Cables

[jazz1]

Hi Jim,

Been reading an article where British sound engineer Tony Faulkner demonstated the new Quad ESL using

Black&Decker extension lead as the speaker cables

Any opinion on this?

If they are difference where would it be the most noticable?

Interconnects

Speaker cables

Power leads

[sidewinder]

using Black&Decker extension lead as the speaker cables

WTF? Is this for real?

Based on my experience, the quality of the lead from source to pre-amp is very critical, prior to any signal conditioning. Quality of loudspeaker cables can also have a big effect in terms of matching, signal dispersion, linearity etc.

I've also found the quality of connection to the mains and the spec of the mains cable to have a significant effect. Really, you could write a pHD thesis on the whole thing and as ever it's a case of try things out and see what works for your system.

[jazz1]

using Black&Decker extension lead as the speaker cables

WTF? Is this for real?

Based on my experience, the quality of the lead from source to pre-amp is very critical, prior to any signal conditioning. Quality of loudspeaker cables can also have a big effect in terms of matching, signal dispersion, linearity etc.

I've also found the quality of connection to the mains and the spec of the mains cable to have a significant effect. Really, you could write a pHD thesis on the whole thing and as ever it's a case of try things out and see what works for your system.

The problem that it cost money.

One of the point mentioned was that the new Quads where one of the few loudspeakers where difference could be heard.

There is so much nonsense around this subject, I've tried a few +_ 500$ interconnects

and I am not yet convinced that I am not a victim of the placebo effect.

I also know that if I went in and out of the room I could not identify which was which consistantly

[Jim Alfredson]

Here's a blog where somebody did a blind listening test with some audio lovers where he used hi-end speaker cables and then coat hangers and nobody could tell the difference.

High quality cable usually only makes a difference if you're dealing with long lengths. I went through the whole expensive cable phase and I even still have some RCA interconnects that cost $150 for a 3m pair. They honestly don't sound any "better" than your standard Radio Shack cable.

[Spontooneous]

Yeah, but everybody already knows there's no difference between Monster Cable and coat hangers.

[captainwrong]

Yeah, but everybody already knows there's no difference between Monster Cable and coat hangers.

Not true!

My coat keeps falling off the Monster Cable.

[RDK]

The only Cables that matters is George.

[AllenLowe]

I used to master music for a living and Jim is right - it's mostly BS unless the cable is really crap - and I like the idea of coat hangers-

[porcy62]

Here's a blog where somebody did a blind listening test with some audio lovers where he used hi-end speaker cables and then coat hangers and nobody could tell the difference.

High quality cable usually only makes a difference if you're dealing with long lengths. I went through the whole expensive cable phase and I even still have some RCA interconnects that cost $150 for a 3m pair. They honestly don't sound any "better" than your standard Radio Shack cable.

I don't fully agree. When I replaced interconnects or speaker cables, the sound of my system changed. Any cable has its own "sound" to my ears. The problems begin when one starts talking about "better" and "truthful" and all the audiophile related BS. So you can ask yourself if a 1K $ interconnect sounds a 1k $ better. I have no answer, but I hear the difference. Now if you ask me what I like better between two cables, I can answer, though I couldn't swear on "better", my judgment is based on my personal tastes.

[sidewinder]

I agree porcy - it's whatever your ears tell you is better on your particular system and whether or not that improvement is worth the $ required. No hard and fast rules - it's trial and error.

[Son-of-a-Weizen]

Yeah, but everybody already knows there's no difference between Monster Cable and coat hangers.

Well Rolf hasn't posted the results of his experiment yet, so that remains to be seen.

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=143927

[robviti]

the relationship between anticipation and perception has been the subject of a good deal of psychological research. anticipation is a process based on the perception that something is going to happen in the future. all living organisms, including humans, use anticipation to guide them in goal-oriented decision-making. It's what makes it possible for us to perform different physical and mental tasks without measuring everything along the way.

this doesn't mean that one cannot hear a difference between cables and interconnects, only that what one hears (or thinks he hears) is partly the result of anticipation. when we add to the mix the high cost of some of this equipment, we can expect the role of anticipation to be even greater.

if you want to be more convincing to others about the improved quality of a cable, you must due to blind study in which someone else switches the cable, leaving you with the job of simply perceiving what you hear. of course even then, the anticipation of the experiment could influence the outcome. better to have someone sneak into your home and replace your cables without your knowledge. in the name of science, i'd be willing to conduct this experiment for you. just send your keys to me, along with an idea of when you'll be away, and i'll do the rest...for science.

Edited March 25, 2008 by jazzshrink

[AllenLowe]

"everybody already knows there's no difference between Monster Cable and coat hangers"

hey; abortion arguments belong in the political forum -

[six string]

Several years ago I bought a pair of Kimber Cable interconnects called Heroes for my cd player. When I plugged them in and began listening to them the sound was quite harsh with a lot of emphasis on the high frequencies. I had read a lot about burn in time for cables, electronics etc. but this was the first time it really stood out. I had thoughts of returning them, but I played a burn in track from a Stereophile disc overnight and the sound improved the next day and after maybe two or three days my system was back to normal and sounding great again. It was the most dramatic change I've ever experienced changing pieces in my system. I'm one to be skeptical about these kinds of things but I know what I heard. On the other hand, I would never spend rediculous amounts of money on such things. The Heroes cost me about $125.00 at the time and that's about as high as I'm willing to go.

[clarke68]

Really, you could write a pHD thesis on the whole thing and as ever it's a case of try things out and see what works for your system.

If said PhD thesis was about the impact of suggestion, pricing, and perceived value on psychoacoustics then yeah, that could be interesting. The engineering aspects of the whole matter, on the other hand, barely warrant a pamphlet, let alone a thesis.

Electrically, a cable has three properties: resistance, capacitance, and inductance. These are the same three properties influenced by a speaker crossover, so yes, cables certainly can change the sound of your system. If you don't want them to, you want cables that have the lowest RCL values you can find.

What the boutique cable "manufacturers" seldom tell you is that cables with vanishingly low RCL (particularly at the insignificant lengths used in most home audio systems) are very common and very inexpensive. The real cable manufacturers, like Belden or Canare, have been working on this for decades, and their cable can be found almost anywhere (e.g., the cable in the Black & Decker product mentioned by the OP was probably made by Belden).

There are cases where the most expensive cables in a boutique company's line introduce more distortion into a system than their entry-level options. Presumably, this is to sell to audiophiles who feel they should "hear a difference" if they spend more.