Unissued Monk at Montery 64 CD

[monkboughtlunch]

Anyone know how this history behind the recording of this show?

http://www.concordmusicgroup.com/albums/MJFR-30312/

Can we expect pro-stereo? Pro-mono? Or amateur soundboard, radio transcription or audience recording etc?

[Dan Gould]

What is an "amateur soundboard"? Audience members lugging a soundboard to the concert to run their microphone through?

I have no doubt that they rolled a tape off the house audio feed and the sound should be more than acceptable. What is more intriguing to me is the Concord page's description of the concert:

This previously unreleased live album features Thelonious Monk on piano, Charlie Rose groovin' the alto sax, Steve Swallow, playin' bass, and Ben Riley on drums. Also features The Monterey Jazz Festival Workshop: Buddy Collette—director, saxophone, flute; Lou Blackburn—trombone; Jack Nimitz—baritone saxophone; Bobby Bryant, Melvin Moore—trumpets. Produced by Jimmy Lyons, this album was recorded live at the Monterey Jazz Festival on September 20, 1964.

There aren't very many recordings of Monk with a larger group, so the West Coast guys could make for an interesting concert. But I have never heard of Rouse on alto with Monk.

[monkboughtlunch]

What is an "amateur soundboard"? Audience members lugging a soundboard to the concert to run their microphone through?

Hi - what I call an amateur soundboard is when a house audio engineer makes a "secret dub" off the PA feed for his personal collection, often on a prosumer reel to reel tape deck and therefore at a tape speed less than the pro resolution standard. The intent not being to create a recording of high quality for commercial issuance, but rather for a personal collection.

Edited July 28, 2007 by monkboughtlunch

[jazzbo]

I bet that's a mistake!

It's going to be a good one. Too bad they delayed this batch of these cds. . . .

Edited July 28, 2007 by jazzbo

[kh1958]

What is an "amateur soundboard"? Audience members lugging a soundboard to the concert to run their microphone through?

I have no doubt that they rolled a tape off the house audio feed and the sound should be more than acceptable. What is more intriguing to me is the Concord page's description of the concert:

This previously unreleased live album features Thelonious Monk on piano, Charlie Rose groovin' the alto sax, Steve Swallow, playin' bass, and Ben Riley on drums. Also features The Monterey Jazz Festival Workshop: Buddy Collette—director, saxophone, flute; Lou Blackburn—trombone; Jack Nimitz—baritone saxophone; Bobby Bryant, Melvin Moore—trumpets. Produced by Jimmy Lyons, this album was recorded live at the Monterey Jazz Festival on September 20, 1964.

There aren't very many recordings of Monk with a larger group, so the West Coast guys could make for an interesting concert. But I have never heard of Rouse on alto with Monk.

The same musicians also augmented the Mingus group on Mingus at Monterey (also from 1964).

[felser]

There's also a Miles '63, a Dizzy '65, and a Sassy '71 set coming (description includes Bob Magnussen "groovin' the bass" - they're repeating bad cliches, although at least they got the instrument right this time, didn't have him on cello like they had Rouse on alto). I'm especially looking forward to the Miles, as I really liked George Coleman's work with Miles/Hancock/Carter/Williams. I assume it's Coleman here - not sure when Strozier, Rivers, and Stitt had their spells in the group. BTW, not a thing ablut any of these on their home page or new releases page, you have to go search by artist or label to see the descriptions. How messed up is that?

Edited July 29, 2007 by felser

[monkboughtlunch]

Also strange is that Monk and Davis were under contract to Columbia at the time. So even if Columbia didn't own these recordings, they may own the mechanical rights. There must have been some legal ballet to allow these come out with Concord involvement. The record label for these recordings is listed "Montery Jazz Records," so maybe Concord is just distributing. Maybe Columbia gave MJR permission as long as profits go to charity.

So should we expect mono from these tapes?

Edited July 29, 2007 by monkboughtlunch

[Ted O'Reilly]

What is an "amateur soundboard"? Audience members lugging a soundboard to the concert to run their microphone through?

I have no doubt that they rolled a tape off the house audio feed and the sound should be more than acceptable.

I remember my first exposure to the European scene at the Nice JF in 1979 -- I was amazed at the number of people with very sophisticated mic. setups and little mixing boards with headsets, all recording the various stages at the Cimiez Gardens. No one stopped them, not even the artists. The attitude seemed to be "oh, well -- that's what they do here". The official sound men were also recording everything from the on-stage setup. On a Nagra IVS at 3.75 ips....

As to Monterey, they must have been doing the same over the years, as there have been quite a few 'documentary'-type releases over the years, such as "40 Legendary Years", a 1997 3-CD release attached somehow to that local jazz fan Clint Eastwood. (Malpaiso/Warner Bros. 9 46703-2). It all starts with a true collector's item: from 1958, Dizzy does a solo trumpet reading of the Star-Spangled Banner!

[brownie]

Looking forward to listen to that Monterey concert release.

Curious to find out how Steve Swallow fit in with the Monk unit!

[jazzbo]

Also strange is that Monk and Davis were under contract to Columbia at the time. So even if Columbia didn't own these recordings, they may own the mechanical rights. There must have been some legal ballet to allow these come out with Concord involvement. The record label for these recordings is listed "Montery Jazz Records," so maybe Concord is just distributing. Maybe Columbia gave MJR permission as long as profits go to charity.

So should we expect mono from these tapes?

John, MBL: we've discussed this before:

http://www.organissimo.org/forum/index.php...terey+Armstrong

Probably the promotors, not the artists' record labels, own the rights to these, hence the appearance on this new label.

[Chuck Nessa]

Probably the promotors, not the artists' record labels, own the rights to these, hence the appearance on this new label.

Sony/Columbia could have stopped this release if they noticed/cared.

[Kalo]

Look again: it's listed as "Charlie Rose groovin' the alto sax." Perhaps an early gig by the PBS talk maven?

Groovin' and playin'? Who the hell is writin' these Concord blurbs?

[jazzbo]

Probably the promotors, not the artists' record labels, own the rights to these, hence the appearance on this new label.

Sony/Columbia could have stopped this release if they noticed/cared.

Cool. I was thinking along the line of Granz. . . .I shouldn't have said probably, I was actually thinking "possibly" but wrote probably.

You'd think they WOULD HAVE stopped these, or gotten their cut. . . are they just so not paying attention?

[Chuck Nessa]

Probably the promotors, not the artists' record labels, own the rights to these, hence the appearance on this new label.

Sony/Columbia could have stopped this release if they noticed/cared.

Cool. I was thinking along the line of Granz. . . .I shouldn't have said probably, I was actually thinking "possibly" but wrote probably.

You'd think they WOULD HAVE stopped these, or gotten their cut. . . are they just so not paying attention?

If anyone noticed (most folks with that info have been fired by the majors) they would have demanded rights, paid "venue rights" and issued it with some payment to the owner of the tapes.

[jazzbo]

Probably the promotors, not the artists' record labels, own the rights to these, hence the appearance on this new label.

Sony/Columbia could have stopped this release if they noticed/cared.

Cool. I was thinking along the line of Granz. . . .I shouldn't have said probably, I was actually thinking "possibly" but wrote probably.

You'd think they WOULD HAVE stopped these, or gotten their cut. . . are they just so not paying attention?

If anyone noticed (most folks with that info have been fired by the majors) they would have demanded rights, paid "venue rights" and issued it with some payment to the owner of the tapes.

It's so hard to believe there's no one around who would know!

WIERD. Sad.

[felser]

Probably the promotors, not the artists' record labels, own the rights to these, hence the appearance on this new label.

Sony/Columbia could have stopped this release if they noticed/cared.

Cool. I was thinking along the line of Granz. . . .I shouldn't have said probably, I was actually thinking "possibly" but wrote probably.

You'd think they WOULD HAVE stopped these, or gotten their cut. . . are they just so not paying attention?

If anyone noticed (most folks with that info have been fired by the majors) they would have demanded rights, paid "venue rights" and issued it with some payment to the owner of the tapes.

It's so hard to believe there's no one around who would know!

WIERD. Sad.

Shows how little interest, numbers wise, there is in this great music. I always think of those amazing OJC Limited Editions, like the Wlt Dickersons, which apparently never sold their allotted 3000 CD's.

[Aggie87]

Looking forward to listen to that Monterey concert release.

Curious to find out how Steve Swallow fit in with the Monk unit!

Just picked this up in the recent Concord sale, and am enjoying the recording. I didn't realize Swallow had even played with Monk until reading the liner notes today. I think he does a pretty good job for never having rehearsed with Monk prior to this show - or even having met him.

Swallow also mentions that he was later invited to join Monk's group in 1970, but it "didn't work out" because he'd already switched to electric bass and sold his acoustic.