Who here saw Coltrane perfom live?

[Soul Stream]

For those of us who never had the chance to see John Coltrane perfom. I wondered if those who did could share their story(ies).....

[Stereojack]

In the fall of 1965, Coltrane was booked into the Jazz Workshop in Boston. I and three of my college friends (two jazz fan buddies and a girl I was dating who was primarily into classical music) decided to go on Saturday night. Normally we would go hear live jazz on the Sunday matinee, which was a good deal for poor college students like us, and the crowds were usually pretty hip. For some reason, we decided to make it a bigger deal by going on Saturday night, although I can't remember why. We were young (underage) jazz enthusiasts, but none of us had ever seen Trane in person, although we had heard some of his recordings with Miles and several of the Atlantic and Impulse albums. The most recent recording we had heard was "A Love Supreme", which had been out for about a year, and we expected to see the quartet with which Trane had been working for about four years. I don't believe that "Ascension" had been released yet.

When we got to the entrance, the band was billed as the John Coltrane Sextet. When we entered the club, we saw that there were two sets of drums on the bandstand. We were seated, eagerly anticipating the evening. Eventually the musicians arrived, and a drummer who we did not recognize sat down at one of the drum sets. A second saxophonist was also present, as well as McCoy Tyner and Jimmy Garrison. I don't know if we knew the identities of the two new musicians that night (Pharoah Sanders & Rashied Ali). There were no announcements, although it's possible that their names were posted at the entrance. Our eyes followed Trane as he went to the bar and got a drink, and then proceeded to the stand, walking right past our aisle table.

The music became intense very quickly, and we were all puzzled, completely unprepared for the full blown sonic assault that was taking place on the bandstand. Our first reaction was negative, and my date looked at me as if to say "get me out of here". We persevered, however, and eventually, near the end of the first set, Elvin Jones did arrive and joined the proceedings on stage. I recall that at one point Jimmy Garrison remained on stage alone, and his bass solo was almost completely drowned out by the chatter of people talking.

The following spring, the album "Meditations" was released. I bought it, and realized that it had been recorded one week before we saw the band. I don't believe Trane ever returned to Boston. As much as Coltrane is revered today, the music he offered us in his final days was met with hostility and indifference by many at the time.

[robertoart]

What a sobering and informative reminiscence. There must have been some people who were exhilarated by the performances at that time though.

[ghost of miles]

I heard a very similar story from David Baker. Years ago, when I bought the CD reissue of LIVE IN SEATTLE, I noticed that the liners referred to Coltrane's having stopped over in Indianapolis for a gig in September 1965 on his way out to the West Coast. He played at a club that seems to have been known alternately as "Chateau d'Eve" or "The Pink Poodle," down in the Indiana Avenue neighborhood that for decades had been home to much of the black music scene in Indianapolis. Now by late 1965, the Avenue was long past its heyday... Wes, Freddie, and many of the other musicians who'd lit it up in the late 1950s were gone, and IUPUI and the interstate were causing all kinds of problems for the neighborhood, along with the other factors that hit the longtime African-American areas... urban blight, diffusion of the community as integration took hold, etc. And the crowd that did still hit the Avenue was, from what I can tell, much more of a hardbop/organ trio audience. So I always wondered what they would've thought of Coltrane late '65 coming to town, when the most recent vinyl most of them could've had would've been A LOVE SUPREME (or JC QUARTET PLAYS, I suppose). David was the first person I talked to who was actually at the gig--he's not sure, but he thinks he went with Charles Tyler. He said they got there a little late, and that people were "fleeing out the doors, all but jumping out the windows, man, like the place was on fire." By the end of the show there were 15, maybe 20 people left in the audience. He said that the club misspelled Trane's name on the poster for the show--"the John Coltain Group"--and that when he mentioned it to JC after the show, JC just smiled & said, "Well, every time you think you're getting somewhere..." David said most of the people who went to the show were still expecting to hear "My Favorite Things," etc. and that the late-'65 sound was quite a shock to them.

[brownie]

First time John Coltrane played in Paris (with Miles Davis in March 1960) I was just starting boot camp in the French Army and there was no no no way to get back to Paris to attend this... and be there when Coltrane was booed by part of the concertgoers

But when Coltrane and the quartet with McCoy, Garrison and Elvin came back here in 1962 after I returned to civilian life, I was in the crowd at the Olympia concert hall. No boos that evening. The crowd was very enthusiastic this time.

Having been a fan of Coltrane since 1957, I knew that the evening would be special. But I was not prepared to the sound and energy level that came out from the musicians. Coltrane brought the music to a plateau I had not envisioned.

Elvin Jones was the musician that made the most impression on me that day with his relentless drive. I thought he was a monster musician.

I could not make it to the July 1965 jazz festival at Antibes-Juan les Pins where Coltrane and the same quartet played a rare live version of 'A Love Supreme' but I was at the Paris Salle Pleyel on the following day for their last appearance in France. The quartet was playing fiery music that day. And the crows was theirs!

I was taking photos at concerts by that time and went backstage to take photos of Coltrane at intermission. He was talking to friends. I had no idea who they were.

A few months later I had made friends with Gato Barbieri and his wife Michelle. Michelle knew I was taking photos by then and asked if I had been to the Salle Pleyel concert. I showed her some of the photos and she screamed with delight when she found out that I had taken a photo of Coltrane talking to her!

I know she kept the prints of these photos I gave her!

A couple of months later, I visited New York for the first time and looked for club or concert appearances by Coltrane but he was on the West Coast. Another missed opportunity

[jlhoots]

In the fall of 1965, Coltrane was booked into the Jazz Workshop in Boston. I and three of my college friends (two jazz fan buddies and a girl I was dating who was primarily into classical music) decided to go on Saturday night. Normally we would go hear live jazz on the Sunday matinee, which was a good deal for poor college students like us, and the crowds were usually pretty hip. For some reason, we decided to make it a bigger deal by going on Saturday night, although I can't remember why. We were young (underage) jazz enthusiasts, but none of us had ever seen Trane in person, although we had heard some of his recordings with Miles and several of the Atlantic and Impulse albums. The most recent recording we had heard was "A Love Supreme", which had been out for about a year, and we expected to see the quartet with which Trane had been working for about four years. I don't believe that "Ascension" had been released yet.

When we got to the entrance, the band was billed as the John Coltrane Sextet. When we entered the club, we saw that there were two sets of drums on the bandstand. We were seated, eagerly anticipating the evening. Eventually the musicians arrived, and a drummer who we did not recognize sat down at one of the drum sets. A second saxophonist was also present, as well as McCoy Tyner and Jimmy Garrison. I don't know if we knew the identities of the two new musicians that night (Pharoah Sanders & Rashied Ali). There were no announcements, although it's possible that their names were posted at the entrance. Our eyes followed Trane as he went to the bar and got a drink, and then proceeded to the stand, walking right past our aisle table.

The music became intense very quickly, and we were all puzzled, completely unprepared for the full blown sonic assault that was taking place on the bandstand. Our first reaction was negative, and my date looked at me as if to say "get me out of here". We persevered, however, and eventually, near the end of the first set, Elvin Jones did arrive and joined the proceedings on stage. I recall that at one point Jimmy Garrison remained on stage alone, and his bass solo was almost completely drowned out by the chatter of people talking.

The following spring, the album "Meditations" was released. I bought it, and realized that it had been recorded one week before we saw the band. I don't believe Trane ever returned to Boston. As much as Coltrane is revered today, the music he offered us in his final days was met with hostility and indifference by many at the time.

I was at that same run at The Jazz Workshop.

I was an intern at the Boston City Hospital at the time.

The "show" I was at had at least one other saxophone player. I think it was Carlos Ward.

It was pretty intense. I loved it at the time. Don't know how it would hit me today.

[Soul Stream]

Thanks for the stories! (amazing!) Would love to hear more!

[medjuck]

I saw the Quartet in Montreal in 1964 or 65. Probably spring of '65 because I was fairly familiar with their work by then. It was very intense. I sat very near the stage but couldn't hear Jimmy Garrison at all except when he soloed, probably becasue I was on Elvin's side of the stage.

[GregK]

Too bad Albertson isn't posting here; didn't he interview him for radio in the 60s?

[ValerieB]

i was fortunate to have heard him live on many occasions in the '60s - mostly in ny but one night in sf as well. he actually was on a double bill with cannonball in sf. my strongest memory of that evening was at one point standing at the back of the room listening to cannonball and coltrane standing next to me. i didn't think i would be able to breathe, my heart was pounding so. i have never felt a stronger "vibe" emanating from anyone in my entire life! i remember his music being very well received that evening and my disbelief at the performances, especially his and elvin's. they were other-worldly to me and i was absolutely incredulous.

[Chuck Nessa]

Saw him a number of nights at the Plugged Nickel in '64/65 with the quartet - not sure if this was 2 different engagements or one long week. I think 2 dates 'cause I remember attending with JR Monterose and without him . I also heard him at the Down Beat festival with Archie Shepp added ('65). Last time I heard him was at the Nickel with the Pharoah, Alice, Jimmy, Ali band. Spoke to him at intermission and he said he was sorry it cost so much to hear the band.

Every gig was sold out set after set. Some folks walked out but their seats were quickly filled by people waiting in the street. The whole deal about the audience and Coltrane was exacerbated by the record marketplace at the time. Prestige and Atlantic were releasing old sessions at the same time Impulse was issuing recent dates. Prestige and Atlantic were old trusted friends to a segment of the record buying public and Impulse was a relative newcomer. As the result of this market penetration a number of people came to the gigs with a false impression of what the show would be like. As I said earlier, many folks were happy to find their abandoned seats.

[Larry Kart]

Most interesting encounter, perhaps, was when Coltrane's first quartet (Steve Kuhn, Steve Davis, Elvin) was at the Sutherland Lounge in Chicago in Aug. 1960. We (my friends and I) knew "Giant Steps," but the "My Favorite Things" album had not yet been recorded, so even though that was the style in which the band and Coltrane were playing, it was all shockingly, thrillingly new to us. Also, one night between sets I saw Trane talking to his old boss Johnny Hodges at the bar -- the raised bandstand at the Sutherland was surrounded by the bar IIRC. In any case, Trane was showing his soprano sax to Hodges, who was examining it with interest -- Hodges of course having played the instrument himself for some time but not for several decades.

Later on, 1962-3 and I think '64, there were quite a few Coltrane Quartet appearances at McKie's Disc Jockey Show Lounge on Cottage Grove Ave. just south of 63rd St. Every one of those was ----ing incredible, beyond anything on disc AFAIK, if only because no recording could capture the dynamic range of Trane and Elvin in live performance, especially if, as was typical at McKie's when you were seated at the bar (which again butted a raised bandstand), your head was about six feet or so from Elvin's bass drum, and Trane stood about four feet away from you. As I once wrote, one night I looked to my right during a set because I heard an odd thudding sound coming from there and saw the late David (Daiv) Rosenthal (son of poet-literary critic M.L. Rosenthal and eventually the author of the book "Hard Bop") beating his head on the bar with a fair amount of force and roughly in time to the music. Daiv was a strange guy, but what he was doing seemed like a reasonable response.

Finally, Coltrane with Pharoah Sanders at the Plugged Nickel in '65 or '66 or both. I have to admit that my main recollection is being put off by Pharoah -- the way he seemed to heat-up instantaneously, as though he were plugged into a socket, while Trane had to "climb the mountain" so to speak (and IIRC Trane was showing signs that the "climb" was literally, physically becoming laborious for him, which was distressing to see and made me that much more inclined to be put off by Pharaoh, because it seemed like his instaneous heat was forcing Trane to match him along those lines). Also, I associate all this with the first time I heard Roscoe Mitchell, at an afternoon session with Elvin Jones during one of these gigs -- a performance that made it fairly clear that there was another way in the wind.

[Chuck Nessa]

Thanks Larry.

[GregK]

Also, I associate all this with the first time I heard Roscoe Mitchell, at an afternoon session with Elvin Jones during one of these gigs -- a performance that made it fairly clear that there was another way in the wind.

Mitchell played with Elvin Jones?

[Larry Kart]

Also, I associate all this with the first time I heard Roscoe Mitchell, at an afternoon session with Elvin Jones during one of these gigs -- a performance that made it fairly clear that there was another way in the wind.

Mitchell played with Elvin Jones?

Yes, at an afternoon jam session at a club on Wells St., north of the Plugged Nickel, between that club and North Avenue. At the the time, Roscoe was known to virtually no one I believe, and IIRC he stepped onto the stand of his own accord in the middle of a tune that already had been going on for a while. I'm sure that what he played had quite a impact on everyone. At the time I thought of it as being kind of Dolphy-esque, with a lot individuality and power and some of that special "objective" quality that is one of Roscoe trademarks -- where you feel that it's explosively hot but he himself is not being carried away, or that his being carried away is not the issue.

BTW, on second thought, the drummer with the Coltrane Quartet that I heard at the Sutherland in Aug. '60 was not Elvin but Pete LaRoca.

[Soul Stream]

Wow, these are all really fascinating stories. Love to hear more, if there are more out there.

[mikeweil]

Indeed - I was too young to have seen him perform and thank you all.

[7/4]

Wow, these are all really fascinating stories. Love to hear more, if there are more out there.

Me too. I wish I was there.

[Bill B]

Wow, these are all really fascinating stories. Love to hear more, if there are more out there.

Me too. I wish I was there.

I saw the group at the JazzWorkshop in Boston in early 1965. My friend and I stayed for two sets.One Tune was played in each set-"Summertime" and "My Favorite Things". Each set lasted about 45 minutes. My friend commented "Man, I'm exhausted just watching those guys" .What a hard working group !! The members were drenched in sweat especially Jimmy Garrison.

[JPF]

In the fall of 1965, Coltrane was booked into the Jazz Workshop in Boston. I and three of my college friends (two jazz fan buddies and a girl I was dating who was primarily into classical music) decided to go on Saturday night. Normally we would go hear live jazz on the Sunday matinee, which was a good deal for poor college students like us, and the crowds were usually pretty hip. For some reason, we decided to make it a bigger deal by going on Saturday night, although I can't remember why. We were young (underage) jazz enthusiasts, but none of us had ever seen Trane in person, although we had heard some of his recordings with Miles and several of the Atlantic and Impulse albums. The most recent recording we had heard was "A Love Supreme", which had been out for about a year, and we expected to see the quartet with which Trane had been working for about four years. I don't believe that "Ascension" had been released yet.

When we got to the entrance, the band was billed as the John Coltrane Sextet. When we entered the club, we saw that there were two sets of drums on the bandstand. We were seated, eagerly anticipating the evening. Eventually the musicians arrived, and a drummer who we did not recognize sat down at one of the drum sets. A second saxophonist was also present, as well as McCoy Tyner and Jimmy Garrison. I don't know if we knew the identities of the two new musicians that night (Pharoah Sanders & Rashied Ali). There were no announcements, although it's possible that their names were posted at the entrance. Our eyes followed Trane as he went to the bar and got a drink, and then proceeded to the stand, walking right past our aisle table.

The music became intense very quickly, and we were all puzzled, completely unprepared for the full blown sonic assault that was taking place on the bandstand. Our first reaction was negative, and my date looked at me as if to say "get me out of here". We persevered, however, and eventually, near the end of the first set, Elvin Jones did arrive and joined the proceedings on stage. I recall that at one point Jimmy Garrison remained on stage alone, and his bass solo was almost completely drowned out by the chatter of people talking.

The following spring, the album "Meditations" was released. I bought it, and realized that it had been recorded one week before we saw the band. I don't believe Trane ever returned to Boston. As much as Coltrane is revered today, the music he offered us in his final days was met with hostility and indifference by many at the time.

Thanks for refreshing my memory, Stereojack. I was at that gig, also, with a group of friends. I had always thought that was later in the 60's, but if, as you say, this was Coltrane's last appearance in Boston, then it was the same gig. I remember being surprised that it was a sextet, and then being really surprised at the music. Because I hadn't been following Coltrane's recent records at that time, I was expecting the quartet's classic sound and this was, to say the least, different. I frankly found it unpleasant, as did everyone I was with. It was painfully loud, maybe the loudest acoustic music I've ever heard, and seemed like six people screaming at each other in a night-long argument. Garrison and Tyner could hardly be heard at all, especially Garrison. Your phrase, "sonic assault," is right on the money.

Fortunately, I had heard Trane's quartet in 1962 (or I should say quintet, since he had Eric Dolphy with him). It was in Germany when I was in the army. It was just excellent - I remember being particularly impressed with Elvin's drumming. I recall Dolphy seeming much "farther out" than Coltrane, and I think I remember there was some scattered booing from the largely German audience. By the way, Coltrane was not the main attraction; he opened for Dizzy Gillespie, who had Leo Wright, Lalo Schifrin, Bob Cunningham on bass and, of all people, Mel Lewis on drums.

And going back even further in time, I should be able to say that I saw Coltrane in Miles' group in 1959, but I can't. Miles was scheduled to play at Music Inn in Lenox, MA, one night in August. We drove out there almost 100 miles for the gig and Miles canceled at the last minute. However, the management threw together a last-minute replacement group consisting of teachers from the Lenox School of Jazz - a sextet featuring Jimmy Giuffre, Herb Pomeroy, Jim Hall and Bill Evans! Not too shabby. It sure would have been nice to see the Miles/Coltrane group, though.

[Steve Gray]

I saw John Coltrane play in London at the Walthamstow Granada.

The date was November 17th 1961.

This, of course, was just a few days after 'Live at the Village Vanguard' was recorded and it was essentially the same group : JC, Eric Dolphy, McCoy Tyner, Reggie Workman and Elvin Jones.

They did the first half of the show before the Dizzy Gillespie group with Lalo Shifrin and Leo Wright performed.

This was the first Modern Jazz group I saw live, before that I had been a fan of British Trad bands. I was 14 years old at the time.

I remember they played 'My Favourite Things' and I suspect they also played 'Impressions' but this was of course before 'Impressions' was issued on LP and there were no announcements.

I enjoyed it all enormously but my memories are a bit hazy now.

The one thing I remember vividly was the large bulge on Eric's forehead when he was soloing.

[AndrewHill]

Up. Really enjoyed these recollections.

[Late]

Really enjoyed these recollections.

Agreed. I just keep thinking "If only (some of) these gigs were recorded ... "

The furthest back I personally can go is seeing Art Blakey in 1985. And then an amazing Betty Carter show in 1988.

Edited April 19, 2008 by Late

[Larry Kart]

Just got a phone call out of the blue from Roscoe, who asked if I could send him copies of some things I wrote about him back then for a talk he was going to give in a few days about that period to a class at Mills College, where he teaches now. I mentioned the story I told earlier in this thread, about hearing him for the first time at that mid-1960s session with Elvin (half-afraid that I might have half-made it up or just distorted it), and Roscoe remembered it as though it had happened yesterday, including the name of the tenor player (Bob Poulian) whom he joined onstage and the fact that he himself left the club right afterwards -- figuring, he explained, that things seemed to have gone pretty well, and he'd better leave it at that.

[AndrewHill]

Just got a phone call out of the blue from Roscoe, who asked if I could send him copies of some things I wrote about him back then for a talk he was going to give in a few days about that period to a class at Mills College, where he teaches now. I mentioned the story I told earlier in this thread, about hearing him for the first time at that mid-1960s session with Elvin (half-afraid that I might have half-made it up or just distorted it), and Roscoe remembered it as though it had happened yesterday, including the name of the tenor player (Bob Poulian) whom he joined onstage and the fact that he himself left the club right afterwards -- figuring, he explained, that things seemed to have gone pretty well, and he'd better leave it at that.

First Chuck watching TV with Roscoe and Lester and now you getting a phone call from Roscoe? Man, I'd freak out if I had that kind of company over or if I got a phone call like that.

I have no stories that come any where near that, but I did get to meet Lester at a "surprise" lecture my prof managed to set up. I was star-struck and dumbfounded when I met him. He looked just the way he did on the album covers and I was just standing there like what do I do now?...I can't believe I'm talking to Lester Bowie!

After reading these accounts of some of you standing next to Trane, talking to him, I can't even imagine how cool that must've been. I am so jealous! :rsmile:

Edited April 20, 2008 by Holy Ghost