Don Ellis Band playing "New Horizons"

[Larry Kart]

No wonder Ellis died young; several numbers like this per night would take a year or two off right there. I love Ellis' conducting toward the end; looks like he might turn himself into a pretzel. Anyone know the provenance of the performance? A shame if there's only this.

[Guest Bill Barton]

Thanks, Larry!

I have no idea the source of this video but the sound quality seemed pretty darned good compared to the visuals.

This clip reminds me of a personal paradox: why do I like Don Ellis when I can't stand Stan Kenton? There certainly is a similarly bombastic vibe and lack of swing. But for some reason Ellis always reaches me on a very visceral level.

[Big Wheel]

To me Ellis sounds like someone who could have (and did) cut it as a bebopper, but eventually chose not to. Even if the grooves are more rock than anything else, there's still something down deep that implies the ability to swing. The album or two I've heard of Kenton sounded to me more like someone who is on the outside looking in - a guy who couldn't have pulled swinging off even if he tried. (Not to say it's necessarily bad, just to be evaluated on different terms.)

[Sundog]

San Francisco Museum Of Art? Link to Don Ellis' UCLA ethnomusic videotape collection.

Don Ellis Video Collection

[MoGrubb]

How th' hell do ya count that stuff(?).

[JSngry]

It's often hard for me to like Ellis, but never to love him.

http://www.donellisfilm.com/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bd0fgpN_Rcg&NR=1

[AndrewHill]

Thanks for the clips everyone. I've been really getting into Ellis' music over the last couple of years and was blown away by Essence. Did Electric Heart ever get released? Was that meant for the theaters or DVD release?

[AllenLowe]

I love Ellis - and will add -

1) one can't just say "I don't like kenton" - because Kenton is about 18 different things - Holman, Russo, Graettinger (a genius IMHO), Gene Roland, Johnny Richards, June Christie, Ruoglo. and more more more - there is some amazing stuff there, I think -

2) I've repeated this a million times, but it's worth noting here, again; I was talking to Jaki Byard about Don Ellis, whom Jaki thought was a major figure - I said, "than why don't you think he gets more recognition?" Jaki looked at me and said "Because he was white."

very honest guy, Jaki was -

[Guest Bill Barton]

I love Ellis - and will add -

1) one can't just say "I don't like kenton" - because Kenton is about 18 different things - Holman, Russo, Graettinger (a genius IMHO), Gene Roland, Johnny Richards, June Christie, Ruoglo. and more more more - there is some amazing stuff there, I think - ...

Good point. But on a personal level, simply a matter of taste, I've never heard anything from Kenton that reaches me like Ellis does.

One of the first jazz albums I ever bought was Shock Treatment.

[mikeweil]

How th' hell do ya count that stuff(?).

1-2-1-2-3-1-2-1-2-3-1-2-1-2-1-2-3 or the Indian way: da-ge-da-ge-na-da-ge-da-ge-na-da-ge-da-ge-da-ge-na

17, subdivided 5-5-7 or 2-3-2-3-2-2-3

p.s.

That's the refrain - in the first melody it's 3-2-3-2-2-2-3 ....

Edited February 12, 2008 by mikeweil

[MoGrubb]

How th' hell do ya count that stuff(?).

1-2-1-2-3-1-2-1-2-3-1-2-1-2-1-2-3 or the Indian way: da-ge-da-ge-na-da-ge-da-ge-na-da-ge-da-ge-da-ge-na

17, subdivided 5-5-7 or 2-3-2-3-2-2-3

Thanks, ug.

MoGrubb is my Indian name, btw.

[AllenLowe]

are you sure it's not: one three two two seven or one one one one one five two one

or eight eight half eighth eighth eighth eighth

[AllenLowe]

or

one one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one one one one one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one one one one one one oneoneone one one one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one oneone one one one one one one one one oneoneone one one

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[AllenLowe]

two

[Chuck Nessa]

Jaki looked at me and said "Because he was white."

Don Ellis was white?!!!

[JSngry]

I don't think so...

[mikeweil]

two

... not to mention three ...

[AllenLowe]

well, I'll raise you one - four - (to quote Miles Davis) -

[AllenLowe]

"Don Ellis was white?!!! "

actually, his mother was 1/14 white, 1/16 Jewish, 3/28 Melungeon, 1/100 Turkish (the Taffy side), 1/79 Afghanistanian, 8/1000 Alzheimer, 3/10,000 Bulgarian, and 2/679 Republican -

[MoGrubb]

are you sure it's not: one three two two seven or one one one one one five two one

or eight eight half eighth eighth eighth eighth

More like: 0ne, huh!?

"Don Ellis was white?!!! "

actually, his mother was 1/14 white, 1/16 Jewish, 3/28 Melungeon, 1/100 Turkish (the Taffy side), 1/79 Afghanistanian, 8/1000 Alzheimer, 3/10,000 Bulgarian, and 2/679 Republican -

Gawd! Not Republican! That's almost like cross-species breeding.

[paul secor]

Back in the 60's, I had the opinion that he started out as an interesting trumpeter who became a showman. Seeing this, I see that he became an even better showman than I had thought.

[mikeweil]

Yes he was - I saw him live with his last band and he pulled them through the performance like a wailing dervish!

But he was fiercely dedicated to his music, in the first place.

I learned those time signatures by patiently counting my way through Ellis' pieces - an invaluable learning experience. All the more as I now have to play rhythms of this complexity in that Kurdish band I'm a member of.

Edited February 12, 2008 by mikeweil

[mikeweil]

actually, his mother was 1/14 white, 1/16 Jewish, 3/28 Melungeon, .....

WTF is Melungeon????

[AllenLowe]

Melungeons are descendants of the Turks, dark skinned and apparently non-white -

Ben Harney was Melungeon -

[MoGrubb]

Melungeons are descendants of the Turks, dark skinned and apparently non-white -

Ben Harney was Melungeon -

They any relation to the curmudgeons?