chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted March 22, 2007 Report Posted March 22, 2007 got this for 3 big ones few mos back- just played it- there is an unidentified vocalist on it too, anyone know what im talkin about? its missing from the fats disog on jazzdisco.org- whos the singer? Quote
brownie Posted March 22, 2007 Report Posted March 22, 2007 Tadd Dameron with Fats Navarro at Royal Roost is well known. The same two at Birdland is unknown. Which label is that Birdland album? Quote
chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted March 22, 2007 Author Report Posted March 22, 2007 musidisc- allan eager on tenor Quote
brownie Posted March 22, 2007 Report Posted March 22, 2007 musidisc- allan eager on tenor Musidisc No wonder! French pseudo-official bootleg label! Their sleeve information was always full of errors or approximations. I have an Ult-Tadd vinyl of this from our friend Boris Rose with a full Dameron at the Roost discography as backliner. The LP has tracks by Dameron and Anita O'Day. Most probably Anita is who you're looking for. What track(s) does she sing on? Quote
chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted March 22, 2007 Author Report Posted March 22, 2007 i have to check again-- so its the royal roost? i guess all the french men aren't as particular as you! Quote
Big Beat Steve Posted March 22, 2007 Report Posted March 22, 2007 (edited) According to Walter Bruyninckx' discography, all tracks on side 1 of this Musidisc LP (JA5176) were recorded on 29 Aug. 48. The (male!) vocalist is identified as Kenny Hagood. Tadd Walk is from 9 Oct. 48, Our Delight from 16 Oct. 48. Wahoo might be from 30 Oct. 48 (same lineup listed in the discog though this issue is not stated). And all of this comes from broadcasts at the Roost, and part of the LP duplicates the Milestone twofer reissue of Navarro/Dameron live recordings. Edited March 22, 2007 by Big Beat Steve Quote
brownie Posted March 22, 2007 Report Posted March 22, 2007 chewy being chewy and me being French, took it that vocalist was a woman songbird Yes, the singer appearing with the Tadd Dameron group on those Royal Roost gigs was good ole Kenny Hagood, mmilovan's favorite singer! Must be him that chewy was listening to! Quote
chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted March 22, 2007 Author Report Posted March 22, 2007 chewy is doing t his new thing where i get up at 9 and work in the morning so i have the rest of the day open, and until i get more aclimated to that, everything sounds like cecil taylor to me Quote
mmilovan Posted March 23, 2007 Report Posted March 23, 2007 (edited) chewy being chewy and me being French, took it that vocalist was a woman songbird Yes, the singer appearing with the Tadd Dameron group on those Royal Roost gigs was good ole Kenny Hagood, mmilovan's favorite singer! Must be him that chewy was listening to! Yep, he certainly is one of few "unknown heroes" of bebop movement. Although his singing is a bit outdated nowadays, I always thought that if someone (back in those days) really sounded bad, or worth nothing, will he/she ever get the chance to record/play with Dameron group? I doubt so. Edited March 23, 2007 by mmilovan Quote
Big Beat Steve Posted March 23, 2007 Report Posted March 23, 2007 (edited) Yep, he certainly is one of few "unknown heroes" of bebop movement. Although his singing is a bit outdated nowadays, I always thought that if someone (back in those days) really sounded bad, or worth nothing, will he/she ever get the chance to record/play with Dameron group? I doubt so. Kenny Hagood outdated? Maybe ... these were different times so the singing styles have changed too. But at any rate he still comes across COOL and HEP - and certainly not quite as outdated as many of those sentimental, operatic, not really very swinging big band era chorus singers, including many of those with the "name bands" of the late 30s and early 40s. Pure corn in many cases! Edited March 23, 2007 by Big Beat Steve Quote
king ubu Posted March 23, 2007 Report Posted March 23, 2007 brownie: is the discography on that one lp sleeve complete? and would you know what exactly is on the Fantasy CD? I wanted to sort that out for a long time... would be great to get a complete edition of all the Dameron live broadcasts, with Navarro, Allen Eager, Rudy Williams, the larger band with Miles, the Big Ten... Quote
brownie Posted March 23, 2007 Report Posted March 23, 2007 Ubu, the discography on that Ult-Tadd vinyl loos pretty complete. Since it was issued in pre-CD days, it includes the other vinyl releases only. Could xerox it and mail it to you... I remember some of the Lester Young broadcasts released on that other Boris Rose label Ambrosia also had listings of the Prez recorded gigs. I have two other of those Boris Rose releases of Dameron material, one on the Sneaker label, the other on the TalCript label. Both had the regular BR liner notes: blank backpages Quote
mmilovan Posted March 23, 2007 Report Posted March 23, 2007 But at any rate he still comes across COOL and HEP - and certainly not quite as outdated as many of those sentimental, operatic, not really very swinging big band era chorus singers, including many of those with the "name bands" of the late 30s and early 40s. Pure corn in many cases! Fully agree! Pardon me, if I wasn't quite clear in my post, but your statement is right what I think about Kenny. Quote
mmilovan Posted March 23, 2007 Report Posted March 23, 2007 Ubu, the discography on that Ult-Tadd vinyl loos pretty complete. Since it was issued in pre-CD days, it includes the other vinyl releases only. Could xerox it and mail it to you... I remember some of the Lester Young broadcasts released on that other Boris Rose label Ambrosia also had listings of the Prez recorded gigs. I have two other of those Boris Rose releases of Dameron material, one on the Sneaker label, the other on the TalCript label. Both had the regular BR liner notes: blank backpages We can only hope that extensive search through Boris Rose archives, now owned by University, and in good hands and full enthusiasm of Doug Pomeroy will show more recorded material... Quote
king ubu Posted March 23, 2007 Report Posted March 23, 2007 Ubu, the discography on that Ult-Tadd vinyl loos pretty complete. Since it was issued in pre-CD days, it includes the other vinyl releases only. Could xerox it and mail it to you... I remember some of the Lester Young broadcasts released on that other Boris Rose label Ambrosia also had listings of the Prez recorded gigs. I have two other of those Boris Rose releases of Dameron material, one on the Sneaker label, the other on the TalCript label. Both had the regular BR liner notes: blank backpages Thank you but that won't be necessary, I think I have the Ult-Tadd LP as well - just wondered about the completeness. Here's my info for the Ult-Tadd (though it's old and I haven't checked it): Tadd Dameron - Ultimate Royal Roost Nights, Vol.3 ULT-TADD TDFNXX1500 side one 1. Wa-Hoo 1 2. The Squirrel 1 3. Wa-Hoo 2 4. Lady Bird 5. Good Bait 1 6. S’Wonderful/They Can’t Take That Away From Me 7. Stella By Starlight 8. Sweet Georgia Brown side two 1. Dizzy Atmosphere 2. Good Bait 2 3. Webb’s Delight 4. Focus 5. Wa-Hoo 3 6. Good Bait 3 7. The Squirrel 2 Recording Information: Broadcast from „Royal Roost“, N.Y.: A1/2: October 30, 1948: A3: November 6, 1948: A4/5,B1: November 13, 1948: Kai Winding (tb), Allen Eager (ts), Tadd Dameron (p), Curly Russell (b), Kenny Clarke (d). A6-8: 1848/49: probably: Anita O’Day (voc), Tadd Dameron (p), Curly Russell (b), Kenny Clarke (d). B2-5: February 12, 1949: Leonard Hawkins (t), Ted Kelly (tb), Sahib Shihab (as), Benjamin Lundy (ts), Cecil Payne (bs), Tadd Dameron (p), John Collins (g), Curly Russell (b), Kenny Clarke (d), Carlos Vidal (cga). B6/7: March 5, 1949: Tadd Dameron Big Ten: Miles Davis (t), Kai Winding (tb), Sahib Shihab (as), Benjamin Lundy (ts), Cecil Payne (bs), Tadd Dameron (p), John Collins (g), Curly Russell (b), Kenny Clarke (d), Carlos Vidal (cga). And here's the info from the other Rose LP I have: Fats Navarro Tadd Dameron - Modern Giants of Jazz Ozone 5 side one 1. The Squirrel 2. Good Bait 3. Pennies From Heaven 4. Anthropology 5. The Kitchenette Across The Hall 6. Lady Be Good side two 1. Tadd Walk 2. Our Delight 3. Wa-Hoo Recording Information: Broadcast from „Royal Roost“, N.Y.: A: August 29, 1948: Fats Navarro (t), Allen Eager (ts), Tadd Dameron (p), Curly Russell (b), Kenny Clarke (d), Kenny Hagood (voc A3/5). B1: October 9, 1948: B2: October 16, 1948: Fats Navarro (t), Rudy Williams (as), Allen Eager (ts), Tadd Dameron (p), Curly Russell (b), Kenny Clarke (d). B3: November 6, 1948: Kai Winding (tb), Allen Eager (ts), Tadd Dameron (p), Curly Russell (b), Kenny Clarke (d). Quote
brownie Posted March 23, 2007 Report Posted March 23, 2007 Not as simple as that Just a reminder that these are Boris Rose products. The copy I have of Volume 3 has the labels reversed. Even the indications on the wax are wrong. In any case, here are the tracks listings: side A: Dizzy Atmosphere Good Bait Webb's Delight Focus Wa Hoo Good Bait 2 The Squirrel side B: Waa Hoo 2 Waa Hoo3 Lady Bird Good Bait 3 S'Wonderful Stella By Starlight Sweet Georgia Brown Personnel listings and dates are correct (except it does not list the Anita O'Day with the Tadd Dameron trio tunes, just the Anita O'Day tracks with the Dameron group. As for the Ozone 5, the discography lists Anthropology/ Kitchenette Across the Hall/ Lady be Good/The Squirrel/Good Bait/Pennies from Heaven are from the August 29, 1948 broadcast, Tadd Walk is from the October 9, 1948 broadcast, Our Delight is from October 16 Waa Hoo is from November 6 Quote
king ubu Posted March 24, 2007 Report Posted March 24, 2007 So for Ozone 5 your info is the same as mine... will need to sort things out some day. I also have copies of the two Jazz View discs (thanks mmilovan!) and of course the Fantasy... and checking with Bruninckx (I photocopied that quite some time ago, not sure I still find these copies... will have to look some day) I think I miss a few songs from these broadcasts. Quote
Big Beat Steve Posted March 24, 2007 Report Posted March 24, 2007 At any rate it looks like the Musidisc JA 5176 LP that Chewy inquired about (and that I also happen to have) exactly duplicates the contents of Ozone 5. Quote
king ubu Posted March 24, 2007 Report Posted March 24, 2007 Yeah, and 1949 for 1948 and Birdland for Royal Roost is pretty exact in the Rosey world... Quote
mmilovan Posted March 25, 2007 Report Posted March 25, 2007 So for Ozone 5 your info is the same as mine... will need to sort things out some day. I also have copies of the two Jazz View discs (thanks mmilovan!) and of course the Fantasy... and checking with Bruninckx (I photocopied that quite some time ago, not sure I still find these copies... will have to look some day) I think I miss a few songs from these broadcasts. Thanks Flurin, I think that Jazzview label "lifted" material from Boris Rose LPs... Quote
erhodes Posted March 25, 2007 Report Posted March 25, 2007 In August 1996 a similar thread came up on rec.music.bluenote. I made an inquiry and Jack Woker wrote me back off list with the following discography and cross references. I have apparently deleted the email so this listing was OCR'd from my surviving hard copy. I proofed it against the original email, which means that any mistakes are mine, not Jack's. He gave me permission to reproduce this almost 11 years ago so I expect he would not mind doing it here. From Brownie's post it would appear that Ozone 5 is duplicated on the other disks, though a quick glance suggests you would need Jazzland 50 and 68, Sneaker 829, Beppo 505 and 506, Talcrip 10230, and Ult-Tadd 1500 to collect all of the tracks. Anyway, I hope this is useful or, at least, interesting. By the way, Chewy, these are all lp's. The rest of the text is from Jack's email... These are the records referenced: (A,D,E,F,H,I are Rose releases) A - ALTO 702, "Count Basie - Anita O'Day" B - JAZZLAND 50 (these comprise the Milestone two-fer/CD) C - JAZZLAND 68 D - JUNG CAT 948, "Great Jazz Concerts at Royal Roost" E - OZONE 5 (Don't have this one, believe it's all duplicated elsewhere) F - SNEAKER 829, "Tadd Dameron - Fats Navarro" G - SPOTLITE 108, "Anthropology" H - TALCRIP 10230, "Fats' Gang" I - ULT-TADD 1500, "Tadd Dameron Vol. 3" J - BEPPO 505, "Fats & Tadd at the Roost 1948, Vol. 1" K - BEPPO 506, "Fats & Tadd at the Roost 1948, Vol. 2" L - JAZZ LIVE 8032, "Tadd Dameron/Dodo Marmarosa "Keybop" 8/29/48 - Navarro, Eager, Dameron, Russell, Clarke, Hagood Anthropology B E F J Kitchenette Across the Hall E F J Lady Be Good B E F J The Squirrel E F J Good Bait B E F J Pennies From Heaven E F ca. 8 or 9/48 - Eager, Gray, Dameron, Russell, Clarke Now's the Time G Lady Be Good G Just You, Just Me (Spotlite) G 9/4/48 - Navarro, Eager, Jackson, Dameron, Russell, Clarke The Tadd Walk F J Symphonette C F J The Squirrel F J 10/2/48 - Navarro, Williams, Eager, Dameron, Russell, Clarke, O'Day Good Bait H J What Is This Thing Called Love A H How High the Moon H The Squirrel B H J 10/9/48 - same as previous The Tadd Walk B E H K September in the Rain A H How High the Moon, H Dameronia B K (not on H, although listed on cover) 10/16/48 - Navarro, Williams, Eager, Dameron, Russell, Clarke Anthropology F K Our Delight B E F K The Tadd Walk F K 10/23/48 - same as previous Our Delight H K Good Bait C H K Eb-Pob C H K The Squirrel H K 10/30/48 - Winding, Eager, Dameron, Russell, Clarke The Chase H Wahoo H I L Lady Be Good H The Squirrel I 11/6/48 - same as previous Anthropology C Wahoo C E I Tiny's Blues C 11/13/48 - same as previous Lady Bird I Good Bait I Dizzy Atmosphere I 2/12/49 - exact personnel unknown, similar to next session. Good Bait I Webb's Delight I Focus I Wahoo I 2/19/49 - Davis, Winding, Shihab, Lundy, Payne, Dameron, Collins, Russell, Clarke, Vidal Focus D L April in Paris D Good Bait D L Webb's Delight D L 2/26/49 - same as previous Milano D Casbah D L 3/5/49 - same as previous Good Bait I The Squirrel I Quote
king ubu Posted March 25, 2007 Report Posted March 25, 2007 Thanks a lot for posting that, Ed! Very helpful! Quote
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