The John Coltrane Reference

[EKE BBB]

Just received this email:

The John Coltrane Reference

Author(s) - Lewis Porter, Chris DeVito, David Wild, Yasuhiro Fuji Fujioka,

Wolf Schmaler

List Price: $150.00

ISBN: 9780415977555

ISBN-10: 041597755X

Publisher: Routledge

Publication Date: 12/10/2007

Pages: 608

from the Routledge website:

"Few jazz musicians have had the lasting influence - or attracted as much

scholarly study - as John Coltrane. Yet, despite dozens of books, hundreds

of articles, and his own recorded legacy, the 'facts' about Coltrane's life

and work have never been definitely established. In The John Coltrane

Reference, well-known Coltrane biographer and jazz educator Lewis Porter has

assembled an international team of scholars to remedy this situation."

At last there's a publication date for what will be THE Trane book.

[paul secor]

$150? Unless it's fantastic, I'll just continue to listen to the recordings.

[mikeweil]

With these people contributing, it should be the definitive work!

[paul secor]

[Matthew]

Despite clem's poo-pooing , I'm seriously thinking of buying this. I just like sitting in my chair and browsing through a book at random. Plus, I really need a good Coltrane discography and this looks like the one to get.

[Matthew]

Besides, I'm totally sure the Chuck Nessa would endorse buying a discography -- but then again, I'm sure he would be happy to look up any questions we have.

Edited May 11, 2007 by Matthew

[Matthew]

.......

otherwise, 150 clams for a 600 page Routledge book-- any non-art, non-fine press book-- is pretty goddamn ridiculous. i'd take a GOOD look at anything Routledge published before parting w/anyone's wampum. no publisher (or record co. for that matter) for vomiting out yet more sub-standard product into an already crowded world.

edc

department of weights & measures

ozona, fla

I'd definitely would wait for feedback until I'd part with any money....

[JSngry]

"Few jazz musicians have had the lasting influence - or attracted as much

scholarly study - as John Coltrane. Yet, despite dozens of books, hundreds

of articles, and his own recorded legacy, the 'facts' about Coltrane's life

and work have never been definitely established. In The John Coltrane

Reference, well-known Coltrane biographer and jazz educator Lewis Porter has

assembled an international team of scholars to remedy this situation."

WTF was Porter's own book?

[mikeweil]

WTF was Porter's own book?

amazon.com

[mikeweil]

The one I linked you can get used from $ 8.91 ...

[relyles]

Despite clem's poo-pooing , I'm seriously thinking of buying this. I just like sitting in my chair and browsing through a book at random. Plus, I really need a good Coltrane discography and this looks like the one to get.

IIRC Porter's book has a good discography. Doesn't it?

[Matthew]

Despite clem's poo-pooing , I'm seriously thinking of buying this. I just like sitting in my chair and browsing through a book at random. Plus, I really need a good Coltrane discography and this looks like the one to get.

IIRC Porter's book has a good discography. Doesn't it?

It does, but, as even Porter admits, it needs to be updated and with some corrections.

[Simon Weil]

Just received this email:

The John Coltrane Reference

Author(s) - Lewis Porter, Chris DeVito, David Wild, Yasuhiro Fuji Fujioka,

Wolf Schmaler

List Price: $150.00

ISBN: 9780415977555

ISBN-10: 041597755X

Publisher: Routledge

Publication Date: 12/10/2007

Pages: 608

from the Routledge website:

"Few jazz musicians have had the lasting influence - or attracted as much

scholarly study - as John Coltrane. Yet, despite dozens of books, hundreds

of articles, and his own recorded legacy, the 'facts' about Coltrane's life

and work have never been definitely established. In The John Coltrane

Reference, well-known Coltrane biographer and jazz educator Lewis Porter has

assembled an international team of scholars to remedy this situation."

At last there's a publication date for what will be THE Trane book.

There's an exchange in Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy that goes something like:

Smiley: "Ever bought a fake painting, Toby?"

Toby Esterhaze: "Sold a couple once."

Smiley: "The more you pay, the less likely you are to doubt its authenticity."

I.E. Whatever else it is, the price is probably a way of saying this is "THE trane book" with 'the facts' about Coltrane's life...definitely established." And once you've bought it, you're certainly going to see it this way.

Kind of related are the massive great tomes that accompanied "major" art exhibitions. Weighty tome = weighty exhibition.

Ahh, the facts. What about The Truth?

Simon Weil

Edited May 12, 2007 by Simon Weil

[JSngry]

I'd be a lot more happy with a simple updated/revised edition of the Porter book.

Besides, I doubt that any revisions therein would be be anything of fundamental importance.

[Larry Kart]

Glancing at Routledge's webpage and going to books on music, I see that this is at the upper end of their normal price range:

http://www.routledge.com/shopping_cart/cat...?parent_id=2409

at the upper end, probably because it's more than 600 pages and may include musical examples. How many signatures there are in a book is a major factor in cost/pricing, as I know because I was told that I had to cut 30-40,000 words from my book or it wouldn't be published, beucause at its original length it would have to be priced higher than they thought a book of its type should sell for, and thus it would not be a good proposition for them. Also, Routledge probably and rightly thinks of its market as being made up mostly of people at academic institutions, which means (so the publisher thinks) that the price can be jacked up further because it's the institution that pays. Take a look at some of the prices on scholarly English Lit. texts from Oxford University Press. They're edging up toward $250 a volume, may even be higher now.

Edited May 12, 2007 by Larry Kart

[MartyJazz]

I'll wager $150 that Ed Rhodes will cop this book. And when he does, I hope he writes a review, considering how erudite and knowledgable he is concerning all things Trane.

[Matthew]

I'll wager $150 that Ed Rhodes will cop this book. And when he does, I hope he writes a review, considering how erudite and knowledgable he is concerning all things Trane.

Heck, yeah! Ed is our Trane conductor.

[mikeweil]

Slightly off topic: A new article on "world jazz" mentions Coltrane "took lessons" with Ravi Shankar in 1961 - is this true?

[Larry Kart]

hate to say this LK bc I think you should be more widely read but there you go-- shows you what the hell Yale knows. they didn't know shit about the "market" & as a U. Press don't play by market rules, really... of course, the other part of the equation is you couldn't have been published... well, maybe. I'd MUCH rather have seen you on, say, Da Capo, who can get books out there, or even Oxford (tho' theit standards have declined). FACT is, the sadly few who DID buy you woulda payed marginally more for more & the final equation would've been the same. (i ain't dissin' on Dan Morgenstern en toto here but c'mon, you had A LOT more to offer that was ** new ** & actually trenchant; meanwhwile... well, that was no best-seller either & perhaps both of ya'll should have gone straight to a nice trade paperback... bc if yr not gonne see any more money off it, might as well get it into the hands of the people... but still, i've seen Dan eight times if I've seen you once & I see those more-than-half crap Giddins anthos twice as often.)

i wanna re-re-re-emphasize if any of ya'll go to bookstores today: L@@K at what pieces of crap Routledge are. also, LK, re: $$$ I dunno, depends who got the deal. i'd assume none of 'em have agents... i love books but i have to say the day for these outrageously priced ackee texts of highly dubious necessity (published just to be published to keep the circle jerk/conveyer belt going) is DONE. put it up as a .pdf somewhere & be done w/it.

save a tree, praise

edc

ozona, fla

But "the sadly few" is my audience, perfectly described.

Edited May 12, 2007 by Larry Kart

[paul secor]

Larry - I ordered my copy from a local independent bookstore owned by a friend. He's carried your book since then - hope that he's sold a few copies. I'll have to ask him and see.

[Larry Kart]

Actually, the response I've gotten to the book from people here has been great, makes me feel like I've done what I usually tried to do -- start one side of a real conversation, which the other party can carry on with me, with others, or with himself, as situation or inclination suggests.

[Larry Kart]

no, i'm sure ANYONE w/an interest who found out about the book would dig it but it just went into the VOID. to cut the publisher a tiny bit of slack, you'd have to pretty much go door-to-door to get ANY attention in today's market but still...

edc

ozona, fla

Clem -- Actually I wondered about that a lot, but I was handicapped because the terrific veteran acquisitions editor at Yale who asked me to do the book left the press in middle of the process, in part because he was unhappy with recent management trends at Yale, and I was left in the hands of a young editor (this was her first book) who couldn't have cared less about the book or me, who knew nothing about jazz, and seemed eager to act like a professional hardass as a kind of management exercise and/or just to prove to herself that she could throw her weight around. On the other hand, the production people at Yale -- cover and type design, etc. -- were very good and couldn't have been more cooperative.

[bakeostrin]

Apart from the discography in Porter's Coltrane book, consider the nearly 400 page discography and "musical biography" published by Scarecrow Press written by Fujioka, Porter (and a third author). Now, how out of date can that be?

I am as hard-core obsessive a book collector as there is and dig limited edition books.

However, I agree that at $150, there would have to be significant photo-illustrations to interest me. For example, previously unavailable or unpublished Claxton, Stewart, Friedlander or Goldblatt photographs, attractively presented would attract me. Also, album covers presented in color, perhaps with alternate shots by the photographers.

The publishers could have had the photographers sign also (with the exception of the late Mr. Goldblatt, of course). Very few books are worth that high price tag; only the most collectible. I would expect top notch quality. Compare, for example, "Omniverse Sun Ra," even though it is softcover; many color plates, attractively presented make for a book worth twice the asking price of this Coltrane book.

I would be very interested to hear anyone's impression of the book's quality of content and format.

Thanks for the update on it.

[ghost of miles]

Larry, any chance Da Capo would pick up your book as a paperback reprint?

I concur with Mr. Sangrey re: this Coltrane "tome," as our friend Hardbop used to say; would rather wait for a Porter revision, but even that doesn't seem particularly imperative to me at this point.

[garthsj]

Apart from the discography in Porter's Coltrane book, consider the nearly 400 page discography and "musical biography" published by Scarecrow Press written by Fujioka, Porter (and a third author). Now, how out of date can that be?

I am as hard-core obsessive a book collector as there is and dig limited edition books.

However, I agree that at $150, there would have to be significant photo-illustrations to interest me. For example, previously unavailable or unpublished Claxton, Stewart, Friedlander or Goldblatt photographs, attractively presented would attract me. Also, album covers presented in color, perhaps with alternate shots by the photographers.

The publishers could have had the photographers sign also (with the exception of the late Mr. Goldblatt, of course). Very few books are worth that high price tag; only the most collectible. I would expect top notch quality. Compare, for example, "Omniverse Sun Ra," even though it is softcover; many color plates, attractively presented make for a book worth twice the asking price of this Coltrane book.

I would be very interested to hear anyone's impression of the book's quality of content and format.

Thanks for the update on it.

A good example of such quality publication would be the two books put out by Parkside Press in Seattle, TAKE FIVE: THE PUBLIC AND PRIVATE LIVES OF PAUL DESMOND, by Doug Ramsey; and A LIFE IN THE GOLDEN AGE OF JAZZ; A BIOGRAPHY OF BUDDY DEFRANCO, by Fabrice Zammarchi and Sylvie Mas .... both of these wonderful tomes are full of great photographs, as well as being quite authoratative texts. They were priced in the $65 range in an approximately 400 page hardback.

Edited May 13, 2007 by garthsj