that on the crappy U.S. remastering for 10 years or so, way too muddy, and lack of definition. I'm not too happy with the choice of "Home Cookin" because is that record really that bad in it's current '96 incarnation? and would the RVG contain the 5 bonus tracks? especially that killer blues "Groanin'?" I got that for Christmas the year it came out and it really doesn't sound that bad, a tad trebly, yes, but still much better than any '87 or '89 reissues. I think they should work on getting out "Midnight Special" and "Back at the Chicken Shack"? the former hasd been one of my fav albums since I was a little kid, I grew up with that Liberty era reissue pressing, and the current CD sounds well, horrible. I wish I wasn't such an audiophile, but truly horrible sound keeps me from fully enjoying the music. I would love to see reissues of "At the Organ vols 1&2" even though I have the Mosaic at home, I would like to hear those albums in an upgraded format and in their LP sequence all on one disc. What about reissuing those Japan only sessions like "Cherokee", "Lonesome Road" and "Jimmy Smith Trio+LD"? all sessions I never heard, and being that I have most of what Jimmy recorded for BN, I want to be able to hear more of that obscure stuff. I really really think that "At the Club Baby Grand" should make an appearance as a domestic RVG sometime in the future. Very happy about "Free For All" and the Byrd Half Note RVG's tho. Edited October 5, 2003 by CJ Shearn Quote
Jazzmoose Posted October 5, 2003 Report Posted October 5, 2003 One more point. Do we really Night of the Cookers. This wasn't worth being issued, let alone reissued, in the first place. I must admit to being a bit curious about this one. However, when I'm holding it in my hand at the store, I'm sure the thought that everyone who has heard it seems to despise it will plop it back down in the bins. Who am I to think I'd be the first to like it? Quote
davef Posted October 5, 2003 Report Posted October 5, 2003 Nice list overall... BTW, I got the JRVG of Goin' West and it's a real nice album, I think the sound quality is good as well. That will be a treat for y'all who don't want to spend over $20 for the session. Picked up Prayer Meeting in the same purchase from dustygroove, but have not listened to it yet. Quote
DrJ Posted October 5, 2003 Report Posted October 5, 2003 (edited) To address a concern raised above: I am pretty certain the RVGs of these titles will have the extra tracks on earlier versions. To my knowledge, in the U.S. RVG series so far they only left off extra tracks that had been on earlier U.S. CDs in reissuing THE SERMON and HOUSEPARTY by Jimmy Smith (to preserve original LP sequence...not sure exactly why). Also, some of the extras that had appeared on NO ROOM FOR SQUARES and THE TURNAROUND by Mobley were left off those RVGs, but then those tracks later appeared on the Conn STRAIGHT NO FILTER anyway. Morganized: regarding the crappy remastering, it's not that I haven't bought and enjoyed every one of those titles immensely (I'm mostly interested in the music, sonics are secondary but since they can so compliment music I don't think we can ignore them altogether), but to my ears the BN remastering from about 1994 and earlier generally were not well done, so it's always a real pleasure to hear an improvement! Edited October 5, 2003 by DrJ Quote
jazzbo Posted October 5, 2003 Report Posted October 5, 2003 Mark, you won't be the first to like Night of the Cookers. I'm there before you. It's not a total stinker, and has grown on me over the years. I"m interested to hear the RVGs. Quote
DrJ Posted October 5, 2003 Report Posted October 5, 2003 So far it hasn't grabbed me, but I wouldn't be surprised if COOKERS does make more of an impact in an RVG remastering. I never could really warm much to Rollins' live Vanguard dates for BN until the RVG came along. Again, I don't want to make it sound like I'm overly fussy about sonics, 'cause I'm not, but for some music a certain minimal level of clarity and presence is really needed. Rollins' tone, the nuances in his playing, they just came out of nowhere on the newer version, at least on my mid-level stereo system. Much the same could be said for the wonderful upgrades Rudy achieved for the Blakey Cafe Bohemia and Birdland recordings - you can now hear all kinds of subtleties that were buried before. So I look eagerly forward to revisiting COOKERS. Quote
Ed S Posted October 5, 2003 Report Posted October 5, 2003 You're right on about the Blakey Cafe Bohemia and Birdland material. Those are fabulous. Who knows, maybe there's some magic to be performed on the Cookers material. I've got the older reissue and don't listen to it very often so I'm not sure I'd want to buy it again. I guess that's another factor in deciding whether to re-buy. I've got so much stuff sitting on the shelves now that I'm reluctant to fork out more bread for stuff I don't have time to listen to now. Too much music, too little time I guess. Quote
bebopbob Posted October 5, 2003 Report Posted October 5, 2003 Still waiting for the following to be released on CD for the first time in their original form as opposed to being issued as part of a Mosaic set) Blue Mitchell - Bring It On Home Blue Mitchell - Heads Up Larry Young - Contrasts Andrew Hill Andrew!!! - The Music of Andrew Hill Andrew Hill - Compulsion Jack Wilson - Easterly Winds Kenny Clarke - The Golden Eight Jutta Hipp - At the Hickory House Frank Foster - Manhattan Fever And how about reissuing some of these which haven't been available for years Stanley Turrentine - Thats's Where It's At Pete La Roca - Basra Leo Parker - Let Me Tell You 'Bout It Leo Parker - Rollin' With Leo Tina Brooks - True Blue Quote
Brad Posted October 5, 2003 Report Posted October 5, 2003 (edited) Whereas some remastering might help some live music that is good in essence but just need some sprucing up to bring out, as Tony say, its nuances, the problem with the Cookers is that the music is not very good to begin with. That's why it's a stinker. In my view, no amount of remastering could help these records. I'm selling the copies I have now and have no interest in making the same mistake twice. For somewhat of an extended discussion, see this Forum. Edited October 5, 2003 by Brad Quote
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