wesbed Posted September 16, 2003 Report Posted September 16, 2003 (edited) I've been noticing Jack McDuff's name on these boards. I've looked past the Jack McDuff entries because I didn't know who Jack McDuff was. I purchased the Grantstand RVG and was more captivated by the organ work than Green's guitar playing (although BOTH are quite good). I picked the CD case up from the passenger seat of my car and flipped it over to discover who the mystery organ master was. Jack McDuff. The name hit me like a slap in the face. Jazz... you never quit learning about it. Edited September 16, 2003 by wesbed Quote
Jim R Posted September 16, 2003 Report Posted September 16, 2003 Jazz... you never quit learning about it. That's for damn sure! And while we're on the subject of organists, I was just thinking this morning how many there are whose styles I have yet to learn to identify (the blindfold test is reminding me)... Quote
sal Posted September 16, 2003 Report Posted September 16, 2003 I'm with you too, Wesbed. Fantastic organ player. "Grantstand" has been getting alot of play time in my CD deck. Does anyone who has the new RVG of "Grantstand" notice some distortion in the organ lines on the first track? I don't know if this is supposed to sound like that, but the organ seems to distort at times. Quote
mr jazz Posted September 16, 2003 Report Posted September 16, 2003 allmusic dot com is always a good starting to at least get a bio of an artist and discography. of course their recs pale in the face of the knowledge pool here Quote
Jim Alfredson Posted September 16, 2003 Report Posted September 16, 2003 Does anyone who has the new RVG of "Grantstand" notice some distortion in the organ lines on the first track? I don't know if this is supposed to sound like that, but the organ seems to distort at times. McDuff always favored a slightly distorted sound on his Hammond. It's become the stuff of legend, actually. Keith Emerson once said that McDuff's distorted sound haunted him and he tried to emulate that with all his organ playing. My mentor, Doug Decker, has been searching for that elusive sound for decades. The only way to get close is to turn everything all the way up. It has to do with the poor crossover of the Leslie 122 and low frequencies leaking into the horn. Thus one of the reasons Emerson could never fullly duplicate the sound: Part of it comes from kickin' bass! If you don't kick bass, the horn doesn't distort in the same way. Anyway, McDuff is one BAD mofo! Any of his Prestige dates are REQUIRED listening. Start with the record "LIVE!" and move on from there. Quote
Soul Stream Posted September 16, 2003 Report Posted September 16, 2003 If your Jack MdDuff collection begins and ends with "Grantstand," you've at least started in the PERFECT place. I could spend a lifetime listening to that one album and still not be able to absorb all of it. Jack McDuff is a name you hear a lot, but it's always underneath names like Jimmy Smith, Larry Young and Don Patterson. It shouldn't be. He embodies the best of what jazz organ was all about in it's heyday. Grantstand wouldn't be as great without McDuff on it. Period. He MAKES that record! (O.k, the rest kill too!) Your next stop on your discovery of Jack McDuff might be the "Live" CD. Quote
sal Posted September 16, 2003 Report Posted September 16, 2003 Thanks alot for your helpful info, B3-er!! Quote
JSngry Posted September 16, 2003 Report Posted September 16, 2003 McDuff consistently led bands of the highest quality. The sidemen were never scrubs or utility players, they were always top-shelf players in their own right. Go to the Fantasy web site www.fantasyjazz.com and check out the McDuff catalog. You'll see names like George Benson, Red Holloway, Harold Vick, Pat Martino and, of course, the man who was arguably the archetypical organ drummer and was definitely ONE of them, Joe Dukes. These guys all had a sophisitcation and versatility that people who tend to turn up their noses at organ groups prefer to ignore. Sure, they could get as down and dirty as anybody, but they could also play some hip bop, some mellow swing, and some tender ballads. These guys were PROS, and McDuff never had a band that was less than excellent, at least not in his "glory days". Jump on in and check it out. Their ain't nothin' on them records except damn fine music. Quote
wesbed Posted September 16, 2003 Author Report Posted September 16, 2003 (edited) Your next stop on your discovery of Jack McDuff might be the "Live" CD. Do you mean this one? Interesting... a 1994 release. Whoops. I just found it. It appears these sessions were recorded in June & October, 1963. Edited September 16, 2003 by wesbed Quote
Soul Stream Posted September 16, 2003 Report Posted September 16, 2003 Your next stop on your discovery of Jack McDuff might be the "Live" CD. Do you mean this one? Interesting... a 1994 release. Whoops. I just found it. It appears these sessions were recorded in June & October, 1963. Yes! That's it....now you're screwed for life. Quote
Jim Alfredson Posted September 16, 2003 Report Posted September 16, 2003 Dig it. It's McDuff's birthday today!!! He would've been 77. Quote
wesbed Posted September 16, 2003 Author Report Posted September 16, 2003 Dig it. It's McDuff's birthday today!!! He would've been 77. Errr... the calendar says it's tomorrow. Quote
Brad Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 Speaking of Jack McDuff, any views/review of Prelude from the Jack McDuff Big Band? This came out on September 9. BTW, if you're looking for a nice recording, organ/sax, check out Groove Holmes and Gene Ammons, Groovin with Jug, from the Pacific Jazz catalogue, reissued a few years ago. Quote
Soul Stream Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 Yes! "Groovin' with Jug" is a must-have. Quote
Free For All Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 Speaking of Jack McDuff, any views/review of Prelude from the Jack McDuff Big Band? This came out on September 9. I too would like to hear what others think about this session. I just received it with an order and haven't yet had an opportunity to listen to it. The reissue apparently contains additional material which brings the playing time to nearly 80 minutes. Quote
Soul Stream Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 Speaking of Jack McDuff, any views/review of Prelude from the Jack McDuff Big Band? This came out on September 9. I too would like to hear what others think about this session. I just received it with an order and haven't yet had an opportunity to listen to it. The reissue apparently contains additional material which brings the playing time to nearly 80 minutes. I've got it on order. That said, I've heard the album at one point at wasn't all that thrilled at the time. I think the organ/big band thing is a very hard thing to make work for my tastes. Jimmy Smith and Wes had some nice turns at it, but...I dunno...(the Groove Holmes/Gerald Wilson stuff is about my personal favorite in this genre)... But I'll post when I get the CD Quote
Free For All Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 (edited) I've been noticing Jack McDuff's name on these boards. I've looked past the Jack McDuff entries because I didn't know who Jack McDuff was. wesbed, I must say I envy you- you're in the process of discovering players and hearing things for the first time (and this board is a great place to further your education). I remember very specifically where I was when I first heard certain recordings, and I remember that big rush that came from realizing that you were hearing some important music or players for the first time. That first-time feeling gets more and more rare as you become familiar w/the music (at least for me it has). I mean, I still get a rush hearing something good for the first time, but after you've studied the music and learned to listen with more of an analytical ear, it gets harder to be objective. You can usually figure out pretty quickly WHY something sounds good, but there's less of that mystical sense of hearing something and liking it w/o knowing why. I miss those days. I miss flipping through the LPs at the record store and coming upon some BN or other session I'd never heard of. I remember the first time I went to Rose Records in Chicago. This was in the 70s and Rose was THE place- it was nirvana (I hadn't yet discovered Jazz Record Mart)! I remember buying a copy of JJ's Proof Positive- that's one of those moments I was talking about. I apologize for the nostalgic tangent . Edited September 17, 2003 by Free For All Quote
Free For All Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 I think the organ/big band thing is a very hard thing to make work for my tastes. Have you heard the Jimmy McGriff w/big band called Tribute to Basie (on the Sonny Lester label)? That one was arranged by Manny Albam. I thought there were some interesting moments on it. I agree, the density of the organ timbre makes for a difficult match w/big band. The orchestration has to be approached w/this in mind. That being said, I think there's a lot yet to be investigated regarding the power of the organ sound facing off w/the power of the big band. It just seems that they shouldn't get in the way of each other. Quote
Soul Stream Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 (edited) I'd love to hear an organ record that cut the difference between a quintet (like Patton's "Oh Baby") and a big-band affair. I think that would be a better blend. Even and organ trio augmented by trombone, trumpet and tenor would be a welcome addition to the usual sounds. Something like beefing up Blakey's quintet with the additon of Curtis Fuller. I've got the Basie/McGriff thing. Been a while...I'll have to dig it out. I do remember liking it very much as far as that sort of thing went. Edited September 17, 2003 by Soul Stream Quote
Free For All Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 (edited) BTW, happy birthday Jack McDuff! Edited September 17, 2003 by Free For All Quote
Jim Alfredson Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 Yeah, that McGriff record is nice. Trombone and organ is a combination that has been way under-utilized, IMO. I'm excited to hear that new Wycliffe Gordon record with Sam Yahel, both great players. Wycliffe teaches at MSU and has sat in with us here and there. We've been toying with the idea of asking him to do a few tunes on our next CD. Organ and vibes is another wonderful combination that should be used more. Quote
mikeweil Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 Organ and vibes is another wonderful combination that should be used more. Jim, howdya like the sessions of Lem Winchester or Johnny Lytle with organ? Quote
JSngry Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 Shirley Scott & Oliver Nelson. Jimmy Smith & Oliver Nelson. Two more excellent organ/big band pairings. Quote
Soul Stream Posted September 17, 2003 Report Posted September 17, 2003 Organ and vibes is another wonderful combination that should be used more. Jim, howdya like the sessions of Lem Winchester or Johnny Lytle with organ? "Tough Duff" with McDuff and Lem Winchester plus sax/drums is one of my favorite records of all time. Organ and Vibes are a match made in heaven. Plus they're two of the heaviest instruments in the world, so the must go together. Quote
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